Digital BW, The Print

Greg wrote:
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Ernst Dinkla 
> <E.Dinkla@...> wrote:
>> Tyler Boley wrote:
>>
>>> We are now seeing a lot of over-enlarged imagery. The above 
> depends on that degree 
>>> IMHO. There comes a point at which the eye needs SOMETHING in 
> focus. Sharp grain is far 
>>> more pleasing to me at any size than mush with nothing sharp 
> anywhere.
>> That describes my love/hate relationship with B&W grain quite 
>> well. But with color grain/clouds it is far less  appealing to 
>> me and I guess to more people. So you may have the strange 
>> conclusion that an analogue B&W image allows a larger print 
>> than a color print (analogue and digital prints) while there 
>> isn't more data available but just because there is that 
>> convention in taste about B&W grain. Part of the appreciation 
>> of BO printing in this list is related to that. All this 
>> probably has much to do with book printing, text, all that 
>> pure B&W graphic material we know since written language 
>> became black ink on white paper. We are less pleased with hard 
>> CMY/RGB dots on screens and papers.
>>
> 
> 
> How does this effect differ (if at all) between the "traditional" B/W 
> films compared to the C-41 process B/W films? I seem to recall a 
> couple people saying the C-41 based films work very nicely for 
> scanning, but I haven't had the chance to directly compare the two 
> types of film. Something I guess I should do one of these days. And 
> then there is the reversal B/W process to consider, is the grain the 
> same after it is reversed to provide a positive?

Chromogenic B&W scans better than analogue B&W if grain isn't 
what you like and the scanner can't cope with the high Dmax of 
a specific analogue B&W films. But it also doesn't have the 
B&W grain that can be attractive as Tyler describes.

Reversal B&W will be Agfa Scala in practice, not really suited 
to scanning either with the density range directed to 
projection. Availability of film and processing in view of 
AgfaPhoto being bankrupt should be considered too.

Like I wrote in another message on another list today: 
analogue film manufacturers should think of some R&D on color 
and B&W film that makes them more suitable for scanning and 
sell that film for that specific work flow sacrificing the 
normal analogue print qualities and/or projection quality of 
the films. That could keep film in competition with pure 
digital photography for a longer time. One would like to have 
the compressed dynamic range + lower Dmax of color negative 
film + its latitude in exposure and at the same time the image 
reversed on film already as grain and color noise is nicer in 
slide film scans. The orange mask of color negative film 
removed as well of course. A similar conventional B&W film 
should be possible too and of course chromogenic B&W film 
also. You can't do anything else with that kind of films though.

http://www.dr5.com/filmprintout.html says something about 
scanning positive B&W film including Scala.

Ernst

-- 

                    --
           Ernst Dinkla


www.pigment-print.com
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