Digital BW, The Print

p.s. I know that AgfaPan is thin emulsion vs the
faster films but it still was thick compared to most
of those available today - altho, I've begun to
experiment with the Adox/Efke 25 speed stuff - anyone
else here have experience/opinion about that?

--- Michael Vendrell <mjvendrell2@...> wrote:

> Well, I guess it's old nostalgia week!  I read all
> of
> the Zone VI Newsletters from Fred Picker and would
> await each one anxiously with greed for more - even
> when I disagreed with him - and that wasn't all that
> rare about non-technical things - but I was always
> inspired whether I agreed or not. I believe only
> Edward Weston's "Daybooks" have had a greater word
> based influence upon me as a photographer and then
> there are Weston's photographs!!!. 
> 
> I too used HC110 (in a rotary tank) for my 8x10"
> Tri-X
> Pro 320 negs.   Nothing can touch that combo in
> large
> format - I know that's just an opinion - but, in
> this
> case, we're right!
> 
> I also was very fond of FG7 but for thick emulsion
> fine grained film (my favorite being Agfapan 25 -
> may
> it RIP) for 120 negs ( for me 1st used in a Twin
> Lens
> Rollei 6x6cm and then later a Pentax 6X7cm - I still
> own both and my 13yo son has been using an old
> Rollei
> I got for him on e-bay for practically nothing -
> altho' a bit more than the Holgas he is also fond
> of...)
> 
> To return to topic: Those 120 negs on Agfapan and
> Tech
> Pan scan like a dream on my Nikon 9000.  I've still
> not scanned any of my 8x10 negs as I always only
> contact printed them - now that is quality to
> behold!
> It was big and good enough for Weston - and usually
> for me as well. We have an 8x10 enlarger in the wet
> darkroom at our studio but I can't say it has
> tempted
> me in the least now that I've tasted the digital
> lightroom.  I have been considering the Epson 4990
> scanner for the big negs - but have also considered
> just paying someone to drum scan them right -  any
> thoughts or advice there - or volunteers <g>?  Oh
> and
> if it's not showing - yea I'll be 55 in April - so
> it
> goes...Michael
> 
> --- Clayton Jones <cj@...> wrote:
> 
> > Hello Ginny,
> > 
> > >Why do you print on both sides? 
> > 
> > I'm not doing any double sided printing, but when
> > I'm working on the
> > last little tweaks for a first-time final print of
> a
> > new image (or the
> > first time on some paper) I often make some test
> > prints.  All of these
> > go back into the box and are reused for future
> test
> > prints.  Also,
> > with the 2400's ABW system I often make a lot of
> > tests with a new
> > image to determine the best color tone for it. 
> Over
> > time this can all
> > add up to a lot of paper, so a double sided paper
> > does save some
> > money.  Kayenta is also 2-sided.
> > 
> > 
> > >I'm not sure what the Paper Chase article is.
> > 
> > Article #5 at the link below is called "The Great
> > Paper Chase", and
> > lists 26 matte papers and their attributes, such
> as
> > weight, cotton
> > content, OBA content, paper color, cold/warm tone
> > (how it renders
> > carbon inks), dmax, etc.  It's a good way to get a
> > quick overview of
> > the popular papers.
> > 
> > 
> > >Yes. I remember the first time I tried TX. I used
> > FG-7 as the
> > >developer. Ugh! So much grain. 
> > 
> > I remember FG-7 <g>.  It made a pretty good
> two-bath
> > developer, but it
> > couldn't beat HC-110 for sheer beauty.
> > 
> > >>I then took a darkroom seminar with Fred Picker.
> > He spoke about 
> > >HC-110 (1:31) and the testing needed to find my
> own
> > personal ASA 
> > >valid for my shutter, and, also how to calculate
> > the true develpment 
> > >time for TX with my equipment. He said that Kodak
> > was over-
> > >developing the film to push the ASA up.  Well,
> the
> > ASA I wound up 
> > >using was 280 or so. And, the development time
> was
> > a minute or 2 
> > >less than what Kodak specified. (They were
> pushing
> > the ASA by 
> > >overdeveloping, hence, more grain) Viola! TX
> became
> > a fine grain 
> > >film! The difference was amazing, breathtaking!
> > 
> > Fred Picker's teachings had a huge effect on me
> (his
> > practical
> > approach to testing and simplification has been a
> > direct influence on
> > my path into digital printing).  I read his book
> and
> > newsletters, and
> > did all as you describe (also used his modified
> > Pentax spotmeter, a
> > great innovation).  I ended up using ASA 200 and
> > HC-110 at 1:48 as I
> > did mostly landscape and wanted to pull even more
> > most of the time.
> > Occasionally I would mark a roll for special
> > treatment, but the dilute
> > HC-110 gave a very nice long scale negative.  No
> > other film/developer
> > combination I tried came even close to what it
> would
> > do (this
> > conversation is making me nostalgic <g>.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > >Hmmm....I could afford the 5D. But, what would a
> > couple of basic
> > >lenses cost me?
> > 
> > Well, mortgage your home, send your kids to work
> at
> > Safeway...
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > >Is it just me or is it hard to find 11X14 paper
> > nowadays? I really
> > >like that size and would use it a lot more if I
> > could find it! 
> > 
> > I've only seen one paper in that size (something
> > from Epson in
> > CompUSA), but I would use 13x19 anyway because I
> > want some border
> > paper around the image.  I no longer trim off the
> > borders and dry
> > mount.  These papers don't ripple like silver
> > papers, and most don't
> > curl either.  They can be held flat and smooth by
> > the window mat.  I
> > now hinge the top of the print to the back of the
> > window mat, and
> > hinge the top of the window mat to the backing
> > board.  This speeds up
> > the matting enormously.  The window is cut larger
> > than the image just
> > like with a mounted print, but the mat is now
> > pressing down on the
> > print's border paper, holding it flat.  It looks
> the
> > same as a mounted
> > print and the signature is now on the print
> instead
> > of the backing
> > board.  Dry mounting is one of the things I was
> > happy to leave behind.  
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > >Can you recommend a good supplier?
> > 
> > Dourian and Aurora must be purchased from Red
> River,
> > MerNat and MerSm
> > from Hawk Mtn.  I get PR from Shades of Paper. 
> VFA
> > and Kayenta can be
> > found lots of places, just look for good prices,
> > sales, etc.  Before
> > ordering any Kayenta, be sure to read the Paper
> > Chase article about it
> > - there was a bad batch out there that may still
> be
> > on vendors' shelves.
> > 
> > 
> > >what does K3 stand for? I know it refers to the
> > inkset
> > > but not sure what it designates.
> > 
> > It refers to the three shades of black or gray (K,
> > LK, LLK).  It
> > differs from the 2200 UC ink which has just K and
> > LK.  The 3rd gray
> > ink is one reason for the nice smooth tones it
> > produces.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > >Thanks for the wealth of info Clayton and the
> nice
> > sharing of 
> > >your early years in photography.
> > 
> > You're welcome.  It's nice to read your story as
> > well and find kindred
> > souls with similar backgrounds.  There are quite a
> > few forum members
> > who used Fred Picker's methods.  I've had a lot of
> > nice email
> > correspondence over the past few years.
> > 
> > Regards,
> > Clayton
> > 
> > 
> > Info on black and white digital printing at    
> > http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> 
> 
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