Digital BW, The Print

Jim,

>I have... just purchased a
>1280 and the MIS FS-N inks based on this specific thread and the
>logic behind it.

Which thread?  Are you going to print the FS-N inks on an 1280 without the
Piezo driver?  If so, I have attached my recommendations as of 3/28, below.
Note, however, that this is a bit experimental.  I have yet to see prints
done this way.

>So now I am ready to load the inks into the
>cartridges and I am stumped.  Do I NOT use the photo magenta and
>photo cyan inks at all?

The problem with the FS inks in hextone machines when using the Epson driver
is that there really are no light, photo position inks.  The FS inksets were
designed to run with Piezo software, and that software does not use the
light/photo inks.  Rather, it uses the full-strength inks in those
positions.

So, if you bought a "set" of FS inks, then the light/photo inks should be
the same density as the full strength ink of the same color.  You may be
able to check this with swab of the inks on some paper.

I hope this, including my 3/8 post, below, helps.

Paul
http://www.PaulRoark.com
______________

How to print FS inks with Hextone printers and the Epson driver:

The FS inks are like Piezo inks and, in hextone machines, will work only
with Cone Editions PiezographyBW software -- UNLESS the ink positions are
altered.
Unlike the quad (4-ink) FS/Piezo systems, there is no way to control the
Epson driver from Photoshop to distribute the inks correctly with the inks
in the positions that Piezo uses (and that any current pre-loaded carts
use).

The "problem" with the hextone Piezo system is that the light ink positions
are not light ink.  They are the same density as the full-strength inks.
Thus, as the input value calls for darker inks, the Epson driver substitutes
the full strength ink for the "light" ink.  However, with ink densities that
are, in fact, the same, you end up with a flat stop.  There is probably no
way around this problem with the Epson driver and the standard Piezo/FS ink
positions.

If you want to use FS inks with a hextone machine, you have three choices.
First, buy a Piezo driver.  Second, buy a ColorByte ImagePrint 4 RIP (check
with that company first).  Third, change the ink positions and  use a simple
grayscale adjustment curve and workflow. Such a curve has been written and
supplied by Shilesh Jani.  The curve is named FS1280N3.acv.

"On Archival Matte and Photo Rag 308 gsm, the images are stunning" with the
FS-N inks according to Shilesh.

(Since I do not have a hextone machine yet, I have not been
able to test this curve and approach.  I will soon have a hextone (870) and
test and refine the approach.)

Here is the alternative FS-Hextone-Epson-driver ink positions I recommend as
of 3/28/02:


Black -- Use the MIS FS (or VM) black;

Cyan position -- Use FS cyan-position ink;

Light cyan position -- Use FS magenta-position ink;

Magenta position -- Use FS cyan-position ink;

Light magenta -- Use FS magenta-position ink;

Yellow -- Use FS yellow-position ink.  (The FS magenta-position ink may work
here also.  I'll test both of them.)

Print files in grayscale mode (no need to convert to RGB).  Have the ink set
to "color ink," however, to take full advantage of the smoothing effect of
all those hextone nozzles.  Apply the mild grayscale Photoshop image
adjustment curve FS1280N3.acv supplied by Shilesh. (You may want to a
modification of this curve to optimize your printer/paper combination.  The
mild grayscale curves are easy to adjust -- much easier than an RGB,
partitioned workflow.)

I think there is a very good chance that the FS inks in the above positions
in hextone printers will produce outstanding results.

Paul
http://www.PaulRoark.com

Thanks Paul,

I do not have a piezo driver.  I realize that this workflow is experimental but if seems to be a great place to start.
I will test swab the inks.  I am torn between taking advantage of member's previous experience and just sorting it out myself.  I will update with the results.

Regards,

Jim Tetlow




--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Paul Roark" <paul.roark@v...> wrote:

> Jim,
> 
> >I have... just purchased a
> >1280 and the MIS FS-N inks based on this specific thread and the
> >logic behind it.
> 
> Which thread?  Are you going to print the FS-N inks on an 1280 without the
> Piezo driver?  If so, I have attached my recommendations as of 3/28, below.
> Note, however, that this is a bit experimental.  I have yet to see prints
> done this way.
> 
> >So now I am ready to load the inks into the
> >cartridges and I am stumped.  Do I NOT use the photo magenta and
> >photo cyan inks at all?
> 
> The problem with the FS inks in hextone machines when using the Epson driver
> is that there really are no light, photo position inks.  The FS inksets were
> designed to run with Piezo software, and that software does not use the
> light/photo inks.  Rather, it uses the full-strength inks in those
> positions.
> 
> So, if you bought a "set" of FS inks, then the light/photo inks should be
> the same density as the full strength ink of the same color.  You may be
> able to check this with swab of the inks on some paper.
> 
> I hope this, including my 3/8 post, below, helps.
> 
> Paul
> http://www.PaulRoark.com
> ______________
> 
> How to print FS inks with Hextone printers and the Epson driver:
> 
> The FS inks are like Piezo inks and, in hextone machines, will work only
> with Cone Editions PiezographyBW software -- UNLESS the ink positions are
> altered.
> Unlike the quad (4-ink) FS/Piezo systems, there is no way to control the
> Epson driver from Photoshop to distribute the inks correctly with the inks
> in the positions that Piezo uses (and that any current pre-loaded carts
> use).
> 
> The "problem" with the hextone Piezo system is that the light ink positions
> are not light ink.  They are the same density as the full-strength inks.
> Thus, as the input value calls for darker inks, the Epson driver substitutes
> the full strength ink for the "light" ink.  However, with ink densities that
> are, in fact, the same, you end up with a flat stop.  There is probably no
> way around this problem with the Epson driver and the standard Piezo/FS ink
> positions.
> 
> If you want to use FS inks with a hextone machine, you have three choices.
> First, buy a Piezo driver.  Second, buy a ColorByte ImagePrint 4 RIP (check
> with that company first).  Third, change the ink positions and  use a simple
> grayscale adjustment curve and workflow. Such a curve has been written and
> supplied by Shilesh Jani.  The curve is named FS1280N3.acv.
> 
> "On Archival Matte and Photo Rag 308 gsm, the images are stunning" with the
> FS-N inks according to Shilesh.
> 
> (Since I do not have a hextone machine yet, I have not been
> able to test this curve and approach.  I will soon have a hextone (870) and
> test and refine the approach.)
> 
> Here is the alternative FS-Hextone-Epson-driver ink positions I recommend as
> of 3/28/02:
> 
> 
> Black -- Use the MIS FS (or VM) black;
> 
> Cyan position -- Use FS cyan-position ink;
> 
> Light cyan position -- Use FS magenta-position ink;
> 
> Magenta position -- Use FS cyan-position ink;
> 
> Light magenta -- Use FS magenta-position ink;
> 
> Yellow -- Use FS yellow-position ink.  (The FS magenta-position ink may work
> here also.  I'll test both of them.)
> 
> Print files in grayscale mode (no need to convert to RGB).  Have the ink set
> to "color ink," however, to take full advantage of the smoothing effect of
> all those hextone nozzles.  Apply the mild grayscale Photoshop image
> adjustment curve FS1280N3.acv supplied by Shilesh. (You may want to a
> modification of this curve to optimize your printer/paper combination.  The
> mild grayscale curves are easy to adjust -- much easier than an RGB,
> partitioned workflow.)
> 
> I think there is a very good chance that the FS inks in the above positions
> in hextone printers will produce outstanding results.
> 
> Paul
> http://www.PaulRoark.com

Paul,

The 21 step, and 0-255, 0-128, and 128-255 gradients printed on EAM 
are being FedExed to you today. I will be away all of next week, so 
please feel free to post your observations and recommendations on-
list.

The originator of this thread should know that using the FS-N inks in 
positions listed by MIS in not a good way to go without Piezo 
software, or other RIP. So it is imperative that that the photo cyan 
and photo magenta are loaded with the same "medium" density inks (the 
magenta ink). For those who don't know, the FS inks are as follows: 
cyan=dark, photo cyan=dark, magenta=medium, photo magenta=medium, and 
yellow=light. In any event, I would suggest they wait until after 
Paul has had a chance to examine my prints with this method.

Shilesh

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Paul Roark" 
<paul.roark@v...> wrote:
> Jim,
> 
> >I have... just purchased a
> >1280 and the MIS FS-N inks based on this specific thread and the
> >logic behind it.
> 
> Which thread?  Are you going to print the FS-N inks on an 1280 
without the
> Piezo driver?  If so, I have attached my recommendations as of 
3/28, below.
> Note, however, that this is a bit experimental.  I have yet to see 
prints
> done this way.
> 
> >So now I am ready to load the inks into the
> >cartridges and I am stumped.  Do I NOT use the photo magenta and
> >photo cyan inks at all?
> 
> The problem with the FS inks in hextone machines when using the 
Epson driver
> is that there really are no light, photo position inks.  The FS 
inksets were
> designed to run with Piezo software, and that software does not use 
the
> light/photo inks.  Rather, it uses the full-strength inks in those
> positions.
> 
> So, if you bought a "set" of FS inks, then the light/photo inks 
should be
> the same density as the full strength ink of the same color.  You 
may be
> able to check this with swab of the inks on some paper.
> 
> I hope this, including my 3/8 post, below, helps.
> 
> Paul
> http://www.PaulRoark.com
> ______________
> 
> How to print FS inks with Hextone printers and the Epson driver:
> 
> The FS inks are like Piezo inks and, in hextone machines, will work 
only
> with Cone Editions PiezographyBW software -- UNLESS the ink 
positions are
> altered.
> Unlike the quad (4-ink) FS/Piezo systems, there is no way to 
control the
> Epson driver from Photoshop to distribute the inks correctly with 
the inks
> in the positions that Piezo uses (and that any current pre-loaded 
carts
> use).
> 
> The "problem" with the hextone Piezo system is that the light ink 
positions
> are not light ink.  They are the same density as the full-strength 
inks.
> Thus, as the input value calls for darker inks, the Epson driver 
substitutes
> the full strength ink for the "light" ink.  However, with ink 
densities that
> are, in fact, the same, you end up with a flat stop.  There is 
probably no
> way around this problem with the Epson driver and the standard 
Piezo/FS ink
> positions.
> 
> If you want to use FS inks with a hextone machine, you have three 
choices.
> First, buy a Piezo driver.  Second, buy a ColorByte ImagePrint 4 
RIP (check
> with that company first).  Third, change the ink positions and  use 
a simple
> grayscale adjustment curve and workflow. Such a curve has been 
written and
> supplied by Shilesh Jani.  The curve is named FS1280N3.acv.
> 
> "On Archival Matte and Photo Rag 308 gsm, the images are stunning" 
with the
> FS-N inks according to Shilesh.
> 
> (Since I do not have a hextone machine yet, I have not been
> able to test this curve and approach.  I will soon have a hextone 
(870) and
> test and refine the approach.)
> 
> Here is the alternative FS-Hextone-Epson-driver ink positions I 
recommend as
> of 3/28/02:
> 
> 
> Black -- Use the MIS FS (or VM) black;
> 
> Cyan position -- Use FS cyan-position ink;
> 
> Light cyan position -- Use FS magenta-position ink;
> 
> Magenta position -- Use FS cyan-position ink;
> 
> Light magenta -- Use FS magenta-position ink;
> 
> Yellow -- Use FS yellow-position ink.  (The FS magenta-position ink 
may work
> here also.  I'll test both of them.)
> 
> Print files in grayscale mode (no need to convert to RGB).  Have 
the ink set
> to "color ink," however, to take full advantage of the smoothing 
effect of
> all those hextone nozzles.  Apply the mild grayscale Photoshop image
> adjustment curve FS1280N3.acv supplied by Shilesh. (You may want to 
a
> modification of this curve to optimize your printer/paper 
combination.  The
> mild grayscale curves are easy to adjust -- much easier than an RGB,
> partitioned workflow.)
> 
> I think there is a very good chance that the FS inks in the above 
positions

> in hextone printers will produce outstanding results.
> 
> Paul
> http://www.PaulRoark.com