Digital BW, The Print

Well there have always been silver papers that are far more matte than air
dried glossy. However, many phenomenal printers rejected them, at least for
much of their work. Lets talk again when we have that same option.

Todd

PS, My esthetic is changing the longer I work the carbon medium, the more
fine prints I see from others, and the more I use better papers (I'm liking
Orwell and LPM best right now). But I doubt I'll ever be willing to give up
that air dried gloss option.

I so often hear about the better separation one gets in the blacks/darks
with digital. Perhaps; but too often they are dry, burnt, blacks. They are
dark, but dead. They don't have the life, the vigor, the vitality, of my
silver blacks. Many images take on a romantic quality with such dry blacks -
I in no way denigrate them, My wording is too harsh, but I think you know
what I mean. They just don't serve all images. One print I'm working on now
is a composition which includes many backlit leaves. I can push the contrast
to soot and chalk and still not get vitality out of them. I can get 200
tones of gray in them, but they don't pulse with life. Yet on the same table
lies a sloppy silver work print that pulses with life. I doubt even Dr.
Frankenstein could give a carbon print such energy.

But I do think the day will come.


> You could say air dried glossy more or less IS the preferred matte surface in
> Silver printing. It isn't glossy, and it isn't matte, some
> sort of beautiful hybrid that I have NEVER seen in Digital. Wonder if we ever
> will?
> 
> 
> Jerry
> 
> 
> Todd Flashner wrote:
> 
>>> You DON'T think Inkjet prints are better than darkroom prints?
>> 
>> Jerry
>> 
>> I don't think they are "superior to any darkroom print". Certain images are
>> served better by one medium over the other. A blanket statement of one
>> process being superior to the other isn't true for either silver of carbon
>> quad/hex. I'm certainly capable of making poor prints in either medium which
>> are exceeded by the other, and I don't know that we've yet seen the *best*
>> either medium is capable of.
>> 
>> I brought up Brett Weston because so much of his imagery is based on
>> abstractions that I think were formulated on the basis of what he could get
>> out of the materials of his day. I think if he were printing on matte papers
>> (which he could have done at that time, if he felt it would serve his art),
>> he'd have shot differently, and we'd be discussing a different body of work
>> from him.
>> 
>> This is a big topic, which I'd love to flush out some time, but I've a busy
>> weekend ahead, now is not it.
>> 
>> In short I'd say I have some images which work better in silver, and others
>> look better in carbon. As I look to the future I expect digi/carbon to
>> improve further than silver, and my opinion may be different at that time,
>> but presently I have too many images that need silver, in order to be what I
>> want them to be.
>> 
>> Todd
>> 
>>> You DON'T think Inkjet prints are better than darkroom prints?
>>> 
>>> Jerry
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Todd Flashner wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Jerry, I happen to have an inside track on the Brooklyn Bridge if your in
>>>> the market for one. ;-)
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> yes. (assuming Bret Weston prints them with a quad system.). He might not
>>>>> be
>>>>> able to do so, as he's assumed room temperature. :)
>>>>> 
>>>>> jerry
>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>> on 8/23/01 3:46 PM, Jerry Olson wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Nick, I'm about as picky a person as you will ever see. I think that
>>>>>>> digital
>>>>>>> prints are superior in every way to darkroom prints. They are
>>>>>>> sharper, the shadow detail is greater, the highlight detail is greater,
>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>> you can do things in photoshop not even the worlds greatest
>>>>>>> printers could do in the darkroom.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Superior to Brett Weston's prints?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Todd
>>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and
>>>> other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
>>>> 
>>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and
>>> other
>>> resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
>>> 
>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>>> 
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and
>> other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
>> 
>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> 
> 
> 
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and other
> resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:
> 
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> 
>