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Future of black and white inkjet printing, if any?

Future of black and white inkjet printing, if any?

2019-07-17 by roark.paul@...

I see there are still quite a few members listed on this old forum.


So, I have a question for the surviving B&W printers/photographers:


What desktop inkjet printer would it be best for me to buy and support for B&W printing?


Needless-to-say, I'd prefer dedicated B&W inks and QTR compatibility (with the old GUI my preference there).


My search suggests that Epson has fairly effectively wiped out our third party ink options on current Epson printers. If there is no third party ink possibility, then I would might abandon Epson. I do not want to indirectly help a company that has damaged the competitive ink market, unless there are no good alternatives. If, all things considered, an Epson printer is still the best for B&W, then so be it.


Because I do my serious fine art printing on either an old 7800 or 9800, which should last a few more years, I do not necessarily need a "fine art" quality, wide-format printer. A cheap little letter size unit would serve my non-gallery photo purposes. However, what would be important to me is to get a printer that would satisfy the needs of the most B&W photographers.


If an Epson 9 ink printer with OEM ink is the best option in a second best world, then I'll go for it. However, I want to be sure I have not overlooked more suitable options first.


Thanks and regards to the group,


Paul

www.PaulRoark.com


RE: [Digital BW] Future of black and white inkjet printing, if any?

2019-07-17 by Elliot Puritz

Hi Paul:

 

As you noted, those who want to use QTR are facing an upcoming problem as older Epson printers break and cannot be replaced with newer models unless the warranty is voided.  Of course, judging from many comments, Epson printers apparently are engineered to break relatively soon and so one must wonder if the one year original warranty is even worth considering.

 

I have sitting in my cabinet an Epson 2880 and 1430-both of which have not been used in about a year.  They were used with Cone inks.

 

The printers are obviously “small desk top” which might perfectly serve your needs.

 

I suspect that one or more channels might need to be cleaned.  However, no charge to you except for shipping from Florida. Perhaps too costly to ship but at no charge might be worth a chance?

 

Elliot
Show quoted textHide quoted text
From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com> 
Sent: Wednesday, July 17, 2019 4:29 PM
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Digital BW] Future of black and white inkjet printing, if any?

 

  

I see there are still quite a few members listed on this old forum.

 

So, I have a question for the surviving B&W printers/photographers:

 

What desktop inkjet printer would it be best for me to buy and support for B&W printing?

 

Needless-to-say, I'd prefer dedicated B&W inks and QTR compatibility (with the old GUI my preference there).

 

My search suggests that Epson has fairly effectively wiped out our third party ink options on current Epson printers.  If there is no third party ink possibility, then I would might abandon Epson.  I do not want to indirectly help a company that has damaged the competitive ink market, unless there are no good alternatives.  If, all things considered, an Epson printer is still the best for B&W, then so be it.

 

Because I do my serious fine art printing on either an old 7800 or 9800, which should last a few more years, I do not necessarily need a "fine art" quality, wide-format printer.  A cheap little letter size unit would serve my non-gallery photo purposes.  However, what would be important to me is to get a printer that would satisfy the needs of the most B&W photographers.





If an Epson 9 ink printer with OEM ink is the best option in a second best world, then I'll go for it.  However, I want to be sure I have not overlooked more suitable options first.





Thanks and regards to the group,





Paul

www.PaulRoark.com <http://www.PaulRoark.com> 

 





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

RE: [Digital BW] Future of black and white inkjet printing, if any?

2019-07-17 by Mike Johnston

It is not a dedicated B&W / QTR solution but the Canon pro-1000 is very good.

 

Thanks

 

Mike Johnston
Show quoted textHide quoted text
From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com> 
Sent: Wednesday, July 17, 2019 2:29 PM
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Digital BW] Future of black and white inkjet printing, if any?

 

  

I see there are still quite a few members listed on this old forum.

 

So, I have a question for the surviving B&W printers/photographers:

 

What desktop inkjet printer would it be best for me to buy and support for B&W printing?

 

Needless-to-say, I'd prefer dedicated B&W inks and QTR compatibility (with the old GUI my preference there).

 

My search suggests that Epson has fairly effectively wiped out our third party ink options on current Epson printers.  If there is no third party ink possibility, then I would might abandon Epson.  I do not want to indirectly help a company that has damaged the competitive ink market, unless there are no good alternatives.  If, all things considered, an Epson printer is still the best for B&W, then so be it.

 

Because I do my serious fine art printing on either an old 7800 or 9800, which should last a few more years, I do not necessarily need a "fine art" quality, wide-format printer.  A cheap little letter size unit would serve my non-gallery photo purposes.  However, what would be important to me is to get a printer that would satisfy the needs of the most B&W photographers.





If an Epson 9 ink printer with OEM ink is the best option in a second best world, then I'll go for it.  However, I want to be sure I have not overlooked more suitable options first.





Thanks and regards to the group,





Paul

www.PaulRoark.com <http://www.PaulRoark.com>

Re: [Digital BW] Future of black and white inkjet printing, if any?

2019-07-17 by forums@walkerblackwell.com

> My search suggests that Epson has fairly effectively wiped out our third party ink options on current Epson printers. 
> 
Reality disagrees. At IJM we support all new North American SC-Ps from the P400 (13”), P600 (13”) all the way to the P9000 with the exception of the P5000 and P10000 and P20000s due to lack of market for chip R&D. If the demand was high we could support the XP-15000 as well. We have brought on several hundred new BW customers in less than half a year on the SC-P series printers. While the conversion can be more costly up front (1-time chips or decoder boards on some printers vs resettable chips), the newer printers are an improvement in many ways as far as head uniformity and dependability, nozzle size, etc. The P400 and P600 work the same, chip-wise, as the older generation. We have several thousand(s) of customers running dedicated BW on both legacy and new model printers successfully year after year. It’s not a dead community at all. People are printing and doing their thing and most have just gone elsewhere to find camaraderie and get their burning questions answered. The demand is there and I should know because I’m always in the clean room making 20L jugs of Pro.

https://community.inkjetmall.com
https://forums.piezography.com
https://groups.io/g/EpsonWideFormat
https://forum.luminous-landscape.com/

Best regards everyone,
Walker._,___

Re: Future of black and white inkjet printing, if any?

2019-07-17 by brian_downunda@...

Have you considered the P400? My understanding is that you can still get refillable carts for it. I'm a fan of these hi-gloss inkset printers. You may not need the extra channels, but I think the build quality is better than the R1430, which I think I read somewhere you had a bad run with. The R1430 is a cheaper printer and the model variation seems high.

I'm still running an R1900, although it's getting more problematic after all these years. I have an unused R2000 ready for when the R1900 finally dies. If I was buying one now I'd go for the P400. I'd like something wider, but for the most part I don't need it, and from what I read and what people tell me, the ink lines and dampers printers come with a maintenance burden for monochrome inkset use, because of pigment sedimentation. The issue with the carts on print head printers is that the carts are more problematic, and you can be unlucky and get a printer that doesn't seem to like them. But at least you can change inksets and economically hibernate the printer when needed.

My 2 cents.

Re: Future of black and white inkjet printing, if any?

2019-07-17 by andre1moreau@...

Hello Paul,
I'm looking to get back into b&w printing (A3 size) after a few year's absence.

I'd started b&w printing a very long time ago with an Epson 1160 and Piezography and left when the green tint problem became apparent. (I know it's been fixed a long time ago also.)

After that I used an Epson 1400 in a 3-MK setup which was a joy to use, but that was last used some five years ago. There are some old printers on the used market but I do not want to go that route.

Today, an Epson XP-15000 or a Canon Pixma Pro-100 would be my choice. In a 3-MK setup if possible.

All the best,

Re: Future of black and white inkjet printing, if any?

2019-07-18 by paulmwhiting@...

One thing that would help would be to hold this forum on a more friendly platform. It's my understanding Groups.io has accepted other Yahoo groups. Newcomers find it to have features lacking here. And Walker has listed other platforms as well.

I'm glad Paul has suggested this discussion. He's one of the pioneers of B&W printing after all.

Paul W.

Re: [Digital BW] Future of black and white inkjet printing, if any?

2019-07-18 by Paul Roark

Hi Elliot,

That's a very kind offer. Thank you.

I think for now I'll search a bit longer for some solution that will be available to others. I'm in touch with some local third party types that have large retail markets. (I9;m also in touch with my old antitrust friends who are still doing that type of work.)

It's a shame that every few years we have to go through this type of exercise.

At one point I actually had an Epson insider tell me flat-out that keeping competitive inks out of their printers was the primary reason for the chips. Maybe the Japanese just don't really understand that we traditionally take antitrust seriously in the US, and treble damages and fines can be huge. Epson has been a good supplier over the years, but keeping the market competitive is more important than any single competitor.

Regards,

Paul
Show quoted textHide quoted text
On Wed, Jul 17, 2019 at 3:22 PM 'Elliot Puritz' drpuritz@... [DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint] <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Hi Paul:

As you noted, those who want to use QTR are facing an upcoming problem as older Epson printers break and cannot be replaced with newer models unless the warranty is voided. Of course, judging from many comments, Epson printers apparently are engineered to break relatively soon and so one must wonder if the one year original warranty is even worth considering.

I have sitting in my cabinet an Epson 2880 and 1430-both of which have not been used in about a year. They were used with Cone inks.

The printers are obviously “small desk top” which might perfectly serve your needs.

I suspect that one or more channels might need to be cleaned. However, no charge to you except for shipping from Florida. Perhaps too costly to ship but at no charge might be worth a chance?

Elliot

From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, July 17, 2019 4:29 PM
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Digital BW] Future of black and white inkjet printing, if any?

I see there are still quite a few members listed on this old forum.

So, I have a question for the surviving B&W printers/photographers:

What desktop inkjet printer would it be best for me to buy and support for B&W printing?

Needless-to-say, I'd prefer dedicated B&W inks and QTR compatibility (with the old GUI my preference there).

My search suggests that Epson has fairly effectively wiped out our third party ink options on current Epson printers. If there is no third party ink possibility, then I would might abandon Epson. I do not want to indirectly help a company that has damaged the competitive ink market, unless there are no good alternatives. If, all things considered, an Epson printer is still the best for B&W, then so be it.

Because I do my serious fine art printing on either an old 7800 or 9800, which should last a few more years, I do not necessarily need a "fine art" quality, wide-format printer. A cheap little letter size unit would serve my non-gallery photo purposes. However, what would be important to me is to get a printer that would satisfy the needs of the most B&W photographers.

If an Epson 9 ink printer with OEM ink is the best option in a second best world, then I'll go for it. However, I want to be sure I have not overlooked more suitable options first.

Thanks and regards to the group,

Paul

www.PaulRoark.com <http://www.PaulRoark.com>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] Future of black and white inkjet printing, if any?

2019-07-18 by Paul Roark

Thanks for the response, Walker. I have use IJM carts in the past with good results. I assume the carts you are referring to are listed here:

A P400 with IJM carts may be my best route forward.

There is a rumor out there that Epson printers/software identify third party carts and, in effect, destroy the printer. Do you see any evidence of that? As an old antitrust lawyer, that would a very attractive suit to bring, though I am out of that business personally.

The rumors also indicate that the P600 is more at risk from third party carts than the P400. Again, however, I'm not in a position to have enough facts to judge this. Does IJM experience indicate any difference in reliability between those two printers?

Again, thanks for the response, and carry on the good work.

Regards,

Paul


Show quoted textHide quoted text
On Wed, Jul 17, 2019 at 4:14 PM 'forums@...' forums@... [DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint] <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


My search suggests that Epson has fairly effectively wiped out our third party ink options on current Epson printers.

Reality disagrees. ...
The P400 and P600 work the same, chip-wise, as the older generation. ...

Re: [Digital BW] Re: Future of black and white inkjet printing, if any?

2019-07-18 by Paul Roark

Hi Brian,

The P400 is probably my best option. But I'm still at the search stage. The crippled 1430 I have has not been up to what I used to expect from Epson, but maybe I just got a bad sample, or maybe their quality is just not up to what it used to be.

Show quoted textHide quoted text
Brian wrote:

... If I was buying one now I'd go for the P400.

Thanks for the advice.

Regards,

Paul

Re: [Digital BW] Re: Future of black and white inkjet printing, if any?

2019-07-18 by Paul Roark

Hi Andre,

I'm looking to get back into b&w printing ...

I'd started b&w printing a very long time ago with an Epson 1160 and Piezography ...

Likewise, once I decided inkjets were good enough for serious work.

I'm encouraged by the responses I've had. I do think we have a path forward, but getting the feedback from the dedicated B&W community has helped me focus on what route may be most useful to the most people.

Given my personality, a turn-key approach is not sufficiently hands-on for me. As such, I'm basically re-visiting the scene to try and find the path that will give me the flexibility I'm after.

Regards,

Paul


Re: [Digital BW] Re: Future of black and white inkjet printing, if any?

2019-07-18 by kellyhealy@...

Paul

I have not done a lot of B/W printing lately. I tried some alternative process experiments and fell head over heals into Kallitypes and printing on Japanese papers I make myself. Darkroom mess compounded exponentially!

I bought a P600 for making digital negatives about a year ago. I like it and have had no trouble with it. One advantage is it has a 60ml capacity vs 25 in the P400.

You already know about IJM carts

Best
Kelly

Re: [Digital BW] Re: Future of black and white inkjet printing, if any?

2019-07-18 by Paul Roark


Kelly (kellyhealy@...) wrote:

...

I bought a P600 for making digital negatives about a year ago. I like it and have had no trouble with it. One advantage is it has a 60ml capacity vs 25 in the P400.

That could be significant.

Are you using the Epson/OEM inks? The reliability of the third party carts might be a major factor in which printer I go with.

The P600's more generic K3 type ink layout may also be more compatible with the existing profiles I have. In fact, I will thoroughly test the OEM inkset that ships with the printer (I assume). If it can do what I want, it's not out of the question that I'll use the OEM inks. Cost is always a factor, but, quality is #1, with ease, installed base, and lots of other factors also in the mix.

Among other things, I have done my own fade testing (which is well controlled and I trust as much as Wilhelm's). We'll see how the OEM ABW, in addition to QTR, with OEM inks stacks up to my predominately carbon pigment inkset, including the use of the (Canon Lucia EX based) cool toner I use to take the carbon to make neutral image tone. In general, carbon is by far the most lightfast pigment -- in the silver print league in fade, and inkjet prints can be 10x better in terms of the longevity of the paper base. The quality of the color pigments needed to make the carbon warm is where there is a significant difference.

In the OEM 3k pigment inksets, the color inks, even if they are very good, are the weaklings. So, the less the better in my B&W prints. The ABW mode may use as little as possible color, but they probably have to have some running to keep the jets in good shape and keep the image as smooth as possible. All else being equal, an inkset that is aimed at the dominant color printing market is at an inherent disadvantage relative to a dedicated B&W setup. The quality of the total package might be able to overcome that disadvantage, but probably not. I do intend to test the OEM approach.

I'll be curious how the OEM inkset does with Arches Hot Press 140 lb watercolor paper as well. NOTE, I do NOT recommend anyone use Arches with inkjet printers. You have to be very careful to avoid head strikes. Most should definitely stay with inkjet paper. That said, with my 7800, a full sheet of Arches is what I consider my favorite medium. While I do like the option of having a 100% carbon pigment image on as large a piece of Arches that I can feed to the machine, if the printer can feed Arches well, and the OEM MK can hit a dmax of 1.6, that could be very significant. For display, however, I do generally prefer a full sheet -- 22 x 30 -- to a 13" max. width printer. With Arches, its relatively low smoothness due to its lack of an inkjet receptor coating, makes Arches not my favorite paper for desktop printing. I currently have to use two MK positions to print on Arches. That means I must have empty refillable carts and QTR. In that respect, the apparent support of the P600 but not the P400 by QTR may well simply exclude the P400 from consideration.

Having a printer that locks me out of deciding what my image forming medium is going to be, however, is not really compatible with my approach to my art and B&W medium. It's also bad for the long term health of the inkjet market.

I do appreciate any comments that can lead me to be best path forward, not only for my art but for the black and white photographic print medium. I put images on paper for wall display. Whatever gets me the best for the least wins. So far, and for my particular personality and preferences, I see nothing that can touch what I call the "carbon on cotton" photographic print medium. So, while B&W on Arches is too small a market for any printer company to care about, how the printer does with that niche is important for me.

Regards,

Paul

Re: [Digital BW] Re: Future of black and white inkjet printing, if any?

2019-07-18 by kellyhealy@...

Paul,

I am using IJM Cone Color pro ink with the IJM cartridges. I bought the printer, cartridges and ink nearly new from an estate. I have had no issues with the cartridges in the 18 months I have been using the printer, I have never had any problems with IJM carts. My B/W Variable tone 3880 is about 6 years old and still plugging away with the origin IJM carts.

I did once try to run some prints through my OEM ink 3880 ABW with Arches. The result was not acceptable.

Kelly

Re: [Digital BW] Re: Future of black and white inkjet printing, if any?

2019-07-20 by brian_downunda@...

I have been reflecting on this, and in particular the P400 vs P600 choice. While I have a strong preference for the simplicity and flexibility of the carts-on-head printers, the small format cartridges can be utter PITA at times. Which may have been your R1430 problem.

Now that IJM has refillable cartridges for the P600 and not just a CIS, there are some benefits to that printer. You're far less likely to get cartridge compatibility problems, and you won't get that never-ending, cascading series of head cleans each time one of the ARC chips resets. And much less often refilling. If you don't need to switch inksets and you print often enough for sedimentation not to be an issue, then it's probably the better choice.

Re: [Digital BW] Re: Future of black and white inkjet printing, if any?

2019-07-20 by Paul Roark

Brian,

I agree. I ordered the p600 yesterday.

Paul

Show quoted textHide quoted text

I have been reflecting on this, and in particular the P400 vs P600 choice. While I have a strong preference for the simplicity and flexibility of the carts-on-head printers, the small format cartridges can be utter PITA at times. Which may have been your R1430 problem.

Now that IJM has refillable cartridges for the P600 and not just a CIS, there are some benefits to that printer. You're far less likely to get cartridge compatibility problems, and you won't get that never-ending, cascading series of head cleans each time one of the ARC chips resets. And much less often refilling. If you don't need to switch inksets and you print often enough for sedimentation not to be an issue, then it's probably the better choice.

Which Piezography system for Epson P800?

2019-08-25 by Feli di Giorgio

I am looking to invest in a Piezography system for glossy black and white printing. 
I’m primarily a film (Tri-X) shooter with access to a Hasselblad X5.

I’ve reviewed the information on the Inkjetmall site and still find myself a little confused in regards to the differences between K7, K6, P2. 

Piezography Pro is pretty clear, but Piezo Pro vs K7/K6/P2 in terms of image quality is another question. 

Going with Piezo Pro and having to do a second pass to apply the gloss is very tempting, but I wonder if the output from K7/K6/P2 is superior given that they use more shades of gray. 

Ultimately I would choose image quality over printing speed



Here is some additional information

- I have a new Epson P800

- Looking to print glossy and PiezoDN (PiezoDN should be fine with any Piezo set)

- I have no interest in printing matte.

- No interest in split tone printing (warm shadows with cool highlights etc)

- I am looking for the closest thing to a traditional selenium toned silverprint. Back in my darkroom days I used to print on AGFA Multicontrast and would selenium tone my prints. 

- Would choose image quality over printing speed.

- Am I correct in the assumption that High​ ​Density​ ​Photo​ ​Black​ is for glossy printing and UltraHD​ ​Matte​ ​Black​ is for matte work?

- I tend to accumulate material and print the project at once, so the printer may sit idle for some time. Sounds like Piezoflush will be my friend.


From my research is seems like I would want either a K7 or P2 setup. 

Is there a difference in quality / tonality / DMAX between glossy prints / DN made on the K7 system and Piezo Pro, given that K6/K7/P2 use far more shades of gray?


Perhaps someone can share their experience and point me in the right direction.


Thank you in advance,


Feli


_______________________________________________
Feli di Giorgio - feli2@... - www.felidigiorgio.com

Re: Which Piezography system for Epson P800?

2019-08-28 by brian_downunda@...

You will face some interesting choices given your preferences and constraints.

As you probably know, K7 uses seven shades of ink, shade 1 being the darkest and shade 7 the lightest. There are two shade 1s - one for matte and one for gloss / semi-gloss. K6 uses the exact same inks but leaves out shade 7, and so the QTR curves are different because the six inks are used to cover the tonal range from black to white rather than seven. If you have K7 installed you can print K6. I've never been been able to find an image where I can see a difference between K7 and K6 prints.

P2 is K6, but with shade 1 for PK in the slot where shade 7 used to be. This means that when switching between MK and PK you don't have to switch cartridges. On smaller desktop printers like the P400 you need to pull one cartridge out and insert the other. On larger printers like the P600, P800 and beyond, you need to do the MK/PK switch. P2 means you never have to do this. So the P2 curves for MK are just K6 curves and the P2 curves for PK are K6 curves reconfigured to draw shade 1 from the yellow slot. P2 makes a lot of sense for those printing with both MK & PK, but is of no advantage if you only plan to print with one or the other.

Since you're only going to print on glossy / semi-gloss papers then the Pro inks have a huge advantage in that the gloss overcoat is applied at the same time as printing. This is called one-pass GO. K7 and its variants currently have a two-pass GO, which is a right pain. You print, and then you print the GO overcoat in a second pass. Things can go wrong and in any case I don't think that two-pass GO is as effective as one-pass. One-pass is a *huge* leap forward for Piezography on gloss / semi-gloss. Walker Blackwell has said that a one-pass version of K7 is under development, but it's been that way for a while so don't hold your breath.

However you won't get selenium from Pro inks. Pro inks have both warm and cool tonings, which you can blend and / or split tone. The only tonings available in Pro are those on the warm-cool axis. There is a selenium toned inkset for K7/K6/P2, but that means two-pass GO.

So this is the choice you currently face - one-pass GO or selenium?

I can't shed a lot of light on the Pro vs K7/K6/P2 question. From a little experience with Pro and much more with P2, I don't think you lose a lot with Pro. I honestly haven't seen an independent assessment of this. Most reports of Pro are either enthusiasts or closely associated with IJM. Now if Pro is as good as K7 etc, this calls into question why go Piezography rather than OEM (K3) if four shades are as good as six or seven? Good question. OEM-QTR-K3 is pretty good, esp on the P800. Part of the answer is that Pro isn't really K4, you're typically using both warm and cool inks in some combination in a print, and so Pro is laying down inks from seven channels. But there are still only four levels of tone. So go figure. There really isn't an answer to this question.

I opted to go Pro because I decided I wanted more control over toning. What you will find with K7/K6/P2 is that what appears to be a subtle toning on matte paper is quite a lot stronger on a gloss / semi-gloss paper. This is particularly true for Special Edition inks, and to a lesser extent with Selenium. With Pro, I can tweak the toning for PK papers to dial the effect down and get roughly the same effect on both types of paper.

I don't regard the P800 as a great printer for very intermittent use. My experience is that the Piezography inks settle without frequent use, and you will then have to waste a lot of ink by flushing it through the lines. There are nine lines and there's 10-15ml in each line between the cartridge and the print head. The same is true for hibernating the printer with Piezoflush. You've got to flush a lot of ink out to get the flush through, and then flush a lot of Piezoflush through to get the ink working. I honestly think that the P400 is a better option for intermittent use, unless you really need 17" wide rather than 13" wide. But as we discussed here recently, the smaller cartridges on the P400 are potentially more problematic than the larger carts on the P600 or P800, so again you face a choice.

For intermittent use you may be better with OEM, because my experience is that those inks sediment much, much slower when left idle. It is possible to simulate selenium with OEM inks - I have a QTR curve that does this.

I realise that you already knew some of this long rant, but I wrote a complete response for the benefit of other readers.

Re: Future of black and white inkjet printing, if any?

2019-08-28 by meilim@...

I use a SC-P600 with the very good QTRip on my iMac, running OSX Mojave... but because of the upgrade to Mojave, I have been getting messages that QTR is not optimised for the OS... ds anyone have a solution to this ? I have emailed the developer to ask, but in the meantime some advice would be most welcome.

I am new to this group

thanks in advance

Mei

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