50g

What sort of things would the serial port be used for?

--- In 50g@yahoogroups.com, "x2dydx" <x2dydx@...> wrote:
>
> What sort of things would the serial port be used for?
>
Mainly hooking up to survey instruments for surveyors, any anything
else u can think of :D
Mick

I use an hp48sx (serial) communication for working with remote terminal units such as data acquisition devices using the modbus protocol, and others.  I use it

--- In 50g@yahoogroups.com, "x2dydx" <x2dydx@...> wrote:
>
> What sort of things would the serial port be used for?
>

I have used mine for communicating with and controlling a telescope.  
Really you could use it for lots of things that require a serial 
connection.  My next project is to play around with using it with a 
GPS unit.

-Al

--- In 50g@yahoogroups.com, "al.arduengo" <al.arduengo@...> wrote:
>
> --- In 50g@yahoogroups.com, "x2dydx" <x2dydx@> wrote:
> >
> > What sort of things would the serial port be used for?
> >
> 
> I have used mine for communicating with and controlling a telescope.  
> Really you could use it for lots of things that require a serial 
> connection.  My next project is to play around with using it with a 
> GPS unit.
> 
> -Al
>
I read somewhere that the serial cable is not available from HP. How 
did you overcome this problem?  Did the serial cable come with your 
telescope?  Or is the serial cable available from some other source or 
did you build one?  Any guidance you can offer is appreciated.  Thanks.

--- In 50g@yahoogroups.com, "x2dydx" <x2dydx@...> wrote:
>
> --- In 50g@yahoogroups.com, "al.arduengo" <al.arduengo@> wrote:
> >
> > --- In 50g@yahoogroups.com, "x2dydx" <x2dydx@> wrote:
> > >
> > > What sort of things would the serial port be used for?
> > >
> > 
> > I have used mine for communicating with and controlling a 
telescope.  
> > Really you could use it for lots of things that require a serial 
> > connection.  My next project is to play around with using it 
with a 
> > GPS unit.
> > 
> > -Al
> >
> I read somewhere that the serial cable is not available from HP. 
How 
> did you overcome this problem?  Did the serial cable come with 
your 
> telescope?  Or is the serial cable available from some other 
source or 
> did you build one?  Any guidance you can offer is appreciated.  
Thanks.
>

I used a Mini 4-B USB connector.  Search comp.sys.hp48 and you'll 
find more details.

--- In 50g@yahoogroups.com, "x2dydx" <x2dydx@...> wrote:
>
> --- In 50g@yahoogroups.com, "al.arduengo" <al.arduengo@> wrote:
> >
> > --- In 50g@yahoogroups.com, "x2dydx" <x2dydx@> wrote:
> > >
> > > What sort of things would the serial port be used for?
> > >
> > 
> > I have used mine for communicating with and controlling a telescope.  
> > Really you could use it for lots of things that require a serial 
> > connection.  My next project is to play around with using it with a 
> > GPS unit.
> > 
> > -Al
> >
> I read somewhere that the serial cable is not available from HP. How 
> did you overcome this problem?  Did the serial cable come with your 
> telescope?  Or is the serial cable available from some other source or 
> did you build one?  Any guidance you can offer is appreciated.  Thanks.
>

I should have been more clear.  Sorry.  I used a 48GX serial port for
my telescope.  I modified a standard 9 pin cable to work with my
calculator cable.  However, as soon as I get a cable for the 50g, I do
not foresee any problems.

I for one am happy that they included this  capability on the new machine!

-Al

--- In 50g@yahoogroups.com, "al.arduengo" <al.arduengo@...> wrote:
>
> --- In 50g@yahoogroups.com, "x2dydx" <x2dydx@> wrote:
> >
> > --- In 50g@yahoogroups.com, "al.arduengo" <al.arduengo@> wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In 50g@yahoogroups.com, "x2dydx" <x2dydx@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > What sort of things would the serial port be used for?
> > > >
> > > 
> > > I have used mine for communicating with and controlling a 
telescope.  
> > > Really you could use it for lots of things that require a 
serial 
> > > connection.  My next project is to play around with using it 
with a 
> > > GPS unit.
> > > 
> > > -Al
> > >
> > I read somewhere that the serial cable is not available from HP. 
How 
> > did you overcome this problem?  Did the serial cable come with 
your 
> > telescope?  Or is the serial cable available from some other 
source or 
> > did you build one?  Any guidance you can offer is appreciated.  
Thanks.
> >
> 
> I should have been more clear.  Sorry.  I used a 48GX serial port 
for
> my telescope.  I modified a standard 9 pin cable to work with my
> calculator cable.  However, as soon as I get a cable for the 50g, 
I do
> not foresee any problems.
> 
> I for one am happy that they included this  capability on the new 
machine!
> 
> -Al
>

Just to be clear re: serial port of 50g.  It is not a true RS232-
standard device.  It's a 3.3V TTL signal (noninverted).  There 
should be a third-party cable soon if you don't want to make one 
yourself.

--Scott

> Just to be clear re: serial port of 50g.  It is not a true RS232-
> standard device.  It's a 3.3V TTL signal (noninverted).  There 
> should be a third-party cable soon if you don't want to make one 
> yourself.
> 
> --Scott
>

Hi Scott, I don't mean to beat this subject to death but I assumed that 
the serial output from the calculator would be RS232.  I really 
appreciate you giving the heads up that it is not standard RS232 
but "3.3V TTL signal (noninverted)," however I don't know the 
ramifications of that difference.  So I guess the question is, are the 
two signals compatable and the interface as simple as building a cable, 
or is there some signal incompatabilities that require additional 
electronic signal processing (for example an inverter) in order to 
interface the calculator to a standard RS232 connection?

--- In 50g@yahoogroups.com, "x2dydx" <x2dydx@...> wrote:
>
> > Just to be clear re: serial port of 50g.  It is not a true RS232-
> > standard device.  It's a 3.3V TTL signal (noninverted).  There 
> > should be a third-party cable soon if you don't want to make one 
> > yourself.
> > 
> > --Scott
> >
> 
> Hi Scott, I don't mean to beat this subject to death but I assumed 
that 
> the serial output from the calculator would be RS232.  I really 
> appreciate you giving the heads up that it is not standard RS232 
> but "3.3V TTL signal (noninverted)," however I don't know the 
> ramifications of that difference.  So I guess the question is, are 
the 
> two signals compatable and the interface as simple as building a 
cable, 
> or is there some signal incompatabilities that require additional 
> electronic signal processing (for example an inverter) in order to 
> interface the calculator to a standard RS232 connection?
>

Hi,

With the 50g, a mark (1) is +3.3V and a space (0) is 0V.  For 
standard RS232 (going from memory and recalling some specs for the 
48GX), a mark is -(3 to 25)V and a space is +(3 to 25)V, with +/- 
10V being pretty typical for a typical RS232 charge-pump circuit 
(MAX232 chip, etc.) being driven by +5V.  What does this mean?  
First, it means that the signal has to be inverted and scaled to at 
least +/- 5V (space/mark, respectively--notice the inversion).  I do 
not know what the "fault" tolerance is on the 50g's serial port 
(i.e., can it handle +/- 25V?).

For some of the older calculators with serial ports, according to 
comp.sys.hp48, there was an interface cable that "stole" some of its 
power from the hardware handshaking lines in order to power the 
conversion circuitry (MAX232, etc.).  WITH THE 50G, ONE OF THE PINS 
TAPS DIRECTLY TO THE BATTERY TO PROVIDE +6V TO POWER THE CONVERTER, 
if desired.  I believe that if the converter is left on the 
calculator and draws power it may drain the batteries.  I have not 
verified if this battery voltage is "switched" when the unit is on--
I wouldn't count on that.

From a programming point of view, since the 50g has a USB port also, 
if you want to send data through the serial (not RS232 as indicated) 
port, you will need to set system flag -78.  In order to use Conn4x, 
be sure to clear flag -78.  Also, be sure to set the "wire" transfer 
option.

HTH,
Scott

--- In 50g@yahoogroups.com, "Scott" <blueelectron@...> wrote:
>
> --- In 50g@yahoogroups.com, "x2dydx" <x2dydx@> wrote:
> >
> Hi,
> 
> With the 50g, a mark (1) is +3.3V and a space (0) is 0V.  For 
> standard RS232 (going from memory and recalling some specs for the 
> 48GX), a mark is -(3 to 25)V and a space is +(3 to 25)V, with +/- 
> 10V being pretty typical for a typical RS232 charge-pump circuit 
> (MAX232 chip, etc.) being driven by +5V.  What does this mean?  
> First, it means that the signal has to be inverted and scaled to 
at 
> least +/- 5V (space/mark, respectively--notice the inversion).  I 
do 
> not know what the "fault" tolerance is on the 50g's serial port 
> (i.e., can it handle +/- 25V?).
> 
> For some of the older calculators with serial ports, according to 
> comp.sys.hp48, there was an interface cable that "stole" some of 
its 
> power from the hardware handshaking lines in order to power the 
> conversion circuitry (MAX232, etc.).  WITH THE 50G, ONE OF THE 
PINS 
> TAPS DIRECTLY TO THE BATTERY TO PROVIDE +6V TO POWER THE 
CONVERTER, 
> if desired.  I believe that if the converter is left on the 
> calculator and draws power it may drain the batteries.  I have not 
> verified if this battery voltage is "switched" when the unit is on-
-
> I wouldn't count on that.
> 
> From a programming point of view, since the 50g has a USB port 
also, 
> if you want to send data through the serial (not RS232 as 
indicated) 
> port, you will need to set system flag -78.  In order to use 
Conn4x, 
> be sure to clear flag -78.  Also, be sure to set the "wire" 
transfer 
> option.
> 
> HTH,
> Scott
>

The cable I built years ago for the 48 series did not have any 
conversion circuitry.  If I recall correctly there were three lines -
 tx, rx and gnd.  I will look at my 50g on a scope today and try to 
get firm info.

-Al

--- In 50g@yahoogroups.com, "al.arduengo" <al.arduengo@...> wrote:
>
> --- In 50g@yahoogroups.com, "Scott" <blueelectron@> wrote:
> >
> > --- In 50g@yahoogroups.com, "x2dydx" <x2dydx@> wrote:
> > >
> > Hi,
> > 
> > With the 50g, a mark (1) is +3.3V and a space (0) is 0V.  For 
> > standard RS232 (going from memory and recalling some specs for 
the 
> > 48GX), a mark is -(3 to 25)V and a space is +(3 to 25)V, with +/-
 
> > 10V being pretty typical for a typical RS232 charge-pump circuit 
> > (MAX232 chip, etc.) being driven by +5V.  What does this mean?  
> > First, it means that the signal has to be inverted and scaled to 
> at 
> > least +/- 5V (space/mark, respectively--notice the inversion).  
I 
> do 
> > not know what the "fault" tolerance is on the 50g's serial port 
> > (i.e., can it handle +/- 25V?).
> > 
> > For some of the older calculators with serial ports, according 
to 
> > comp.sys.hp48, there was an interface cable that "stole" some of 
> its 
> > power from the hardware handshaking lines in order to power the 
> > conversion circuitry (MAX232, etc.).  WITH THE 50G, ONE OF THE 
> PINS 
> > TAPS DIRECTLY TO THE BATTERY TO PROVIDE +6V TO POWER THE 
> CONVERTER, 
> > if desired.  I believe that if the converter is left on the 
> > calculator and draws power it may drain the batteries.  I have 
not 
> > verified if this battery voltage is "switched" when the unit is 
on-
> -
> > I wouldn't count on that.
> > 
> > From a programming point of view, since the 50g has a USB port 
> also, 
> > if you want to send data through the serial (not RS232 as 
> indicated) 
> > port, you will need to set system flag -78.  In order to use 
> Conn4x, 
> > be sure to clear flag -78.  Also, be sure to set the "wire" 
> transfer 
> > option.
> > 
> > HTH,
> > Scott
> >
> 
> The cable I built years ago for the 48 series did not have any 
> conversion circuitry.  If I recall correctly there were three 
lines -
>  tx, rx and gnd.  I will look at my 50g on a scope today and try 
to 
> get firm info.
> 
> -Al
>

The 48GX has a true-ish RS232 port, wich inversion/level conversion 
built-in.

--Scott

Isn't it the same as for the 49g (not +)? If it is,
then the HP part # is F1633-66050

I believe that includes the cable, DB9 adaptor, & hp48
adaptor.

--- Art Kennedy <artkennedy@...> wrote:

> Does anybody have any news about the serial port
> (non-USB) on the 50g?
> 
> Is there a cable yet?  Any way to hook it to a
> oldstyle PC Serial Port?
> 
> 



 
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I was just at groups.google.com and in the
comp.sys.hp48 newsgroup I did a searched for.. 50g
serial .. and saw (but didn't read) some discussion
about that. Give that a try

--- Art Kennedy <artkennedy@...> wrote:

> Thanks Don,
> 
>     No, the connector on the HP50 is very different
> and I have the distinct impression that I saw
> information on the serial port that indicated that
> it was not really RS232 compatible.  I mean even
> less so that previous models.  The crazy thing is
> that 2 months later I can now find no trace of such
> information on the web or on my machine ( I usually
> save things ) !?
> 
> Oh well, guess I'll call 800-888-0262.
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
>   From: Don Hart 
>   To: 50g@yahoogroups.com 
>   Sent: Tuesday, February 13, 2007 8:12 PM
>   Subject: Re: [50g] Serial Port
> 
> 
>   Isn't it the same as for the 49g (not +)? If it
> is,
>   then the HP part # is F1633-66050
> 
>   I believe that includes the cable, DB9 adaptor, &
> hp48
>   adaptor.
> 
>   --- Art Kennedy <artkennedy@...> wrote:
> 
>   > Does anybody have any news about the serial port
>   > (non-USB) on the 50g?
>   > 
>   > Is there a cable yet? Any way to hook it to a
>   > oldstyle PC Serial Port?
>   > 
>   > 
> 
>  
>
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>   Yahoo! Music Unlimited
>   Access over 1 million songs.
>   http://music.yahoo.com/unlimited
> 
> 
>    



 
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Hi there.
You may want to consider the following threads on comp.sys.hp48:

http://groups.google.com/group/comp.sys.hp48/browse_frm/thread/96d71a9de
d6348ec/347f113ccb896a9c?lnk=gst&q=50G+serial+cable&rnum=3#

http://groups.google.com/group/comp.sys.hp48/browse_frm/thread/ecfb14a98
192024f/b48bfd8d2299bfc2?
lnk=gst&q=50G+serial+cable&rnum=5#b48bfd8d2299bfc2

Hope this helps.
Best regards.
Giancarlo