Digital BW, The Print

Sorry to inject a total newbee question, but here goes my background 
and question:

Background:  About 15 years ago I did quite a bit of amateur B&W 
photography and processing.  I used primarily Pan-X and Tri-X 35 mm 
but also dabbled a bit with Technical Pan 35mm and made a few 5x7 
negatives as well.  I printed mostly on Illford non-RC papers, 
mostly 11x14 and 8x10s.  Due to time and flexibility constraints, 
darkroom work is not an option.  I got an Epson 750 printer some 
time back and have used it to make very acceptable 5x7 color prints 
from scanned negatives and digital images.  However, I can't seem to 
get an acceptable B&W image no matter what combination of things I 
try.  They all have rather pronounced dot patterns.  Until today, I 
had assumed this was unavoidable, but I read an article today my 
Clayton Jones (who posts here) that makes me have hope that I may be 
able to get a good print.  I have isolated the issue as coming from 
the printer since the dot pattern is not evident in the on-screen 
image.  I am using Photoshop and have tried printing to the Epson 
750 using color and black only on Epson consumer-grade photo paper, 
but get basically the same degree of "dot patterning".  For B&W 
images printed with the full inkset, I had assumed that is was a 
result of having only a limited number of greys possible, but now I 
am not sure.  Of course, this would be a problem with black only 
since there is only one shade, but the article my Mr. Jones 
indicated that the problem is not as pronounced as I seem to be 
experiencing if one knows how to print properlym,even with black 
only.  I can be fairly picky, but am willing to accept some degree 
of imperfection, since darkroom printing is not an option.  I would 
have been satisfied paying a service to do my B&W printing but I 
can't find a service that does greyscale printing of digital images, 
although there are several acceptable ones for color now.

Question:  Can anyone suggest a some combination of 
ink/paper/software that would give a reasonable point-of-departure 
for getting reasonable amateur-grade B&W prints suitable for 
matting? 

Ideally, I would like a solution that would use an inkset that would 
not require a dedicated printer (that is, not a greys-only inkset) 
and would not require buying another printer or expensive printer 
drivers.  However, this may not be possible.  I can live with 
imperfection to some degree (as subjective as that is).

Thanks in advance for any help.  I'll check over the next couple of 
days to see if anyone has any suggestions.

Hello pfrym,

>...read an article today by Clayton Jones that makes me have 
>hope that I may be able to get a good print.  

>I am using Photoshop and have tried printing to the Epson 
> 750 using color and black only on Epson consumer-grade photo paper, 
> but get basically the same degree of "dot patterning".  

>...but the article my Mr. Jones indicated that the problem 
>is not as pronounced as I seem to be experiencing 

Without seeing your prints it's hard to know what kind of dots you're
getting.  It may be that the 750 is an older model which prints larger
dots (anybody know?).  My only experience has been with an 870 which
is a 6-ink model that prints 4 picoliter dots at 1440 dpi, so
everything I said about BO printing is based on that.  I mentioned in
the article that older printers may not do as well.  So I would check
out the 750 specs for that.


> Ideally, I would like a solution that would use an inkset that
>would not require a dedicated printer (that is, not a greys-only
>inkset) and would not require buying another printer or expensive 
>printer drivers.  

Both of these can be achieved with BO printing.


>However, this may not be possible.  I can live with 
> imperfection to some degree (as subjective as that is).

Before jumping to any conclusions I think the first thing would be to
determine if the 750 prints 4 picoliter dots at 1440 dpi.  If it does,
then perhaps even those dots are too much for your taste.  You can
also get a sample high quality BO print to see what BO is capable of
and compare it to yours.  If the 750 does print the small dots but
still doesn't look good, it's possible that the driver is to blame. 
If the 750 isn't capable of good BO work then you can decide what to
do next.  At least you'll know what's possible and can decide if it's
worth it to buy a new printer to get what you want.

Regards,
Clayton


Info on black and white digital printing at    
http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm

The Epson Photo 750 is an "older" 6 color printer (as printer 
technology goes; I think it came out in '99 or so).  It has a 
maximum resolution of 720 x 1400 and a 6 picoliter dot size.   It is 
possible I can get images close to those you seem to be getting with 
BO printing on the 870.  I plan to fool with this some this 
evening.  If I can't get something reasonable, I'll be back.  Thanks 
for the info.

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Clayton Jones 
<cj@c...>" <cj@c...> wrote:
> Hello pfrym,
> 
> >...read an article today by Clayton Jones that makes me have 
> >hope that I may be able to get a good print.  
> 
> >I am using Photoshop and have tried printing to the Epson 
> > 750 using color and black only on Epson consumer-grade photo 
paper, 
> > but get basically the same degree of "dot patterning".  
> 
> >...but the article my Mr. Jones indicated that the problem 
> >is not as pronounced as I seem to be experiencing 
> 
> Without seeing your prints it's hard to know what kind of dots 
you're
> getting.  It may be that the 750 is an older model which prints 
larger
> dots (anybody know?).  My only experience has been with an 870 
which
> is a 6-ink model that prints 4 picoliter dots at 1440 dpi, so
> everything I said about BO printing is based on that.  I mentioned 
in
> the article that older printers may not do as well.  So I would 
check
> out the 750 specs for that.
> 
> 
> > Ideally, I would like a solution that would use an inkset that
> >would not require a dedicated printer (that is, not a greys-only
> >inkset) and would not require buying another printer or expensive 
> >printer drivers.  
> 
> Both of these can be achieved with BO printing.
> 
> 
> >However, this may not be possible.  I can live with 
> > imperfection to some degree (as subjective as that is).
> 
> Before jumping to any conclusions I think the first thing would be 
to
> determine if the 750 prints 4 picoliter dots at 1440 dpi.  If it 
does,
> then perhaps even those dots are too much for your taste.  You can
> also get a sample high quality BO print to see what BO is capable 
of
> and compare it to yours.  If the 750 does print the small dots but
> still doesn't look good, it's possible that the driver is to 
blame. 
> If the 750 isn't capable of good BO work then you can decide what 
to
> do next.  At least you'll know what's possible and can decide if 
it's

> worth it to buy a new printer to get what you want.
> 
> Regards,
> Clayton
> 
> 
> Info on black and white digital printing at    
> http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm