Digital BW, The Print

exactly my point! I'd be interested in how you can say that 'the detail is
there' if the scan appears very soft. I can give the appearance of
sharpness - as i do - by USM tricks - but the details (I'm thinking here of
thin branches, trees etc - the usual difficult suspects) are missing. When
people say the 1680/3200 are sharp, what they are really saying is 'sharp
enough for them' - but as to some form of 'absolute' sharpness (I feel
Austin about to dive in;-0 ) they are very second rate IMO compared to film
scanners.

Julian
----- Original Message -----
From: "Simon Lamb" <simon@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2003 5:47 PM
Subject: Re: [Digital BW] RE: Is this noise or what? (was: Epson3200 - Test
results)


> Julian
>
> I must be losing the thread here.  What Polaroid and Minolta are you
> comparing scans with?  If the Multi Pro and SS120 then you cannot compare
> flatbed to dedicated film scanner.  My 3200 scans appear very soft but
look
> great after sharpening in PS, and all the detail is there.
>
> Simon
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Julian Thomas" <julianthomas@...>
> To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Monday, March 17, 2003 3:53 PM
> Subject: Re: [Digital BW] RE: Is this noise or what? (was: Epson3200 -
Test
> results)
>
>
> > well mine is. and I've had it serviced twice. There really is no
> comparison
> > with scans I've done on both a Minolta and Polaroid film scanner of the
> same
> > neg.
> >
> > Julian
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Simon Lamb" <simon@...>
> > To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Monday, March 17, 2003 4:26 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Digital BW] RE: Is this noise or what? (was: Epson3200 -
> Test
> > results)
> >
> >
> > > Julian
> > >
> > > The 1680 cannot be producing softer scans than the 3200 and I am
getting
> > > excellent results with just PS sharpening.  I have definitely found
> > > artifacts appearing when doing any sort of sharpening in the scan
> > software,
> > > especailly is smooth, even tones such as blue sky.  I have also found
> that
> > > UltraSharpen Pro produces much better results than plain USM.
> > >
> > > Simon
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Julian Thomas" <julianthomas@...>
> > > To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> > > Sent: Monday, March 17, 2003 2:43 PM
> > > Subject: Re: [Digital BW] RE: Is this noise or what? (was: Epson3200 -
> > Test
> > > results)
> > >
> > >
> > > > You are dead right - it is better to leave sharpening until PS, BUT
> the
> > > > optics in the 1680 are so soft that I need both. BTW I only do this
in
> > > BW -
> > > > for colour I do all the sharpening (I use Ultra Sharpen Pro) in PS.
> One
> > > test
> > > > I do is to take a blank neg and use a sharp knife to make a score
and
>
> > then
> > > > experiment with various amounts of sharpening to get a fine line.
> > Flatbed
> > > > scanners IME just cannot get the sharpness of a film scanner. People
> > talk
> > > > resolution numbers all the time but ignore the 'look' of scanners. I
> > note
> > > > that this is happening with cameras i.e. the Kodak is 'better' than
> the
> > > > canon because it has more megapixels, noone seems to be bothered
about
> > the
> > > > image quality!
> > > >
> > > > Julian
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: "Alessandro Pardi" <alessandro.pardi@...>
> > > > To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
> > > > Sent: Monday, March 17, 2003 3:14 PM
> > > > Subject: RE: [Digital BW] RE: Is this noise or what? (was:
Epson3200 -
> > > Test
> > > > results)
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > Julian,
> > > > >
> > > > > do you get better results with a pre-sharpening at scan time? I
> always
> > > > read
> > > > > that it's better to leave the sharpening to Photoshop.
> > > > >
> > > > > Alessandro
> > > > >
> > > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > > From: Julian Thomas [mailto:julianthomas@...]
> > > > > > Sent: domenica 16 marzo 2003 12:06
> > > > > > To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
> > > > > > Subject: Re: [Digital BW] RE: Is this noise or what? (was:
> > Epson3200 -
> > > > > > Test results)
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >  I cannot get satisfactory scans (sharp) without applying 3x3
> > > > > > > pixel unsharp mask in the scanning application (Silverfast Ai
> 6).
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Me too on a 1680. I need a 3x3 in the scanner software plus the
> > usual
> > > > > > unsharp mask tricks in PS. Just as an example - I had some
> > > > > > scans done on a
> > > > > > minolta of 6x6 cm negs. On the 1680 I have to use the same
> > > > > > amount of unsharp
> > > > > > mask on a 600x600 pixel 75ppi jpeg as i did on the 4800ppi
> > > > > > minolta tiff
> > > > > > file. Colour is harder as the 3x3 gives me a halo effect. I've
> > started
> > > > > > shooting a BW landscape project (ok Nij stop laughing) and the
> > lackof
> > > > > > sharpness is pissing me off big time
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Julian
> > >
> > >
> > >
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and
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