Digital BW, The Print

I just came from B & H. Photo in NYC where they were kind enough to print 
some of my files on their Epson 5500. We printed onto the museum parchment 
paper I supplied. I wanted to see a sepia print made on this unit. It was 
fantastic. It was so beautiful under their lights! Then I walked it outside. 
My beautiful sepia toned print turned green! I sell many of my images in 
outdoor circumstances. Even if they like the green, they'll be upset when 
they get the prints home and they turn brown! The 5500 is an awesome printer. 
I need an archival color printer now, without metamerism. Does anybody have 
one that works? (without metamerism). Maybe the MIS variable inks for sepia 
and something else for color?
Sorry for ranting,

George J Kunze

Interesting comments on the 5500 (actually the inks!).  

Why not buy a Epson 1200 and PiezoColor Inkset with CIS?

Low Cost, available, custom profiles, little to no metamerism, great technical support and even a group of dedicated users on the PiezoColor forum.

Buy a refurb 1200 and the cost is even lower.  

Steadman

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: toomagenta@... 
  To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Monday, August 20, 2001 2:21 PM
  Subject: Re: [Digital BW] Metamerism


  I just came from B & H. Photo in NYC where they were kind enough to print 
  some of my files on their Epson 5500. We printed onto the museum parchment 
  paper I supplied. I wanted to see a sepia print made on this unit. It was 
  fantastic. It was so beautiful under their lights! Then I walked it outside. 
  My beautiful sepia toned print turned green! I sell many of my images in 
  outdoor circumstances. Even if they like the green, they'll be upset when 
  they get the prints home and they turn brown! The 5500 is an awesome printer. 
  I need an archival color printer now, without metamerism. Does anybody have 
  one that works? (without metamerism). Maybe the MIS variable inks for sepia 
  and something else for color?
  Sorry for ranting,

  George J Kunze

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

George,

unfortunately, no surprises in your message. The 2000P which uses the same 
inks has had similar problems, well documented by now. For color, Piezo 
Color makes claims of no metamerism. Look it up at inkjetmall (links on our 
Bookmarks). 

For BW,  either PiezoBW or the MIS VT would be candidates: I haven't heard 
of metamerism problems with either,  but I would let the experts talk for MIS. 
My experience is only with Piezo, and if you like a warm-to -warmer range, 
you are in good hands. If you prefer cooler tones and control over the exact 
tone, it seems MIS has the edge. Also, if you use MIS, you can use a larger 
Epson printer (7000, may be 9000) without special software (ie with the Epson 
driver).

Antonis


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., toomagenta@a... wrote:
> I just came from B & H. Photo in NYC where they were kind enough to print 
> some of my files on their Epson 5500. We printed onto the museum 
parchment 
> paper I supplied. I wanted to see a sepia print made on this unit. It was 
> fantastic. It was so beautiful under their lights! Then I walked it outside. 
> My beautiful sepia toned print turned green! I sell many of my images in 
> outdoor circumstances. Even if they like the green, they'll be upset when 
> they get the prints home and they turn brown! The 5500 is an awesome 
printer. 
> I need an archival color printer now, without metamerism. Does anybody 
have 
> one that works? (without metamerism). Maybe the MIS variable inks for 
sepia 

> and something else for color?
> Sorry for ranting,
> 
> George J Kunze

Antonis.
Thanks for your reply. I was really taken aback by the 5500's metamerism 
since I had read a review saying it's was much better than the 2000's 
metamerism. Perhaps the color images exhibit less metamerism, but the sepia! 
Does the MIS variable allow for a sepia tone, or do I need a six-color 
printer?
Thanks again
George J Kunze

Steadman,
Thanks for your reply. I had a 1200 once and the 1270 really made mince meat 
of it. If the cone inks were working with the 1270 or 80 I'd be there. I 
understand there are issues, and I need a commercial printer. I do a lot of 
volume. I may just dedicate an 1160 to MIS variables with a cone driver for 
my sepia, and use a 1280 with cone color for color. Thanks again
George Kunze

On a bright white paper, piezo is almost sepia. With the MIS variable tone
inkset, you could get it a little warmer than piezo.

Jerry



toomagenta@... wrote:

> Antonis.
> Thanks for your reply. I was really taken aback by the 5500's metamerism
> since I had read a review saying it's was much better than the 2000's
> metamerism. Perhaps the color images exhibit less metamerism, but the sepia!
> Does the MIS variable allow for a sepia tone, or do I need a six-color
> printer?
> Thanks again
> George J Kunze
>
> If you do not wish to belong to Digital B&W, The Print, you may
> unsubscribe by sending an email to:
> DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

Hi Jerry,
I have bw piezo, and mine is really cool. It was greenish until I put some 
OEM carts in and ran it thru my 1160. It got pretty close to neutral, but 
still a bit cool. I just tried the LPM and it is greenish. I assumed it was 
the paper. Maybe I have some bad ink. I would love some sepia like tones. But 
it has to be predictable. Cones stuff was warm a few months ago, but now...? 
Maybe I should ship the ink back for inspection. But if the variable inkset 
can get the best of warm, neutral and cool, 'that's great. And it is so much 
less expensive! I wonder if I need to flush the piezo and buy a new CIS? 
Thanks for your comments.
George Kunze

I did not flush between the piezo and the MIS inks, or the Generations inks. In
fact, I've mixed both with the piezo inks and had no problems.

I have never seen the green cast some people are talking about. The Legion photo
matte and the MIS variable tone inks are a wonderful combination with the exact
cool tones that I love. Paul's warm curve can be made a little bit warmer by
sliding the magenta/green slider to the far left on 6 color printers, or the
Yellow/Blue slider on the 4 color printers.

If you are truly looking for a sepia tone, you can mix the exact tone you want
in a color balance photoshop adjustment curve. Then just apply it to each print
before printing, and you can use any archival color inkset.

There would be enough color in there to avoid any crossovers. (Did you know
there are about a hundred or more shades of Sepia? It's hard to choose which you
like best!  Start with about a 20 Yellow 10 magenta mix, and spread out from
there.

How did your e mail address come about?

Jerry

Again, thank you, Jerry for your response and help. My email address 
"toomagenta" was given to me by my wife who claimed I always critique my 
prints as too magenta, too green,etc.
George J Kunze