Digital BW, The Print

Now that QTR will handle jpgs, I thought I'd convert the GG-to-QTR.tif file to jpg so that I can use the 3MK/R1800 workflow with Photoshop Elements. (Because Elements doesn't have Profile Conversion.) But when I went to the layers palette to see the actual correction curve, it was not visible, only the text overlay. So, with my jpg image still on the workspace I instead called up the original tiff version. Now I had the two layers I was accustomed to, with both the text and the curve easily visible, and I was able to drag the curve over and drop it on the image. I could see a shift in the tonal values take place, as expected. Then I saved the new file, again as a jpg. 

Could it be I did something wrong in converting the tiff correction to a jpg? Or shall I just continue using the tiff version when working with a jpg image? Seems to work... but is it ok to lay a tiff curve over a jpg image?  (I also noted that the file size did not increase nearly as much as when I placed the tiff curve correction over a tiff image.)

Thanks!

Paul

"Paul" <paulmwhiting@...> wrote:
>
> Now that QTR will handle jpgs, I thought I'd convert the GG-to-QTR.tif file to jpg so that I can use the 3MK/R1800 workflow with Photoshop Elements. (Because Elements doesn't have Profile Conversion.) But when I went to the layers palette to see the actual correction curve, it was not visible, only the text overlay.

That text layer should have been merged down so there would be only a single layer -- the one you wanted.  I'm not sure which of the many such files you're using.  Do you have the URL where you downloaded the conversion file?

> So, with my jpg image still on the workspace I instead called up the original tiff version. Now I had the two layers I was accustomed to, with both the text and the curve easily visible, and I was able to drag the curve over and drop it on the image. I could see a shift in the tonal values take place, as expected. 

>Then I saved the new file, again as a jpg. 

I can't save a Jpeg with a layer in Photoshop CS5.  It converts to a .PSD.  If Elements is flattening the image first and then saving it, don't forget that it's only a printing version.

If your Jpeg was converted to a PSD or Tiff and then you converted it back to a Jpeg, you may have multiple Jpeg artifacts.  That is, the original would have had Jpeg compression artifacts, then in the process of conversion to Tiff and re-conversion back to Jpeg, you'd have a second "save as" Jpeg that would double up on the artifacts.

I try to avoid Jpegs or convert them to Tiff ASAP.

 
> Could it be I did something wrong in converting the tiff correction to a jpg? Or shall I just continue using the tiff version when working with a jpg image? Seems to work... but is it ok to lay a tiff curve over a jpg image?  (I also noted that the file size did not increase nearly as much as when I placed the tiff curve correction over a tiff image.)

Again, I try to avoid conversions to Jpeg.  Photoshop does seem to allow a layer to be dragged to a Jpeg, but my guess is that internally it has converted the file to a PSD.  Can you actually save a Jpeg and have the layer stay as a layer?  I don't think I can do that in CS5.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

Thanks, Paul,

(hope this is not too confusing to read, I tried to respond to your comments as I understood them. I'm in pretty deep water for me here!)

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Paul" <roark.paul@...> wrote:
>
> 
> "Paul" <paulmwhiting@> wrote:
> >
> > Now that QTR will handle jpgs, I thought I'd convert the GG-to-QTR.tif file to jpg so that I can use the 3MK/R1800 workflow with Photoshop Elements. (Because Elements doesn't have Profile Conversion.) But when I went to the layers palette to see the actual correction curve, it was not visible, only the text overlay.
> 
> That text layer should have been merged down so there would be only a single layer -- the one you wanted.  I'm not sure which of the many such files you're using.

I didn't know there were others out there.

> Do you have the URL where you downloaded the conversion file?

Here's the one I used... from your website. Is this what you mean?

http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/GG22-to-QTR-curve.zip

> > So, with my jpg image still on the workspace I instead called up the original tiff version. Now I had the two layers I was accustomed to, with both the text and the curve easily visible, and I was able to drag the curve over and drop it on the image. I could see a shift in the tonal values take place, as expected. 
> 
> >Then I saved the new file, again as a jpg. 
> 
> I can't save a Jpeg with a layer in Photoshop CS5.  It converts to a .PSD.  If Elements is flattening the image first and then saving it, don't forget that it's only a printing version.

But a printing version is what I want, isn't it? {I think!)
 
> If your Jpeg was converted to a PSD or Tiff and then you converted it back to a Jpeg, you may have multiple Jpeg artifacts.  That is, the original would have had Jpeg compression artifacts, then in the process of conversion to Tiff and re-conversion back to Jpeg, you'd have a second "save as" Jpeg that would double up on the artifacts.

> I try to avoid Jpegs or convert them to Tiff ASAP.

I should do that more often, good point.

> Again, I try to avoid conversions to Jpeg.  Photoshop does seem to allow a layer to be dragged to a Jpeg, but my guess is that internally it has converted the file to a PSD.  Can you actually save a Jpeg and have the layer stay as a layer?

I don't really know what's going on here. I don't believe that it stays as a layer. It must get flattened, as you say.

Paul

"Paul" <paulmwhiting@...> wrote:
>
...
> 
> I didn't know there were others out there.

(I have to use Google to find things in my own web space.)

 
> Here's the one I used... from your website. Is this what you mean?
> 
> http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/GG22-to-QTR-curve.zip

OK, the text was already on the background.  There is only one additional (curves) layer.  I think you just have to be sure it's the curves layer that you're dragging to the target image and not the background.


> > >Then I saved the new file, again as a jpg. 
> > 
> > I can't save a Jpeg with a layer in Photoshop CS5.  It converts to a .PSD.  If Elements is flattening the image first and then saving it, don't forget that it's only a printing version.
> 
> But a printing version is what I want, isn't it? {I think!)

The altered image is what you want for printing, but it's just for printing.  I usually save the printing versions to the desktop and add "QTR" to the name so that I know they are altered.  After I print them by dragging the file to QTR, I drag the file to the Recycle bin.


Paul
www.PaulRoark.com