Yamaha DTXpress/DTXplorer/DTXtreme

hehe... Thanks to all of you! I'm sitting here grinning from ear to ear
reading through this thread. When I first posed the question, I mentioned
to a cow orker here that I was "trying to start a philosophical
discussion on the drummer mailing list". He laughed! <insert your
favorite dumb drummer joke here> :D

This is the type of discussion I *love* to participate in, especially
when others participate at such high levels! The idea that your direction
in pursuing an art form can be altered by exploring such ethereal topics
as "what is a drum/what is a drummer?" really keeps my interest up!

I think I've gotten some new insight from the opinions offered so far,
and I do see that my approach to edrums does appear to be in the
minority. I never thought of my edrums as a "Stand in" for my a-drums,
any more than I thought of my first keyboard as a stand-in for the piano
we had in the rehearsal hall.

I *always* thought of it as a _new_ instrument I was about to explore. It
could be some people might be inclined to dismiss the e-drums as "not
ready for prime time" when their a-drum skills cannot be used *exactly*
to produce the sounds they did with the a-drums.

I think that if you approach the e-drum kit with the mindset that it is a
new instrument and it will require learning in order to create acceptable
sound, you will be more successful. If you come in with the mind set that
it is an electronic version of an acoustic kit you'll probably be
disappointed and frustrated.

Vern

--
Vern Graner CNE/CNA/SSE    | "If the network is down, then you're
Senior Systems Engineer    | obviously incompetent so why are we
Texas Information Services | paying you? Of course, if the network
http://www.txis.com        | is up, then we obviously don't need
Austin Office 512 328-8947 | you, so why are we paying you?" VLG




emf said:
> --- In DTXpress@yahoogroups.com, "brown8700" <brown8700@a...> wrote:
>> Joe:
>> I am not, repeat, NOT, saying that e-drums are not drums. (does a
>> triple-negative statement make a positive statement?)
>> Lionel Hampton a drummer? You bet! Had you ever seen him play a
> kit?
>> He wasn't just a mallet man. I'm proud to say that Mr. Hampton
> hailed
>> from my hometown of Louisville, KY.
>> Future Man a drummer? I don't know, I guess. He strikes things in a
>> rythmic-percussive manner that make a drum-like sound. And, I'm
> proud
>> to say that Bela Fleck hails from my home state of Kentucky. Not
> sure
>> about Future Man, though.
>> Now, the next question is "would a Linn-Drum programmer be
> considered
>> a drummer?"
>
> I thought this would heat up--in a good way--given the variables. But
> I think that everyone agrees that anything that's hit in a musical or
> purely percussive context qualifies as a "drum"--electronic drums
> qualify with distinction--unless the context dictates that the label
> be withheld for explanatory reasons: "What's Herschel playing at the
> back of the stage?  Is that a drum?  No, it's a garbage can."
> Electronic drums are not "real" drums only to the extent that they
> invite direct comparison with their acoustic counterparts: "Was
> someone playing Slingerlands on that cut?" "No, that was definitely a
> DTXpress programmed to sound like real Slingerlands."
>
> One empirical question is whether education on an e-kit is an
> adequate substitute for education on an a-kit. I don't think that
> anyone thinks that the two situations are a perfect match, though
> people may disagree about the extent of the mismatch, though both
> instruments are drums.
>
> Another empirical question, with defintite semantic overtones, is how
> does one qualify to be a "drummer." The easy, and often true, answer
> is by playing drums with some method to the madness. But in a context
> that intends to discriminate between abilities, or activities, the
> answer might not be so easy. Any definition runs the risk of
> arbitrariness. "Drummer" can be a relative title of honor. If you
> asked Buddy Rich whether Ringo is a drummer, he'd unequivocably
> say "no." But Buddy Rich might also say, "Look at that guy over there
> playing those copper pots. Now, there's a drummer." Skill in a
> percussive context also enters into someone's ascription of the term.
> Whether people agree in any given circumstance might boil down to
> whether they are "drummers" themselves, whether they are open-minded,
> etc. Buddy Rich might ultimately reserve his judgment: "But I'd like
> to see him behind a kit plaing with a big band before I give him my
> blessing," whereas we might say, "why bother? That guy has great
> hands."
>
> The Linn-drum programmer is not a "drummer" in the context of the
> DTXpress Group, in which members discuss drumming by using sticks
> ultimately to create sound. But in a wider framework, as someone who
> creates percussive accompaniment in a musical setting, the Linn
> technician certainly falls within the broad family of drummers,
> especially if he also knows how to play "real" drums and uses that
> knowledge to good effect in his programming.
>
> One thing to keep in mind is that language works best within
> circumscribed contexts that contain other less ambiguous cues. When
> words have to do all of the work themselves, they are subject to
> failure. (Vern reminded me once that when I want to make sure that
> what I say comes off as a joke, I should use an emoticon.) Words are
> not vehicles of absolute meaning. One person's/moment's "drummer" is
> another person's hack, beginner, or eccentric. Do we set up a
> committee to determine who the "real drummers" are? We get along
> quite well without one, I think.
>
> Ed
>
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