Digital BW, The Print

Hello all,
I think I might have posted this question once before, but 
 my life has been to caotic? to follow up.
Anyway try as I may I cant seem to get natural b/w prints 
from my 1280. no matter what i do i always get a little color tone.
I,m using lyson small gamut because of their long-life, and limited
pigment, thinging i could get better b/w's from my printer, but i was
wrong.I'm using photo shop elements software and epson enhanced matt
paper.
I've tryed other papers and every setting imaginable, but still
the prints are not convincing. Being of the traditioal darkroom 
school I dont know much about icc or other sofeware  tone curves.
If anyone out there can clue me in I would really appreciate it.
Thanks
John

Hi

As a (mostly) satisfied user of SG inks (and yes, I know some aren't :-)) I
really would recommend getting to understand the fundamentals of colour
management. It can take so much of the guesswork (and wasted paper) out of
printing - not that you'll stop testing, you have a better idea of what's
going wrong... You might want to try the Lyson fine-art profile, but best
results  (imho) with SG (like many other inks) come with a custom profile
(and a calibrated monitor).

I've collected references to a lot of this sort of stuff in the links
section at <http://northlight-images.co.uk/links.html> including some
downloadable chapters of books dealing with CM issues. Sorry if that¹s not a
quick solution, but it is a subject that needs some real thinking about -
but well worth it!

If there are any specific SG questions please let me know, since I only get
the digest version of this list.


bye for now   

Keith Cooper

In message <bgo227+3hkd@...>, joonyten <ericten@...> 
writes
>Hello all,
>I think I might have posted this question once before, but
>my life has been to caotic? to follow up.
>Anyway try as I may I cant seem to get natural b/w prints
>from my 1280. no matter what i do i always get a little color tone.
>I,m using lyson small gamut because of their long-life, and limited
>pigment, thinging i could get better b/w's from my printer, but i was
>wrong.I'm using photo shop elements software and epson enhanced matt
>paper.
>I've tryed other papers and every setting imaginable, but still
>the prints are not convincing. Being of the traditioal darkroom
>school I dont know much about icc or other sofeware\ufffd tone curves.
>If anyone out there can clue me in I would really appreciate it.
>Thanks
>John\ufffd
>\ufffd\ufffd
>
>
>
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--
Lyson small gamut inks,
I use them regularly for B&W prints. For settings and help try the Marrutt web
site. They are the agents in England and I have always found them exceptionally
helpful. They supply free downloadable settings to set up the print previews
etc in Photoshop with their prefared settings and for a neutral print with
little metamerism use (in PS) Hue/Sat click - colorize Hue set to 210 sat4.
In the UK they sent me a CD with test print files and a printed example which
you should be able to match on your printer.
Cyril H. Walker

John,

Natural black and white prints do seem to be a bit of
a holy grail to this list.  The question of whether or
not an image competes directly with a silver print or
if it complements traditional methods is continually
being asked.

It is difficult to get great images right off, and
many of us spend much following advice and claims made
by the manufacturers and experienced users.  While
this makes a great starting point - it never helps
fully.  Due to tolerances in printer manufacture,
color management, operating system woes, digital image
capture, etc... we can emulate results but never
really obtain the same results as another user. 
Therefore, what works for them  - just kinda works for
them.

To get to the point, the easiest solution is generally
the best solution.  Clayton's method of Black Only is
foolproof.  Some are wary of the "gritty" images it
creates, but you will find it difficult to get a
greyscale image as easily with other methods (or as
inexpensively).  Images are made with one ink only -
so you have less issues of color cast.  No further
costs are needed - just your original epson driver and
the black cartridge.

If you get the acceptable image quality printing black
only and like the look, you are done.  If not - you
can take what you've learned and do wonders with any
B&W method or system.  Black only printing gives you a
great starting point so that you will know what you
and your equipment are capable of.  I highly advise
this method.  It reduces variables and allows you to
see how tones print from pure black to paper white. 
Then, you will be able to print much better if you are
using a quad or hextone based inkset.

If all else fails, plenty of workshops are available
for digital imaging.  The cost is irrelevant - as you
can directly weigh the price against the materials you
might have wasted anyway with endless testing.  Just
don't give up yet - great results are available with
your system, you just have to find the right
combination. 

Don



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