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Digital BW, The Print

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RE: [Digital BW] Grain drives PiezoTone mad

RE: [Digital BW] Grain drives PiezoTone mad

2002-09-26 by Jonah, Jim

This may be unrelated, however, it reminds of my days in the pre-press
world trying to get smooth gradations out of Illustrator/Photoshop
files. 
 
When we used a 150 lpi screen we could see the banding, but when we
lowered the screen to 100 lpi the banding when away (granted it's a
courser screen, but it looked better than the banding did).
 
You mentioned that the Cone driver is imaging at 720 dpi and the Epson
is at 360 dpi. In some cases a "lower" resolution is better.
 
Not sure if this helps, but it was an eye opener when I was first
learning about the differences between continuous tone and screened
printing...
 
Jim
Show quoted textHide quoted text
	-----Original Message-----
	From: Peter Baumbach [mailto:info@...] 
	Sent: Wednesday, September 25, 2002 8:39 PM
	To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
	Cc: Nij; piezobw@...
	Subject: [Digital BW] Grain drives PiezoTone mad
	
	
	I am currently printing a portfolio for a friend. She
photographed nudes on
	35 mm Tri-X. The PiezoTone prints look posterized in the
midtones (like a
	print that was not totally fixed) , the transitions from the
midtones to the
	darker skin tones are much too hard. Because I just started with
PiezoTone I
	thought it was my fault and checked everything again and again
with no
	improvements. But today I tried Woolfs workflow and the Epson
driver. And
	voila: the problems are solved although the highlights are not
as dotfree as
	with the Piezo driver (under a magnifier). But thats not a
problem with
	grainy negatives...
	
	In my opinion the holy 21 step wedge test does not show the real
problems
	unless you are exclusively working with large format cameras and
ASA 100
	films or digital cameras. My assumption now is that the piezo
driver has
	difficulties with interpreting noisy pixels. And you all can
proof this if
	you use the 21 step wedge and add a small amount of noise that
is more or
	less in the range of a 35 mm 400 ASA film. Then the tonal
transitions being
	smooth when printing the step wedge straight become totally
different. In
	the range of 35% to 50% you can find posterization, from 50% to
60% there is
	an artificial lumpy structure not related to the noise, from 65%
to 70%
	again some posterization, from 70% to 100% again a too noisy
lumpy structure
	(but less pronounced than in the 50 to 60% range). Making the
same
	experiment with the Epson driver and Woolfs workflow does not
show this
	phenomenon.
	
	If it is the grain that disturbs the piezo driver interpretation
of density
	then this would explain why some people reported problems with
posterization
	and bad skin tones and others did not mention it at all although
the product
	is long enough in the market (btw: who tested fading before
launching
	PiezoTone?? Should have been noticed before as well.).
	
	Any comments?
	
	Peter Baumbach
	Fine Art Photography Munich
	
	
	
	[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
	
	
	
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: [Digital BW] Grain drives PiezoTone mad

2002-09-26 by Bob Frost

Jim,

I get the opposite. With my 1290 if I use the 1440 dpi setting I get
microbanding, while if I use the 2880 dpi setting everything is wonderfully
smooth. Only just visible by eye, but quite an amazing difference under a
lens.

Bob Frost.

----- Original Message -----
Show quoted textHide quoted text
From: "Jonah, Jim" <jim.jonah@...>


>
> You mentioned that the Cone driver is imaging at 720 dpi and the Epson
> is at 360 dpi. In some cases a "lower" resolution is better.

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