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Using Epson 1280 to get good B&W prints

Using Epson 1280 to get good B&W prints

2002-07-17 by daintreeriver2002

I am a serious amateur photographer and have invested in quite a bit 
of computer/digital equipment in the past 6 months in order to set up 
a digital darkroom.  I'm happy with my color prints, but not so with 
my black and whites.  I would greatly appreciate any tips or sources 
of information to successfully print black and white photographs.  
I'm hoping to not have to buy a lot of new equipment, but obviously 
expect to have to buy different supplies (inks and papers)  and 
perhaps software.  Right now, I've been working from black and white 
negatives that I've scanned, but in the future I'd like to primarily 
shoot new photos using my digital camera.   Here is a synopsis of my 
current equipment set-up:

Nikon CoolPix 5000 Digital Camera
Nikon Super CoolScan 4000
PhotoShop 7 (I just bought this and am definitely not a PhotoShop 
expert yet)
Epson 1280 Photo Stylus Printer.

Thanks in advance

RE: [Digital BW] Using Epson 1280 to get good B&W prints

2002-07-17 by Steadman Uhlich

My best advice:

Read the forum archives.  There are many suggestions (lengthy) posted
regarding starting with a new setup for quadtones using similar equipment
(in fact the very same 1280).  There has already been much written
specifically addressing a newbie request for suggested inks, workflow,
printers, papers, software etc...

It is all there...for free.

But of course you want something simple eh?

My simple suggestion:  Buy Piezography software and PiezoTones ink from
inkjetmall.com to get started.  Relatively easy way to get going.  Check
their website for loads of info on the process and all the goodies you need
to buy. Simple.

Good luck,

Steadman
Show quoted textHide quoted text
  -----Original Message-----
  From: daintreeriver2002 [mailto:workmantx@...]
  Sent: Wednesday, July 17, 2002 7:26 AM
  To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
  Subject: [Digital BW] Using Epson 1280 to get good B&W prints


  I am a serious amateur photographer and have invested in quite a bit
  of computer/digital equipment in the past 6 months in order to set up
  a digital darkroom.  I'm happy with my color prints, but not so with
  my black and whites.  I would greatly appreciate any tips or sources
  of information to successfully print black and white photographs.
  I'm hoping to not have to buy a lot of new equipment, but obviously
  expect to have to buy different supplies (inks and papers)  and
  perhaps software.  Right now, I've been working from black and white
  negatives that I've scanned, but in the future I'd like to primarily
  shoot new photos using my digital camera.   Here is a synopsis of my
  current equipment set-up:

  Nikon CoolPix 5000 Digital Camera
  Nikon Super CoolScan 4000
  PhotoShop 7 (I just bought this and am definitely not a PhotoShop
  expert yet)
  Epson 1280 Photo Stylus Printer.

  Thanks in advance



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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: Using Epson 1280 to get good B&W prints

2002-07-17 by jimhayes361

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "daintreeriver2002" 
<workmantx@a...> wrote:
> I am a serious amateur photographer and have invested in quite a bit 
> of computer/digital equipment in the past 6 months in order to set 
up 
> a digital darkroom.  I'm happy with my color prints, but not so with 
> my black and whites.  I would greatly appreciate any tips or sources 
> of information to successfully print black and white photographs.  

Experience. Yours, not mine.

ALL inksets/papers will have advantages/disadvantages, and what's 
more, they vary from person to person. You could read posts going back 
on this and other groups, but even that would be colored by personal 
bias (even mine<g>), conjecture and lack of experimental information. 
Also, new products are coming out now, namely the 2200 printer and the 
new Piezo inks.

The only thing I MIGHT suggest is that something you like now may 
change in six months, either because something better comes out, or an 
unseen problem with your existing setup arises. Sometimes the problems 
are blatent and/or occur immediately, but many times they are subtle 
and you don't notice a change in your printing quality right away. 
Often you have to jump on a bandwagon before the system has been out 
for half a year...oh well. Part of my "workflow" is to try as best I 
can to be observant about the current product I use and be flexible to 
changing products- not always easy to do.

In this light, although much more expensive, trying out carts before 
going to a plumbing system of CFS/CIS might be wise.

I'm sorry I don't mean to sound cynical or scare you away or confuse 
you. Actually this is an optimistic time in printing, simply because 
so many choices are out there. It's just that there is no instant, 
tidy, consistantly superior, undisputed sucess (some will dispute 
this<g>)- it's try and tweak. And INVESTIGATE for yourself.

I will however congraulate you on your printer choice, I am happy with 
my 1280 despite the chip nonsense.
Jim H.

Re: [Digital BW] Using Epson 1280 to get good B&W prints

2002-07-17 by Robert Morrison

On 7/17/02 6:44 AM, "Steadman Uhlich" <steadmanuhlich@...> wrote:

> My simple suggestion:  Buy Piezography software and PiezoTones ink from
> inkjetmall.com to get started.  Relatively easy way to get going.  Check
> their website for loads of info on the process and all the goodies you need
> to buy. Simple.

But you will need to buy another printer...because these are separate inks
and I'm assuming that you will still want to print color with your existing
1280?  In my opinion you can't print good neutral BW with epson 1280 OEM
inks...you might be able to with a 2200...but they haven't officially come
out yet.  I agree with Steadman, buy a 1280, Piezo software and perhaps the
Selenium toned Piezotones...I think that is the best introduction to quad BW
printing...oh and get yourself a bunch of Epson Enhanced Matte to start
printing on...don't use Epson Heavyweight (which is fine for the 1280 inks),
Epson Enhanced Matte (or Epson Archival Matte) are made for pigment
inks...which the Piezotones are.


Robert

Re: [Digital BW] Re: Using Epson 1280 to get good B&W prints

2002-07-17 by Bonita Rice

Why waste money on printing something that you really
want to keep on your printer. Upload it to a
professional lab and let them do the work. That is the
reason I love digital. You only keep the best and then
you print only the ones you really want to keep. It
has worked for me. I grayscale and then do the other
stps such as contrast and brightness. I just received
back from Kodak a black and white of my son in law and
it is great. I also tinted a picture of my niece and
it turned out great. I have a new Epson printer but it
seems I can't consistantly print the quality that I
like. My pictures always look as good or better when
they come back from the lab. 
I though that I could be happy with a printer, but
have spend more money than it would have taken to send
them to a good lab. I occasionaly do use the printer
to do something for a friend in a hurry. I have a Fuji
6900 and my pictures are excellent quality. I can
enlarge up to a 30x40. 
Just want to put my thoughts on this on the message
board. 
BJ
--- jimhayes361 <jimhayes@...> wrote:
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y...,
> "daintreeriver2002" 
> <workmantx@a...> wrote:
> > I am a serious amateur photographer and have
> invested in quite a bit 
> > of computer/digital equipment in the past 6 months
> in order to set 
> up 
> > a digital darkroom.  I'm happy with my color
> prints, but not so with 
> > my black and whites.  I would greatly appreciate
> any tips or sources 
> > of information to successfully print black and
> white photographs.  
> 
> Experience. Yours, not mine.
> 
> ALL inksets/papers will have
> advantages/disadvantages, and what's 
> more, they vary from person to person. You could
> read posts going back 
> on this and other groups, but even that would be
> colored by personal 
> bias (even mine<g>), conjecture and lack of
> experimental information. 
> Also, new products are coming out now, namely the
> 2200 printer and the 
> new Piezo inks.
> 
> The only thing I MIGHT suggest is that something you
> like now may 
> change in six months, either because something
> better comes out, or an 
> unseen problem with your existing setup arises.
> Sometimes the problems 
> are blatent and/or occur immediately, but many times
> they are subtle 
> and you don't notice a change in your printing
> quality right away. 
> Often you have to jump on a bandwagon before the
> system has been out 
> for half a year...oh well. Part of my "workflow" is
> to try as best I 
> can to be observant about the current product I use
> and be flexible to 
> changing products- not always easy to do.
> 
> In this light, although much more expensive, trying
> out carts before 
> going to a plumbing system of CFS/CIS might be wise.
> 
> I'm sorry I don't mean to sound cynical or scare you
> away or confuse 
> you. Actually this is an optimistic time in
> printing, simply because 
> so many choices are out there. It's just that there
> is no instant, 
> tidy, consistantly superior, undisputed sucess (some
> will dispute 
> this<g>)- it's try and tweak. And INVESTIGATE for
> yourself.
> 
> I will however congraulate you on your printer
> choice, I am happy with 
> my 1280 despite the chip nonsense.
> Jim H.
> 
> 
> ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> 
> Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files,
> Bookmarks, Polls and other resources as they are
> often being updated. The page is at:
> 
>
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
> 
> Please follow these basic guidelines:
> - Include your full name with your message.
> - Include the address of your website, if you have
> one.
> - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of
> earlier messages to keep them short.
> - As the topic of a thread changes remember to
> change the subject header.
> - Good manners are required at all time. No personal
> attacks or "flames."
> - Complete your Yahoo profile.
> - Before posting a question, search the message
> archives and the various resources on the homepage. 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ 
> 
> 


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RE: [Digital BW] Using Epson 1280 to get good B&W prints

2002-07-17 by Frank J Mares

I too had some problems with B&W printing with somewhat similar set-up. I
dedicated my 1280 to B&W only via Piezography and now WN Piezotones and I've
never looked back. I'm so happy with the WN piezotone, that I have ordered a
second 1280 to dedicate to the Selenium Piezotone inks. I also have a 7600
Epson printer ad a 2000P(soon to be sold) as well as a 785 EPX for card
stock. The most satisfying work is still with the Piezo set-up. The 1280 has
been rock solid.
  Frank
  Francis James Mares Photoraphy



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] Using Epson 1280 to get good B&W prints

2002-07-17 by thinh360

Hi Frank,
So the 7600 does not print b&w as nicely as the 1280 with a real 
quadtone inkset?
Thanks,
Thinh Le

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., "Frank J Mares" 
<fjmcsu@w...> wrote:
>    I too had some problems with B&W printing with somewhat similar 
set-up. I
> dedicated my 1280 to B&W only via Piezography and now WN Piezotones 
and I've
> never looked back. I'm so happy with the WN piezotone, that I have 
ordered a
> second 1280 to dedicate to the Selenium Piezotone inks. I also have 
a 7600
> Epson printer ad a 2000P(soon to be sold) as well as a 785 EPX for 
card
> stock. The most satisfying work is still with the Piezo set-up. The 
1280 has
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> been rock solid.
>   Frank
>   Francis James Mares Photoraphy
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

RE: Using Epson 1280 to get good B&W prints

2002-07-18 by Mitch Alland

To: "daintreeriver2002" <workmantx@...>

>I'm happy with my color prints, but not so with 
>my black and whites.  I would greatly appreciate any tips or sources 
>of information to successfully print black and white
>photographs.

I had a long quest for good B&W prints, starting with a Kodak dye-sub (streaking in uniformly light-colred areas like skies) and than a Fuji Pictrography 4000 (compressed dark tones and highlights), until I moved to Piezography. I find that the Piezography software gives the best gradation and smoothest tones that I have seen. I did find the Piezography inks a little too warm, and you may want to try the new Selenium Piezotones.

My recommendation would be to get another 1280 and dedicate it to Piezography with a CIS. Alternatively, you may want to get the new 2200 for color (because print life is suppposed to be 80 years) and use your 1280 for Piezography, that is if the color gamut of the 2200 really turns out to be as goood as that of the 1280.

Another possible complication: the new 2100 is supposed to have a facility for making neutral B&W prints that are not possible with the 1280 with the original color inks. You could wait to see how the 2100 performs on B&W, but I am sceptical whether it will have the smoothness of the Piezography driver, particulalrly in the mid-tones. But if you want good information on how the 21000 really performs on B&W, you may have too wait until you can see prints with your owjn eyes, or until some people like Martin Wesley write a review. You can't trust just any review, on the Luminous Landscape forum, for example, when the 1280 first came out, there were several people raving about how it produced "perfectly neutral" B&W right out of the box.

--Mitch/Bangkok

RE: [Digital BW] Using Epson 1280 to get good B&W prints

2002-07-18 by Frank J Mares

Thinh
  At this point I prefer the the Piezo 1280 for the smaller size prints on
Photo rag, but then again I'm just beginning to use the 7600 so time will
tell as I get more comfortable with the matte black prints on the 7600 with
different paper combo's including the Hahn Photo rag.
  Frank
  Francis James Mares Photography



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: Using Epson 1280 to get good B&W prints

2002-07-18 by markhahn2000

A good friend of mine purchased a 1280 and put a media street (?) CIS 
into it.  He mainly prints color, but after calibrating everything 
with the Monaco system was able to print out stunning b&w prints, 
which aside from the color shift, were much better than my MIS VM 
1180 prints... but I decided to stick with the 1180 & VM quadtones 
because I didn't like the color shift.  ...there is also that 
longitivity issue.

mark

>...
I'm happy with my color prints, but not so with 
> > my black and whites.  I would greatly appreciate any tips or 
sources 
> > of information to successfully print black and white photographs
...

1280 problems

2002-07-18 by Greg Phelps

Has anyone had this problem with their 1280

Mine is printing with a slight ghost of ink printing outside the image area
in the paper white border around the outside of the image.

It never did this when it was new. It just started about four months ago.
the image seems fine it is just the spray of ink outside the image area is
driving me nuts.

Epson has proved to be worthless as far as help with this problem. Today I
received an exchange printer and guess what the same problem. It has to be
software.

I downloaded their new driver for Mac from their website. Same problem.

Paper and resolution don't have any effect. subject matter has no effect.

Greg

--

Gregory James Phelps
Gregory James Phelps Photography
2334 Boca Chica #600
Brownsville, TX 78521

Web: http://www.gjphelps.com
http://www.gjphelps.com/currentwork
email: greg@...

Ph. 956-546-3700
Fx. 956-541-5264

Re: [Digital BW] Using Epson 1280 to get good B&W prints

2002-07-19 by Ken Carney

I have a similar setup, except an Epson 1270.  I get very good neutral b&w prints on Epson media by applying a color correction immediately before printing, not saved with the image in the likely event Epson decides to change ink formulation again, or the Chinese plant decides to turn out different ink from the Mexican plant, etc. The current correction (your 1280 will be different in all likelihood) is, from left to right, -2, 0, +2 in shadow, mid and highlight (Image>adjust>color balance).  When you get the right tweak, just make a PS Action so you only have to hit one button to correct.  This is of course after having calibrated the monitor as best you can.  The prints, usually on Epson Radiant White watercolor paper, show no color shift and little if any metamerism (my inspection light is 5000K, but they seem OK in any reasonable light).  Hope this helps.  BTW, I have the digital camera bug also, perhaps the new "Leica".  The quality of 35mm scanned on my Nikon 4000ED is obviously superior (even better, 8x10 negs scanned on the Linotype-Hell), but the lure of an instant pic is strong ("So, Dr. Land, you claim to have a machine that will make instant pictures, do you?").

  --Ken Carney
Show quoted textHide quoted text
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: daintreeriver2002 
  To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Wednesday, July 17, 2002 7:25 AM
  Subject: [Digital BW] Using Epson 1280 to get good B&W prints


  I am a serious amateur photographer and have invested in quite a bit 
  of computer/digital equipment in the past 6 months in order to set up 
  a digital darkroom.  I'm happy with my color prints, but not so with 
  my black and whites.  I would greatly appreciate any tips or sources 
  of information to successfully print black and white photographs.  
  I'm hoping to not have to buy a lot of new equipment, but obviously 
  expect to have to buy different supplies (inks and papers)  and 
  perhaps software.  Right now, I've been working from black and white 
  negatives that I've scanned, but in the future I'd like to primarily 
  shoot new photos using my digital camera.   Here is a synopsis of my 
  current equipment set-up:

  Nikon CoolPix 5000 Digital Camera
  Nikon Super CoolScan 4000
  PhotoShop 7 (I just bought this and am definitely not a PhotoShop 
  expert yet)
  Epson 1280 Photo Stylus Printer.

  Thanks in advance



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              ADVERTISEMENT
             
       

  Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, Bookmarks, Polls and other resources as they are often being updated. The page is at:

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  Please follow these basic guidelines:
  - Include your full name with your message.
  - Include the address of your website, if you have one.
  - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep them short.
  - As the topic of a thread changes remember to change the subject header.
  - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or "flames."
  - Complete your Yahoo profile.
  - Before posting a question, search the message archives and the various resources on the homepage. 




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