Yahoo Groups archive

Digital BW, The Print

Index last updated: 2026-04-28 22:56 UTC

Thread

Epson 1430 and Eboni 6 request

Epson 1430 and Eboni 6 request

2012-04-19 by Dave

Hi all - 

I've been reading this list since 2009, with the intention of one day setting up a dedicated B&W printer. Based on the posts I've been reading about the 1400/Eboni 6, and the low price for admission ($220 + ink and carts), I think I'm ready to make the plunge.

I've been printing with an HP 9180 for the past several years and in general it's been a good experience. Lately though, I've been having difficulty printing successfully in B&W. My tests indicate that it's probably due to a combination of poor HP software, changes in Apple's color management scheme, and printheads that are testing as good, but failing to produce consistent results from session to session. I'll continue to use the 9180 for color work as long as I can keep it going, but I know its days are numbered. It'll eventually be replaced with a 17 or 24" Epson.

The idea of carbon printing appeals to me on a number of levels. The permanence of prints is a big plus, as is the color constancy (the lack of metamerism) and the novelty of working with a relatively esoteric printing method. At this point though, I'm not willing to take the "mad scientist" experimental approach that some here have (very admirably) committed to, in paving the way toward a mainstream acceptance of carbon on cotton. I realize that I'll need to experiment and adapt the medium to my own use, but I'm far more interested in doing photography than I am in developing the technology that supports it. 

Having said this, the only thing that's holding me back right now is the fact that I've never actually seen an Eboni-6/1400 print in the  flesh. I have no way of knowing whether the color and tonal range will be suitable for the work I do. So, here's my question: is there anyone in this group, using a 1400 with Eboni-6 that lives in New Mexico, who would be willing to show me some prints? I'm east of Santa Fe, but I'd be happy to travel. Alternately, would any of you be willing and able to send me a list of the RGB values you're reading (with a spectrocolorimeter) from a typical Eboni-6/1400 print of a grayscale step wedge? My preferred paper at this point is Entrada Bright, but readings from any paper would be welcome. I'm interested in a color range that's just on the warm side of neutral.

Thanks in advance. I look forward to reading your responses.

All best,
Dave

Re: Epson 1430 and Eboni 6 request

2012-04-19 by Paul

Dave <cowcreekroad@...> wrote:

> ... about the 1400/Eboni 6, ...

> would any of you be willing and able to send me a list of the RGB values you're reading (with a spectrocolorimeter) from a typical Eboni-6/1400 print of a grayscale step wedge? My preferred paper at this point is Entrada Bright, but readings from any paper would be welcome. I'm interested in a color range that's just on the warm side of neutral.
...



My PDF on Eboni-6 has several graphs of the Lab A and B values for various papers.  
See http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/Eboni-6.pdf

The Lab B measures the yellow (positive) - blue (negative Lab B) of the image.  It is the single best measure of warmth.  Both the absolute values and the change from the paper white affect the impression of warmth.  I think you'll find the papers with the low Lab B rise probably meet your criteria of "just on the warm side of neutral."

Additionally, while I do not have values for the Entrada bright, I do for the natural.  A screen grab of values for it and some others has been uploaded to http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/Eb-MoabEntN-others.JPG

Hope this helps.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

Re: Epson 1430 and Eboni 6 request

2012-04-19 by Pamela Holt

Ditto, is anyone in the Charlotte NC area with this type of printer?
Thanks so much! Pamela Holt


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] Re: Epson 1430 and Eboni 6 request

2012-04-20 by Dave

Thank you, Paul.

Unfortunately, my very limited experience with the L*A*B process keeps me from understanding these values in anything but a very approximate and relative sense. I know that if I saw samples, I'd be able to evaluate coloration without a problem, but viewing an array of values is just too disconnected from my visual experience.

RGB values of gray patches would be more helpful, in that I'm very familiar with the process, and I could easily reproduce the colors on my monitor or in print.

Ideally, I'd like to see samples of E-6 on paper, in the flesh. 
Show quoted textHide quoted text
On Apr 19, 2012, at 8:40 AM, Paul wrote:

> Dave <cowcreekroad@...> wrote:
> 
>> ... about the 1400/Eboni 6, ...
> 
>> would any of you be willing and able to send me a list of the RGB values you're reading (with a spectrocolorimeter) from a typical Eboni-6/1400 print of a grayscale step wedge? My preferred paper at this point is Entrada Bright, but readings from any paper would be welcome. I'm interested in a color range that's just on the warm side of neutral.
> ...
> 
> 
> 
> My PDF on Eboni-6 has several graphs of the Lab A and B values for various papers.  
> See http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/Eboni-6.pdf
> 
> The Lab B measures the yellow (positive) - blue (negative Lab B) of the image.  It is the single best measure of warmth. Both the absolute values and the change from the paper white affect the impression of warmth.  I think you'll find the papers with the low Lab B rise probably meet your criteria of "just on the warm side of neutral."
> 
> Additionally, while I do not have values for the Entrada bright, I do for the natural.  A screen grab of values for it and some others has been uploaded to http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/Eb-MoabEntN-others.JPG
> 
> Hope this helps.
> 
> Paul
> www.PaulRoark.com

[Digital BW] Re: Epson 1430 and Eboni 6 request

2012-04-20 by mccarvill

Maybe ask MIS if they would send you a sample. Their competitor, Jon Cone, sells Piezography samples, so MIS should do this as well.

Mark 

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Dave <cowcreekroad@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
> Thank you, Paul.
> 
> Unfortunately, my very limited experience with the L*A*B process keeps me from understanding these values in anything but a very approximate and relative sense. I know that if I saw samples, I'd be able to evaluate coloration without a problem, but viewing an array of values is just too disconnected from my visual experience.
> 
> RGB values of gray patches would be more helpful, in that I'm very familiar with the process, and I could easily reproduce the colors on my monitor or in print.
> 
> Ideally, I'd like to see samples of E-6 on paper, in the flesh. 
> 
> 
> On Apr 19, 2012, at 8:40 AM, Paul wrote:
> 
> > Dave <cowcreekroad@> wrote:
> > 
> >> ... about the 1400/Eboni 6, ...
> > 
> >> would any of you be willing and able to send me a list of the RGB values you're reading (with a spectrocolorimeter) from a typical Eboni-6/1400 print of a grayscale step wedge? My preferred paper at this point is Entrada Bright, but readings from any paper would be welcome. I'm interested in a color range that's just on the warm side of neutral.
> > ...
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > My PDF on Eboni-6 has several graphs of the Lab A and B values for various papers.  
> > See http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/Eboni-6.pdf
> > 
> > The Lab B measures the yellow (positive) - blue (negative Lab B) of the image.  It is the single best measure of warmth. Both the absolute values and the change from the paper white affect the impression of warmth.  I think you'll find the papers with the low Lab B rise probably meet your criteria of "just on the warm side of neutral."
> > 
> > Additionally, while I do not have values for the Entrada bright, I do for the natural.  A screen grab of values for it and some others has been uploaded to http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/Eb-MoabEntN-others.JPG
> > 
> > Hope this helps.
> > 
> > Paul
> > www.PaulRoark.com
>

[Digital BW] Re: Epson 1430 and Eboni 6 request

2012-04-20 by Paul

Would one of the internet color converters work? Try http://www.easyrgb.com/index.php?X=CALC

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com 

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Dave <cowcreekroad@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
> Thank you, Paul.
> 
> Unfortunately, my very limited experience with the L*A*B process keeps me from understanding these values in anything but a very approximate and relative sense. I know that if I saw samples, I'd be able to evaluate coloration without a problem, but viewing an array of values is just too disconnected from my visual experience.
> 
> RGB values of gray patches would be more helpful, in that I'm very familiar with the process, and I could easily reproduce the colors on my monitor or in print.
> 
> Ideally, I'd like to see samples of E-6 on paper, in the flesh. 
> 
> 
> On Apr 19, 2012, at 8:40 AM, Paul wrote:
> 
> > Dave <cowcreekroad@> wrote:
> > 
> >> ... about the 1400/Eboni 6, ...
> > 
> >> would any of you be willing and able to send me a list of the RGB values you're reading (with a spectrocolorimeter) from a typical Eboni-6/1400 print of a grayscale step wedge? My preferred paper at this point is Entrada Bright, but readings from any paper would be welcome. I'm interested in a color range that's just on the warm side of neutral.
> > ...
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > My PDF on Eboni-6 has several graphs of the Lab A and B values for various papers.  
> > See http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/Eboni-6.pdf
> > 
> > The Lab B measures the yellow (positive) - blue (negative Lab B) of the image.  It is the single best measure of warmth. Both the absolute values and the change from the paper white affect the impression of warmth.  I think you'll find the papers with the low Lab B rise probably meet your criteria of "just on the warm side of neutral."
> > 
> > Additionally, while I do not have values for the Entrada bright, I do for the natural.  A screen grab of values for it and some others has been uploaded to http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/Eb-MoabEntN-others.JPG
> > 
> > Hope this helps.
> > 
> > Paul
> > www.PaulRoark.com
>

[Digital BW] Re: Epson 1430 and Eboni 6 request

2012-04-24 by mis_inksupply

If you would like to send us a sample image to print I can have it printed next week when I can get some free time with the printer. I will put the image along with a 21 step wedge on the test prints.

Please send the request to support@... and include your shipping details.  If you put my name in the subject line along with the request for EB6 it will get forwarded to me.

I will send free test prints for anyone in the USA that would like one, but the EB6 will only be in the printer for a day or two before we will have to pull it for other test products, and I will not be able to guarentee prints once we pull it.

I have a surplus of our 180 GSM Premier Art matte paper that I can use to run the prints, other papers would be subject to paper sample prices.

-Justin

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "mccarvill" <mccarvill@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>
> 
> 
> Maybe ask MIS if they would send you a sample. Their competitor, Jon Cone, sells Piezography samples, so MIS should do this as well.
> 
> Mark 
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Dave <cowcreekroad@> wrote:
> >
> > Thank you, Paul.
> > 
> > Unfortunately, my very limited experience with the L*A*B process keeps me from understanding these values in anything but a very approximate and relative sense. I know that if I saw samples, I'd be able to evaluate coloration without a problem, but viewing an array of values is just too disconnected from my visual experience.
> > 
> > RGB values of gray patches would be more helpful, in that I'm very familiar with the process, and I could easily reproduce the colors on my monitor or in print.
> > 
> > Ideally, I'd like to see samples of E-6 on paper, in the flesh. 
> > 
> > 
> > On Apr 19, 2012, at 8:40 AM, Paul wrote:
> > 
> > > Dave <cowcreekroad@> wrote:
> > > 
> > >> ... about the 1400/Eboni 6, ...
> > > 
> > >> would any of you be willing and able to send me a list of the RGB values you're reading (with a spectrocolorimeter) from a typical Eboni-6/1400 print of a grayscale step wedge? My preferred paper at this point is Entrada Bright, but readings from any paper would be welcome. I'm interested in a color range that's just on the warm side of neutral.
> > > ...
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > My PDF on Eboni-6 has several graphs of the Lab A and B values for various papers.  
> > > See http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/Eboni-6.pdf
> > > 
> > > The Lab B measures the yellow (positive) - blue (negative Lab B) of the image.  It is the single best measure of warmth. Both the absolute values and the change from the paper white affect the impression of warmth.  I think you'll find the papers with the low Lab B rise probably meet your criteria of "just on the warm side of neutral."
> > > 
> > > Additionally, while I do not have values for the Entrada bright, I do for the natural.  A screen grab of values for it and some others has been uploaded to http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/Eb-MoabEntN-others.JPG
> > > 
> > > Hope this helps.
> > > 
> > > Paul
> > > www.PaulRoark.com
> >
>

Re: [Digital BW] Re: Epson 1430 and Eboni 6 request

2012-04-24 by Dave

Thank you Justin! I'll drop you a line this evening, when I get back to the computer.
Show quoted textHide quoted text
On Apr 24, 2012, at 1:04 PM, mis_inksupply wrote:

> If you would like to send us a sample image to print I can have it printed next week when I can get some free time with the printer. I will put the image along with a 21 step wedge on the test prints.
> 
> Please send the request to support@... and include your shipping details.  If you put my name in the subject line along with the request for EB6 it will get forwarded to me.
> 
> I will send free test prints for anyone in the USA that would like one, but the EB6 will only be in the printer for a day or two before we will have to pull it for other test products, and I will not be able to guarentee prints once we pull it.
> 
> I have a surplus of our 180 GSM Premier Art matte paper that I can use to run the prints, other papers would be subject to paper sample prices.
> 
> -Justin
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "mccarvill" <mccarvill@...> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Maybe ask MIS if they would send you a sample. Their competitor, Jon Cone, sells Piezography samples, so MIS should do this as well.
>> 
>> Mark 
>> 
>> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Dave <cowcreekroad@> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Thank you, Paul.
>>> 
>>> Unfortunately, my very limited experience with the L*A*B process keeps me from understanding these values in anything but a very approximate and relative sense. I know that if I saw samples, I'd be able to evaluate coloration without a problem, but viewing an array of values is just too disconnected from my visual experience.
>>> 
>>> RGB values of gray patches would be more helpful, in that I'm very familiar with the process, and I could easily reproduce the colors on my monitor or in print.
>>> 
>>> Ideally, I'd like to see samples of E-6 on paper, in the flesh. 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Apr 19, 2012, at 8:40 AM, Paul wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Dave <cowcreekroad@> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> ... about the 1400/Eboni 6, ...
>>>> 
>>>>> would any of you be willing and able to send me a list of the RGB values you're reading (with a spectrocolorimeter) from a typical Eboni-6/1400 print of a grayscale step wedge? My preferred paper at this point is Entrada Bright, but readings from any paper would be welcome. I'm interested in a color range that's just on the warm side of neutral.
>>>> ...
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> My PDF on Eboni-6 has several graphs of the Lab A and B values for various papers.  
>>>> See http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/Eboni-6.pdf
>>>> 
>>>> The Lab B measures the yellow (positive) - blue (negative Lab B) of the image.  It is the single best measure of warmth. Both the absolute values and the change from the paper white affect the impression of warmth.  I think you'll find the papers with the low Lab B rise probably meet your criteria of "just on the warm side of neutral."
>>>> 
>>>> Additionally, while I do not have values for the Entrada bright, I do for the natural.  A screen grab of values for it and some others has been uploaded to http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/Eb-MoabEntN-others.JPG
>>>> 
>>>> Hope this helps.
>>>> 
>>>> Paul
>>>> www.PaulRoark.com
>>> 
>> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------
> 
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as they are often being updated.
> 
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> 
> If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same page.
> 
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep them short.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames. Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the membership without notice.
> - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from the membership.
> - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner and Moderators. See “Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines” in the Files section:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
> 
> BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  “OWNER” AND “MODERATORS” OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
>

Move to quarantaine

This moves the raw source file on disk only. The archive index is not changed automatically, so you still need to run a manual refresh afterward.