Dave Smith Instruments SYNTHESIZERS

Hi All

Evolver seems to be the kind of thing I'm after.
Does anyone in the UK own one who would kindly give me a demo.

Also what other new analog gear is on the market

Thanks

John

John, I'm not in the UK, but are you asking for an "in-person demo", 
or are you asking for some .mp3 or .wav files?  You can find a ton of 
files between Dave Smith's official site, the messages and "files" 
section of this Yahoo group, and the EX5Tech Evolver forum.  I posted 
I think over 200 mb of high quality .wav format "demo loops" at 
AMPFEA.  Go to the following link and check out the entries that 
start with "DSI Evolver":

http://ampfea.org/sln/browse.php?num=3&a_id=173


Regarding other new (real) analog gear, have you checked out the 
Minimoog Voyager:
http://www.moogmusic.com/

Analogue Solutions also has some nice stuff:
http://www.analoguesolutions.com

So does Wiard Synthesizer:
http://www.wiard.com


Ski
www.ex5tech.com
EX5Tech Evolver forum:
http://www.ex5tech.com/ex5ubb_cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=forum&f=23


--- In DSI_Evolver@yahoogroups.com, John <liquid.poet@n...> wrote:

> Hi All
> 
> Evolver seems to be the kind of thing I'm after.
> Does anyone in the UK own one who would kindly give me a demo.
> 
> Also what other new analog gear is on the market
> 
> Thanks
> 
> John

Hi Ski



>John, I'm not in the UK, but are you asking for an "in-person demo",

Yes in person demo.
I have quite a few VA synths micro Q, SuperNova, Korg MS2000 etc
and I'm looking for something really deep, hairy and analog with midi.
I don't really want get another Virtual Analog synth.

I have listened to some mp3s and that has got me interested
in the "DSI Evolver".

I'm quite desperate to get something I can use on our album.

Thanks for the other links, I will be chasing them up.

John

on 18/04/03 13:07, John at liquid.poet@... wrote:

> I have quite a few VA synths micro Q, SuperNova, Korg MS2000 etc
> and I'm looking for something really deep, hairy and analog with midi.
> I don't really want get another Virtual Analog synth.

Hi John,

Have you tried Studio Electronics ATC-1?  I think it takes care of "really
deep & hairy" part very well :-)


-Yutaka

The Studio Electronics ATC-1 is quite cool.  I especially like the 
replaceable cartridge based filter system.

However, the Evolver has twice the LFO's, four additional modulation 
source/destination combos, a MUCH deeper "modulation matrix", the 16 
step 4 track sequencer, the two digital oscillators in addition to 
the two analogs, etc.

I'm certainly not bashing the ATC-1, and I really like Studio 
Electronics as a company.  However, I think the Evolver is clearly a 
much more capable machine, and it's literally half the price.


Ski
www.ex5tech.com
EX5Tech Evolver forum:
http://www.ex5tech.com/ex5ubb_cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=forum&f=23


--- In DSI_Evolver@yahoogroups.com, Yutaka Nakamura 
<liquidbrain@n...> wrote:
> on 18/04/03 13:07, John at liquid.poet@n... wrote:
> 
> > I have quite a few VA synths micro Q, SuperNova, Korg MS2000 etc
> > and I'm looking for something really deep, hairy and analog with 
midi.
> > I don't really want get another Virtual Analog synth.
> 
> Hi John,
> 
> Have you tried Studio Electronics ATC-1?  I think it takes care 
of "really

> deep & hairy" part very well :-)
> 
> 
> -Yutaka

on 18/04/03 19:00, ski_ex5tech at ex5tech@... wrote:

> The Studio Electronics ATC-1 is quite cool.  I especially like the
> replaceable cartridge based filter system.
> 
> However, the Evolver has twice the LFO's, four additional modulation
> source/destination combos, a MUCH deeper "modulation matrix", the 16
> step 4 track sequencer, the two digital oscillators in addition to
> the two analogs, etc.
> 
> I'm certainly not bashing the ATC-1, and I really like Studio
> Electronics as a company.  However, I think the Evolver is clearly a
> much more capable machine, and it's literally half the price.

Hi Ski,

I certainly agree with you on all the points you've made - in fact, I bought
Evolver because of mod matrix & step sequencer which makes this thing
comparable to a modular synth setup (probably one of the best deal ever on
synth market).  Programming fun never ends on this machine, that's for sure
:-)

However, sound wise, I think ATC has much deeper, or bigger sound, compared
to Evolver's DCO.  I am not saying that Evolver sounds bad - I actually like
it very much, very sweet sounding, but it is not a "fat" sounding synth.
Well, they are very different synth that fits in the mix very differently,
and I don't think it hurts for him to try it out.

Well, I think it is great to have both :-)


-Yutaka

Yes, "more" is usually "better" when it comes to synths!  Buying both 
is a great solution!  ;)

Regarding the comments about the "fatness" of the Evolver...  I 
understand why you make those statements.  However, I partially 
disagree.  I heard many similar comments about the ARP Odyssey (of 
which I own two).  I think reality is that it would be more fair to 
say that AT BASIC/"DEFAULT"/"NORMAL" kinds of SETTINGS, the Evolver 
sounds "less fat" than some other synths.  However, when you're even 
moderately good at programming your own sounds, I think that the 
Evolver (and the Odyssey) can be as fat as the fattest, because of 
the depth of their synth architecture (oscillator options, modulation 
capabilities, etc.).  I'm not positive as to exactly why synths like 
the Evolver and Odyssey sound less fat with basic settings, but I 
suspect it may have to do with their more stable oscillators and 
filters.  Most of what goes into making a synth sound like what 
people call "fat" is the *movement* and subtle variations of the 
sound over time, i.e. subtle modulation.

I have a monster old Yamaha CS-30L that is simply a "fat synth bass" 
FACTORY.  It's SO quick and easy to make fat synth bass sounds on 
this machine.  My Odysseys and Evolver CAN do much the same thing, 
but it takes a little more work.


Ski
www.ex5tech.com
EX5Tech Evolver forum:
http://www.ex5tech.com/ex5ubb_cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=forum&f=23


--- In DSI_Evolver@yahoogroups.com, Yutaka Nakamura 
<liquidbrain@n...> wrote:
> on 18/04/03 19:00, ski_ex5tech at ex5tech@e... wrote:
> 
> > The Studio Electronics ATC-1 is quite cool.  I especially like the
> > replaceable cartridge based filter system.
> > 
> > However, the Evolver has twice the LFO's, four additional 
modulation
> > source/destination combos, a MUCH deeper "modulation matrix", the 
16
> > step 4 track sequencer, the two digital oscillators in addition to
> > the two analogs, etc.
> > 
> > I'm certainly not bashing the ATC-1, and I really like Studio
> > Electronics as a company.  However, I think the Evolver is 
clearly a
> > much more capable machine, and it's literally half the price.
> 
> Hi Ski,
> 
> I certainly agree with you on all the points you've made - in fact, 
I bought
> Evolver because of mod matrix & step sequencer which makes this 
thing
> comparable to a modular synth setup (probably one of the best deal 
ever on
> synth market).  Programming fun never ends on this machine, that's 
for sure
> :-)
> 
> However, sound wise, I think ATC has much deeper, or bigger sound, 
compared
> to Evolver's DCO.  I am not saying that Evolver sounds bad - I 
actually like
> it very much, very sweet sounding, but it is not a "fat" sounding 
synth.
> Well, they are very different synth that fits in the mix very 
differently,

> and I don't think it hurts for him to try it out.
> 
> Well, I think it is great to have both :-)
> 
> 
> -Yutaka

>Yes, "more" is usually "better" when it comes to synths!  Buying both
>is a great solution!  ;)

Well if I had enough money........

>Regarding the comments about the "fatness" of the Evolver...  I
>understand why you make those statements.  However, I partially
>disagree.  I heard many similar comments about the ARP Odyssey (of
>which I own two).  I think reality is that it would be more fair to
>say that AT BASIC/"DEFAULT"/"NORMAL" kinds of SETTINGS, the Evolver
>sounds "less fat" than some other synths.  However, when you're even
>moderately good at programming your own sounds, I think that the
>Evolver (and the Odyssey)

Yes Odyssey is good. I like that sound. I think i'd be happy with something
along those lines.
What I don't want is anything digital sounding, for I have plenty of that
already.
The price for the Evolver is great, but I'm not sure if it will be too
ermmmm digital, although I know it has an analog oscillater. Which is why I
really need to hear it first hand.
I have listened to some mp3s btw, I'll try some more tomorrow.
The ATC-1, may be too expensive for me, if it is twice the price of the
Evolver.

     Many thanks for your advice/ links already. I'm open to any more
advice.
    But of course hands on experience can't be beaten.

   John

Well, the Evolver CAN sound digital, because it has two digital 
oscillators!  That doesn't mean that you have to use the digital 
oscillators, though.  Besides, even the digital oscillators go 
through the (real) analog filters and the analog VCAs.  So it's not 
that "sterile" digital sound you get from the typical sample playback 
synth.

Remember that the Evolver has TWO analog oscillators.

The modulation functions/capabilities are simply unmatched by 
anything in it's class, or for up to four or five times the cost.  
You pretty much have to use a seriously good modular analog synth to 
do better.

You really should go to Dave Smith's site and download the owners 
manual.  That will tell you a lot more details regarding what the 
Evolver is capable of.

And remember that when listening to demo mp3's, or the .WAV "demo 
loops" I made, that the Evolver has both analog AND digital 
oscillators.  Some demos use only the analog oscillators, some only 
use the digital, but many use both.


Ski
www.ex5tech.com
EX5Tech Evolver forum:
http://www.ex5tech.com/ex5ubb_cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=forum&f=23


--- In DSI_Evolver@yahoogroups.com, John <liquid.poet@n...> wrote:
> 
> >Yes, "more" is usually "better" when it comes to synths!  Buying 
both
> >is a great solution!  ;)
> 
> Well if I had enough money........
> 
> >Regarding the comments about the "fatness" of the Evolver...  I
> >understand why you make those statements.  However, I partially
> >disagree.  I heard many similar comments about the ARP Odyssey (of
> >which I own two).  I think reality is that it would be more fair to
> >say that AT BASIC/"DEFAULT"/"NORMAL" kinds of SETTINGS, the Evolver
> >sounds "less fat" than some other synths.  However, when you're 
even
> >moderately good at programming your own sounds, I think that the
> >Evolver (and the Odyssey)
> 
> Yes Odyssey is good. I like that sound. I think i'd be happy with 
something
> along those lines.
> What I don't want is anything digital sounding, for I have plenty 
of that
> already.
> The price for the Evolver is great, but I'm not sure if it will be 
too
> ermmmm digital, although I know it has an analog oscillater. Which 
is why I
> really need to hear it first hand.
> I have listened to some mp3s btw, I'll try some more tomorrow.
> The ATC-1, may be too expensive for me, if it is twice the price of 
the
> Evolver.
> 
>      Many thanks for your advice/ links already. I'm open to any 
more

> advice.
>     But of course hands on experience can't be beaten.
> 
>    John

Hey John,

I'm in Cambridge - you can come and check mine.  Mail me back if you're 
interested and I'll mail you my number.

It does have a slight digital sound because it has a A/D D/A stage, but 
if you run it into a desk hot then that doesn't seem to be a problem - 
it's a great synth:  I auditioned it against a waldorf MWXT - and it 
sounds much better than that.

I don't have any expensive synths to compare it too, but I'm sure 
you'll get an idea.  It's great to program too.

Alex

On Saturday, Apr 19, 2003, at 00:01 Europe/London, John wrote:

>
>
> >Yes, "more" is usually "better" when it comes to synths!  Buying both
> >is a great solution!  ;)
>
> Well if I had enough money........
>
> >Regarding the comments about the "fatness" of the Evolver...  I
> >understand why you make those statements.  However, I partially
> >disagree.  I heard many similar comments about the ARP Odyssey (of
> >which I own two).  I think reality is that it would be more fair to
> >say that AT BASIC/"DEFAULT"/"NORMAL" kinds of SETTINGS, the Evolver
> >sounds "less fat" than some other synths.  However, when you're even
> >moderately good at programming your own sounds, I think that the
> >Evolver (and the Odyssey)
>
> Yes Odyssey is good. I like that sound. I think i'd be happy with 
> something along those lines.
> What I don't want is anything digital sounding, for I have plenty of 
> that already.
> The price for the Evolver is great, but I'm not sure if it will be too 
>  ermmmm digital, although I know it has an analog oscillater. Which is 
> why I really need to hear it first hand.
> I have listened to some mp3s btw, I'll try some more tomorrow.
> The ATC-1, may be too expensive for me, if it is twice the price of 
> the Evolver.
>
>     Many thanks for your advice/ links already. I'm open to any more 
> advice.
>     But of course hands on experience can't be beaten.
>
>    John
>
<image.tiff>

>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> DSI_Evolver-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

What do you mean by "sounds much better" ?
I have both and the XT  is a hell of a synth.
If you mean less digital, of course the XT is a
digital synth.  Many synths will sound
less digital than the XT.


on 19/04/03 7:41 AM, Alex at zero@... wrote:

"It does have a slight digital sound because it has a A/D D/A stage, but
if you run it into a desk hot then that doesn't seem to be a problem -
it's a great synth:  I auditioned it against a waldorf MWXT - and it
sounds much better than that."

Hi Alex

>It does have a slight digital sound because it has a A/D D/A stage, but
>if you run it into a desk hot then that doesn't seem to be a problem -
>it's a great synth:  I auditioned it against a waldorf MWXT - and it
>sounds much better than that.


Just wondering did you audition the Evolver before you bought it or after.

John

Hi Sorry Simon, I meant that to be a personal email, not to the list, 
and as such was just representing a personal opinion to someone, err, 
personally.  Didn't mean to broadcast.

z.
On Sunday, Apr 20, 2003, at 00:28 Europe/London, simon leclerc wrote:

> What do you mean by "sounds much better" ?
> I have both and the XT  is a hell of a synth.
> If you mean less digital, of course the XT is a
> digital synth.  Many synths will sound
> less digital than the XT.
>
>
> on 19/04/03 7:41 AM, Alex at zero@... wrote:
>
>
> "It does have a slight digital sound because it has a A/D D/A stage, 
> but
> if you run it into a desk hot then that doesn't seem to be a problem -
> it's a great synth:  I auditioned it against a waldorf MWXT - and it
> sounds much better than that."
>
>
<image.tiff>

>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> DSI_Evolver-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

Hi Ski

>My Odysseys and Evolver CAN do much the same thing,
>but it takes a little more work.

Purely on a sound level. If you was in a studio to record your prized creations (songs)
and could take either the Evolver or your Odyssey, which would it be?

John

Wow!  You know how to ask tough questions, don't you?!

You said "purely on a sound level", but let me break "sound level" 
down into three things:  

1) Timbral QUALITY of the basic oscillators and filters (purely a 
personal preference, of course)

2) Timbral RANGE of the basic oscillators and filters (number of 
different tones that can be made)

3) Synthesis features (synthesis architecture, including modulation 
matrix, etc.

For item #1, the Odyssey and Evolver really aren't that dissimilar.  
Certainly, at basic settings, I think the Evolver sounds much closer 
to an Odyssey than a Minimoog.  I've never really thought about it, 
but I'd have to say that I don't have a preference for one over the 
other.  I'd call this one a tie.

For item #2, even on the analog side only, the Evolver has more range 
than the Odyssey.  Both have sawtooth, pulse, pulse width mod, a 
great 24 db/octave resonant lowpass filter, and a highpass filter 
(digital highpass in the case of the Evolver).  However, the Evolver 
adds a triangle, a mixed triangle/saw, and a 12 db/octave lowpass 
filter setting.  Throw in the digital oscillators, and the Evolver 
leaves the Odyssey well behind.  Both machines are very good here, 
with a nice range of tones, but the Evolver wins this one.

For item #3, one of the things I liked best about the Evolver when I 
first saw it is that it can do some of the things that my Odysseys 
could do that no other (or few other) synths could ever do.  There 
are still a few unique tricks that the Odyssey can do that the 
Evolver can't (such as the duophonic operation, S/H lag, ability to 
choose the S/H waveforms, etc.).  However, there are a LOT of things 
the Evolver can do that the Odyssey can't (4 LFO's, 3 EG's, great 
modulation matrix, tunable feedback loop, three delays with feedback, 
distortion, "output hack", 4 track sequencer that can modulate all 
sorts of things, etc.).  Once again, both machines have great 
features, but the Evolver is the clear winner.


I guess that means I'd have to pick the Evolver over the Odyssey as 
the one machine that I'd take to the studio... assuming, of course, 
that I'd have a good keyboard controller with me, too!  (PLEASE don't 
let my Odysseys hear that I said that!  Or the ARP Little Brother, 
either!)

Now... if I could just find the level of composing talent that guys 
like Stefan and Boele have to take into the studio with me too...  


Ski
www.ex5tech.com
EX5Tech Evolver forum:
http://www.ex5tech.com/ex5ubb_cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=forum&f=23


--- In DSI_Evolver@yahoogroups.com, John <liquid.poet@n...> wrote:
> Hi Ski
> 
> >My Odysseys and Evolver CAN do much the same thing,
> >but it takes a little more work.
> 
> Purely on a sound level. If you was in a studio to record your 
prized
> creations (songs)
> and could take either the Evolver or your Odyssey, which would it 
be?
> 
> John

Hey thanks for the answer(s) Ski


>Wow!  You know how to ask tough questions, don't you?!

Yes;) Well it was the one question I could think of which would give me a
clear indication.


John

On Tue, 22 Apr 2003 20:23:48 +0100, John <liquid.poet@...>
wrote:

>Purely on a sound level. If you was in a studio to record your prized
>creations (songs)
>and could take either the Evolver or your Odyssey, which would it be?

Evolver - no contest. My Ody (rather different to most I should say)
is pretty much a law unto itself. Interesting but not as something I'd
like to rely on...

Paul

>Evolver - no contest. My Ody (rather different to most I should say)
>is pretty much a law unto itself. Interesting but not as something I'd
>like to rely on...

>Paul

Ok this is more very good testiment for the Evolver!

Someone has very kindly offered to let me come and listen to his Evolver in
the UK.

This week I am doing a recording session for one of our tracks and I think
there will be heavy use of an Oddysey and various other analog synths (not
mine, unfortunately).
Oddly enough though the track is called 'Digital World'.

This  should give me first hand knowledge of what is what.

John

<best_Dr._McCoy_voice>
ARP Odyssey... law?  LAW!??  My gosh, Paul... get a hold of yourself, 
man!  The Odyssey isn't law.  It's religion!

Oh, what do you expect from someone who only owns ONE Odyssey, 
anyway.  :rolleyes:  Dammit Jim, I'm a doctor, not a psychotherapist!

Besides, I'm not sure I LIKE this newfangled "Evolver" thing 
scattering my atoms across the universe.
</best_Dr._McCoy_voice>


Ski
www.ex5tech.com
EX5Tech Evolver forum:
http://www.ex5tech.com/ex5ubb_cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=forum&f=23


--- In DSI_Evolver@yahoogroups.com, Paul Nagle <paul@s...> wrote:
> Evolver - no contest. My Ody (rather different to most I should say)
> is pretty much a law unto itself. Interesting but not as something 
I'd
> like to rely on...
> 
> Paul


> On Tue, 22 Apr 2003 20:23:48 +0100, John <liquid.poet@n...>
> wrote:
> 
> >Purely on a sound level. If you was in a studio to record your 
prized
> >creations (songs)
> >and could take either the Evolver or your Odyssey, which would it 
be?
>

I think it is high time for a synth-off! We need to come up with some 
criteria for a synth contest, and then figure out a way to have it in real 
time and with with real time judging.

My money is on Evolver.






>From: "ski_ex5tech" <ex5tech@...>
>Reply-To: DSI_Evolver@yahoogroups.com
>To: DSI_Evolver@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: [Evolver] Re: Hello from the UK / Evolver vs. ARP Odyssey
>Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2003 03:14:41 -0000
>
><best_Dr._McCoy_voice>
>ARP Odyssey... law?  LAW!??  My gosh, Paul... get a hold of yourself,
>man!  The Odyssey isn't law.  It's religion!
>
>Oh, what do you expect from someone who only owns ONE Odyssey,
>anyway.  :rolleyes:  Dammit Jim, I'm a doctor, not a psychotherapist!
>
>Besides, I'm not sure I LIKE this newfangled "Evolver" thing
>scattering my atoms across the universe.
></best_Dr._McCoy_voice>
>
>
>Ski
>www.ex5tech.com
>EX5Tech Evolver forum:
>http://www.ex5tech.com/ex5ubb_cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=forum&f=23
>
>
>--- In DSI_Evolver@yahoogroups.com, Paul Nagle <paul@s...> wrote:
> > Evolver - no contest. My Ody (rather different to most I should say)
> > is pretty much a law unto itself. Interesting but not as something
>I'd
> > like to rely on...
> >
> > Paul
>
>
> > On Tue, 22 Apr 2003 20:23:48 +0100, John <liquid.poet@n...>
> > wrote:
> >
> > >Purely on a sound level. If you was in a studio to record your
>prized
> > >creations (songs)
> > >and could take either the Evolver or your Odyssey, which would it
>be?
> >
>
>


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Just curious.....  :)