Digital BW, The Print

Shilesh,

>...
>I did rough density measurents (scanner based) on Epson color dyes
>and the FS Quads, and I believe the FS inks loaded in the following
>order will require very small curves adjustments (I will try them in
>a couple of days):

>CcMmYK (inks positions) = CYCYMK (FS inks) or Dark, Light, Dark,
>Light, Medium, Black. This is slightly different from my current ink
>positions of CcMmYK = CMCMYK.

I would think the C to Y difference might be a bit on the large side.  Did
you ever try the C & M system with M also in the yellow position?  With all
3 jets firing M in the highlights I was guessing that it might be too dark.

At any rate, I'll be curious what you find with the new ink positions.

Paul
http://www.PaulRoark.com

_________________________

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Paul Roark"
<paul.roark@v...> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> For 1270 and 870 owners, a new set of Photoshop image adjustment
curves has
> been posted in the Files section of this forum.  The Files section
is at:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
>
> From there go to:  > Ink Sets, reviews and techniques > MIS
Variable Mix >
> 870 and 1270 Curves
>
> Martin has put all the curves in a Zip file that also includes a
text file
> with the setting information.
>
> These curves use different settings than the older 1270 curves.
The first
> difference is that the Epson driver color management setting
is, "No Color
> Adjustment."  So the sliders are disabled.  But, the trade-off is
that the
> curves should be cross-platform. (The names have a prominent "NCA"
in them
> to remind me and others of this change.)
>
> I wrote the curves on an 870-PC platform.  So, I'd be most curious
how they
> work on a 1270-Mac platform.
>
> These curves also use paper-type setting of Matte Heavy Weight, not
Photo
> Quality Ink Jet.  The curves, as usual, were written for Epson
> Archival/Enhanced Matte.
>
> The curves also are written for Adobe RGB (1998) working space.  (I
set the
> Color Settings (under "Edit") first to PS 5 defaults and then just
change
> the RGB working space to Adobe RGB (1998).)
>
> I've re-named the "mw" curve the "nw" curve.  When this curve is
used with
> EAM, the print is initially dead neutral in the mid-ranges --
according to
> the X-Rite densitometer I used to write the curves.  (Of course,
the paper
> tone affects the highlights, and the warm black affects the deep
shadows.)
> So, the "nw" curve starts neutral but will warm to medium warm.
>
> Note also that one of the curves is a grayscale printing curve.
There is no
> RGB mode conversion in the workflow for this curve.  Just apply the
curve
> and print.  (Be careful not to save an altered file, which will not
be as
> obvious as in the RGB workflows.)  The print is 0.01 unit cool in
the
> lighter tones and a bit cooler in the shadows, with a maximum 0.03
cool at
> 65-70%.  (These modern, hextone Epsons clearly do not need
partitioning

> curves to get smooth highlights.)
>
> Let me know how these new curves work on your 1270s.
>
> Paul
> http://www.PaulRoark.com

Paul,

I never tried your alternate inks position suggestion - I was too 
busy printing photographs as opposed to test strips (finally!) to 
mess with the work flow. But the engineer in me is always looking for 
a good experiment, so I will give it a go. The guys at LincolnInks 
have been suggesting a tri-tone solution without partitioning for 
quite a while now, and that may well be the way to go!

Shilesh

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Paul Roark" 
<paul.roark@v...> wrote:
> Shilesh,
> 
> >...
> >I did rough density measurents (scanner based) on Epson color dyes
> >and the FS Quads, and I believe the FS inks loaded in the following
> >order will require very small curves adjustments (I will try them 
in
> >a couple of days):
> 
> >CcMmYK (inks positions) = CYCYMK (FS inks) or Dark, Light, Dark,
> >Light, Medium, Black. This is slightly different from my current 
ink
> >positions of CcMmYK = CMCMYK.
> 
> I would think the C to Y difference might be a bit on the large 
side.  Did
> you ever try the C & M system with M also in the yellow position?  
With all
> 3 jets firing M in the highlights I was guessing that it might be 
too dark.
> 
> At any rate, I'll be curious what you find with the new ink 
positions.
> 
> Paul
> http://www.PaulRoark.com
> 
> _________________________
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Paul Roark"
> <paul.roark@v...> wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > For 1270 and 870 owners, a new set of Photoshop image adjustment
> curves has
> > been posted in the Files section of this forum.  The Files section
> is at:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
> >
> > From there go to:  > Ink Sets, reviews and techniques > MIS
> Variable Mix >
> > 870 and 1270 Curves
> >
> > Martin has put all the curves in a Zip file that also includes a
> text file
> > with the setting information.
> >
> > These curves use different settings than the older 1270 curves.
> The first
> > difference is that the Epson driver color management setting
> is, "No Color
> > Adjustment."  So the sliders are disabled.  But, the trade-off is
> that the
> > curves should be cross-platform. (The names have a prominent "NCA"
> in them
> > to remind me and others of this change.)
> >
> > I wrote the curves on an 870-PC platform.  So, I'd be most curious
> how they
> > work on a 1270-Mac platform.
> >
> > These curves also use paper-type setting of Matte Heavy Weight, 
not
> Photo
> > Quality Ink Jet.  The curves, as usual, were written for Epson
> > Archival/Enhanced Matte.
> >
> > The curves also are written for Adobe RGB (1998) working space.  
(I
> set the
> > Color Settings (under "Edit") first to PS 5 defaults and then just
> change
> > the RGB working space to Adobe RGB (1998).)
> >
> > I've re-named the "mw" curve the "nw" curve.  When this curve is
> used with
> > EAM, the print is initially dead neutral in the mid-ranges --
> according to
> > the X-Rite densitometer I used to write the curves.  (Of course,
> the paper
> > tone affects the highlights, and the warm black affects the deep
> shadows.)
> > So, the "nw" curve starts neutral but will warm to medium warm.
> >
> > Note also that one of the curves is a grayscale printing curve.
> There is no
> > RGB mode conversion in the workflow for this curve.  Just apply 
the
> curve
> > and print.  (Be careful not to save an altered file, which will 
not

> be as
> > obvious as in the RGB workflows.)  The print is 0.01 unit cool in
> the
> > lighter tones and a bit cooler in the shadows, with a maximum 0.03
> cool at
> > 65-70%.  (These modern, hextone Epsons clearly do not need
> partitioning
> > curves to get smooth highlights.)
> >
> > Let me know how these new curves work on your 1270s.
> >
> > Paul
> > http://www.PaulRoark.com

On my 1270, the new curves give me significantly better transitions in 
the darker tonalities...  It is apparent on large expanses of 
 darkeneing skies (one example).

THANKS FOR ALL THE HARD WORK PAUL!!!

[Keith]
 




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Paul Roark wrote:

> Keith,
>
> Do you use a Mac or PC?
>
>
PC, unfortunately, in this case..


[Keith]
 
 




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Keith,

Do you use a Mac or PC?

Paul


>On my 1270, the new curves give me significantly better transitions in 
>the darker tonalities...  It is apparent on large expanses of 
>darkeneing skies (one example).

>THANKS FOR ALL THE HARD WORK PAUL!!!

[Keith]

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Editor P.O.V. Image Service" <editor@p...> 
wrote:

I'm on a Mac with an 870 and the new curves are definitely better than the old ones 
(ver. 6). All curves are much smoother, especially in the 70-100% range. I would say 
that the cool curve is perfect; the neutral curve is almost perfect, but it has a small 
bit of banding at about the 70-75% tone; the nw curve has a little bump around the 
45%, and another around 75-80%, and still another around 85-90%; and the warm 
curve is a little worse (but still much better than the old curve), especially around 
45%, 70-75%, and 80-85%. 

Overall the curves are smoother, the color is relatively evenly spaced from cool to 
warm, and the separation, particularly in the 90-100% range is more even than 
before. Tyler's Zees look better... now I can see the next to last darkest Z against its 
background.

Paul, thank you!

Ed