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Re: direction about greeting cards

Re: direction about greeting cards

2004-05-24 by houston.spencer@alcatel.com

Maria:

(Long post follows.  Forgive me if any of this has been covered already; 
I'm a few days behind in my e-mail. Also, please forgive any of this that 
is so obvious that I deserve to be slapped.)

All of Stan's observations about costs are right.  You've discussed 
printing your own cards on inkjet and contracting with a greeting card 
company.  But there's another option that sounds like it would make more 
sense given your goals.  That option is to self-publish in small printing 
runs.  By small, I'm talking about printing 4-10 different image cards at 
750-1000 cards per run. This would give you enough volume, at reasonable 
cost, to get started on the art-fair/small shop market. And if you want to 
scale up, that's easy to do at very, very low incremental cost.

A few words of experience if you do go this route:

Price:  Because of high competition in the printing industry, the prices 
for doing this kind of run are quite low. You will probably have to invest 
a couple thousand dollars (depending on number of cards, size of run, 
number of colours, quality of stock), but your margins will be reasonable 
and, assuming your cards sell, you will easily recover the cost and go on 
to profit.  (How much profit is up to you.)

Quality:  It can vary a *great* deal from print shop to print shop. As 
with all craft businesses, get recommendations from other photographers 
who have had cards printed. 

Quality II - The high end: There are printers that specialize in high-end 
photography reproduction.  Their work is wonderful, and their prices are 
high.  Remember, you're publishing greeting cards.  They need to be 
beautiful enough to sell and (we hope) touch the receipient, but they will 
more likely end up in the trash than in a frame, so watch your printing 
costs.

Quality III - The low end: There are web-based printers with literally no 
human interaction required.  You upload your images to card templates, and 
the cards arrive in the mail a surprisingly short time later. It's almost 
magic! The quality is what it is: sometimes fine, sometimes not.  I've 
worked with two of these types of setups, and both were fine for 
non-critical work...and the price was extraordinarily reasonable.  One of 
them had quite excellent phone-based customer service. Note, however, that 
these outfits are usually brokers--agents that farm the job out to various 
contract printers--not the printers themselves.  That's not necessarily a 
bad thing; it does, after all, get you a very, very low price if that's 
what you need to get started.

Customer service and relationships: If you go this printing route, you 
will find your eye for quality develops very, very quickly. I have found 
that having a relationship with a good printer (not the sales guy, but the 
*printer*) is very valuable.  You know about your photographs and how they 
should look.  He (usually he) knows his press and how to deliver what you 
want, down to recommending different stocks or approaches.  If you're 
going choose a local shop, specifically choose to work with someone you 
like and respect.  Printing jobs *can* be a hassle, and you want to be 
doing this with someone whom you trust, and with whom you can chuckle when 
the first proof comes back looking shocking.

Color: Why on earth would you care about colour? You may find that your 
work produces well in a single ink color (ie black). I haven't.  After 
having tried everything from single ink to full process color, I now work 
almost entirely in duotone for press output. This is very much personal 
preference and is all about how you want your final product to look...and 
what cost trade-offs you want to make. Working in duo- and tri-tone has 
only reinforced the above comment about the value of your relationship 
with a good printer. 

Design: If you've got a good eye for design, by all means design the cards 
yourself.  Don't forget back-side branding, copyright etc.  Designing a 
card that conveys that feeling that it's a piece of art--vs Hallmark and 
the like--is a fun challenge. 

Size:  The size of your card (by which I mean shape and dimensions) is an 
important design element, but it's also critical to something else: cost. 
*Card* size and shape, per se, has only tiny influence on cost: everything 
gets printed on large sheets and is cut when it comes off the back of the 
press anyway, so choosing a custom size won't have much, if any, cost 
impact. BUT you need to use a standard size *envelope*, or your custom 
envelope costs will kill your margin. 

Stock:  Get recommendations on stock from your printer unless you already 
know what you want.  Choose a stock that suits your images (color and 
weight). You're freed to some extent from the inkjet 
coated/uncoated/smooth/velvet/matt/gloss/ tyranny, but you enter a world 
of even more options (some of which have similar names--eg "coated"--but 
different meanings, so watch your step). Furthermore, you need to keep in 
mind the card/envelope match.  Make sure the stock you choose goes well 
with a readily available--ie, inexpensive--envelope size and color.

The business you're in: I'm probably talking down to you, here, and, if 
so, I apologize in advance.  But this is a point that bears making, just 
in case you haven't thought about it.  When you get into selling greeting 
cards, it's certainly a way of selling your photography, but go in with 
your eyes open that you're getting into the business of selling greeting 
cards.  The two can live in a very happy marriage, but trudging around 
trying to sell your cards is time you're not spending making photographs. 
That said, if you can make money selling your images this way, more power 
to you. I'm all for people getting out and making their living (or part of 
it) from their passion.

I worry, looking back over this long screen of text, that I'm making this 
sound scary.  It's not. I jumped in with a 4-card 1000 sheet run a few 
years ago, having no idea what I was doing.  They turned out nicely, were 
popular enough that I never got nervous again about recovering print 
costs, and quality has only improved with each bit of knowledge accrued in 
successive runs.

So, if you've got the energy to sell 'em once you've got 'em, then go get 
'em!  And leave your inkjet to do beautiful, but high cost, master prints 
and limited editions that you sell at high prices beside your cards at the 
art fairs. 

I'm surprised that Lea (from whinydogpress) hasn't piped up on this topic. 
 Are you tuned in, Lea?

Cheers. --h 
...on a gobsmackingly beautiful day in Paris


* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * 

Message: 12
   Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 12:00:23 -0700
Show quoted textHide quoted text
   From: sierra <artistasierra@...>
Subject: Re: direction

Stan, 

Thank you for your response.

My ultimate goal would be to be published by a greeting card company.  Of
course, I don't know the pros and cons to that, so...  My plan was just to
start going shop to shop and possible art fairs and sell them on a small
scale at first. 

Is there a better site to explore the options available and pros/cons to
creating income with our photography.  The only other thing that I know
about is stock photog.  Does publishing our photog. legally prohibit us 
from
doing any kind of art exhibits in the future?  Is this the site to 
continue
to ask questions like this?

Maria

Re: [Digital BW] Re: direction about greeting cards

2004-05-24 by Arthur Fink

[writing off list ... just to you]

Sounds like you have a small greeting card company ...  Can I have the URL?

Thanks,

Arthur Fink

  A r t h u r    F i n k      P h o t o g r a p h y
  .................................................
  Ten New Island Avenue     � 207.766.5722
  Peaks Island, Maine 04108 � arthur@...

[Digital BW] Re: direction about greeting cards

2004-05-24 by houstonspencer

Arthur:

Not any more!  Fun and successive relocations with my day job have 
kept the cards in the closet for a couple of years.  Feel free to 
contact me off-list, however, if I can be helpful.

If you're still keen, I do have a woefully out of date website which 
is a great demonstration of ham-fisted scanning and Photoshop skills 
(ie, mine when I put the site up).  I try to convince myself that 
it's there to remind me how far I've come, but it's really a reminder 
that I need to get off my duff and do some work to update the bloody 
thing.

It's at www.humanimages.com

Cheers.  --h


--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Arthur Fink 
<arthur@m...> wrote:
> 	[writing off list ... just to you]
> 
> Sounds like you have a small greeting card company ...  Can I have 
the URL?
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Arthur Fink
> 
>   A r t h u r    F i n k      P h o t o g r a p h y
>   .................................................
>   Ten New Island Avenue     · 207.766.5722
>   Peaks Island, Maine 04108 · arthur@a...

Re: [Digital BW] Re: direction about greeting cards

2004-05-25 by lea

I made it!

The original post got past me somehow but I would be happy to share a
bit of what I've learned in my 7+ years of running my own greeting card
company full-time (my only source of income I'm proud to say).

Let me preface by saying that every card I've printed in all the years
I've been doing this have been printed on an Epson printer...starting
with the Epson Stylus, then the Epson 800, 850 and currently I'm on my
4th Epson 900. For me, buying new printers and ink was much cheaper than
having the cards printed by a shop. For a couple of reasons...my full
card line has over 300 images in it and there is no way I could afford
to have enough quantity of that many images printed in bulk. The other
reason I continue to self-print is so I can add an image to the line
just as quick as a wink; I can take a shot today and have it up on the
website or in the catalog for sale by tomorrow.

I worked with a paper supplier (not Office Max or Office Depot but a
real supplier) and tested several papers before settling on my current
stock. I use a textured bright white which shows off the sepia as well
as the colorized images very nicely. One big setback was that I
originally was using a translucent envelope which was just
gorgeous...expensive but amazingly beautiful...but when I went national
I found out that some post offices were charging up to 11 cents more to
mail that type of envelope so I ended up going to a solid white envelope
which matches my stock. That was a hard decision because much of the
look of my work was how it looked in the envelope.

Buy your stock in bulk once you decide on what you'll use. I buy
2-4,000--8.5 x 11" sheets at a time. These go to a print shop where they
are scored. After I run them thru my printer I cut them to card size
(4.25 x 11") and fold them very quickly.

My father is my sales rep and within a month of starting my business I
had cards in 78 shops; at the height of my business I had over 400
stores in the US, Canada and Europe carrying my line. Remember, each of
these were printed, cut and folded by me (and my daughter who worked for
me for quite some time)! September 11 hit my shops hard and since
several of my buyers were little mom and pop shops I lost quite a few in
the past couple of years. I still have roughly 250 shops carrying the
line.

I'd like to expand on the selling Dad does and the marketing I do...Dad
(he's retired so this is actually just play for him) and Mom drive to
different towns looking for shops they think might like the cards and
Dad just cold calls the buyer. He's really, really good at what he does
and that type of selling is very natural for him; it is not comfortable
for me. I have only ever approached one store to carry the line and
indeed, they did say yes but it about killed me.

For marketing, what I do is scour magazines and the internet looking for
shops which might be a match for the line; I send them a promo piece
sample, Dad follows up with a phone call and either we have a new shop
or we don't. This takes some coordination and I use the database ACT to
track what I send and when it goes out. It is not uncommon for a buyer
to see my cards in a shop and call asking for information on the cards.

The back of each card has my web address so anyone can look at my stuff;
it has been invaluable in gaining me new clients.

I do all my shipping via Priority Mail which has never once lost a
package. I like it so much better than UPS because there are fewer forms
to fill out and it's cheaper.

One of the great things that happened as a result of my cards was that I
was picked up by an agent and my images are used for licensing on all
sorts of products from posters and cups and calendars and plates and
books and framed art pieces as well as computer software. That has been
a huge part of what I do with those images.

In the past 2 years I've expanded my photography to include pets and
children and wedding work so I'm not nearly so focused on the cards as I
once was; I still make them but I don't shoot specifically for them like
I once did. I do offer my portrait clients the option to buy cards with
their images on them and I do a killer business at Christmas.

You are certainly welcome to have a romp around my web site and I'd be
happy to answer any questions you may have.
Lea
www.whinydogpress.com
Show quoted textHide quoted text
----- Original Message -----
From: <houston.spencer@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, May 24, 2004 4:41 AM
Subject: [Digital BW] Re: direction about greeting cards


Maria:

(Long post follows.  Forgive me if any of this has been covered already;
I'm a few days behind in my e-mail. Also, please forgive any of this
that
is so obvious that I deserve to be slapped.)

All of Stan's observations about costs are right.  You've discussed
printing your own cards on inkjet and contracting with a greeting card
company.  But there's another option that sounds like it would make more
sense given your goals.  That option is to self-publish in small
printing
runs.  By small, I'm talking about printing 4-10 different image cards
at
750-1000 cards per run. This would give you enough volume, at reasonable
cost, to get started on the art-fair/small shop market. And if you want
to
scale up, that's easy to do at very, very low incremental cost.

A few words of experience if you do go this route:

Price:  Because of high competition in the printing industry, the prices
for doing this kind of run are quite low. You will probably have to
invest
a couple thousand dollars (depending on number of cards, size of run,
number of colours, quality of stock), but your margins will be
reasonable
and, assuming your cards sell, you will easily recover the cost and go
on
to profit.  (How much profit is up to you.)

Quality:  It can vary a *great* deal from print shop to print shop. As
with all craft businesses, get recommendations from other photographers
who have had cards printed.

Quality II - The high end: There are printers that specialize in
high-end
photography reproduction.  Their work is wonderful, and their prices are
high.  Remember, you're publishing greeting cards.  They need to be
beautiful enough to sell and (we hope) touch the receipient, but they
will
more likely end up in the trash than in a frame, so watch your printing
costs.

Quality III - The low end: There are web-based printers with literally
no
human interaction required.  You upload your images to card templates,
and
the cards arrive in the mail a surprisingly short time later. It's
almost
magic! The quality is what it is: sometimes fine, sometimes not.  I've
worked with two of these types of setups, and both were fine for
non-critical work...and the price was extraordinarily reasonable.  One
of
them had quite excellent phone-based customer service. Note, however,
that
these outfits are usually brokers--agents that farm the job out to
various
contract printers--not the printers themselves.  That's not necessarily
a
bad thing; it does, after all, get you a very, very low price if that's
what you need to get started.

Customer service and relationships: If you go this printing route, you
will find your eye for quality develops very, very quickly. I have found
that having a relationship with a good printer (not the sales guy, but
the
*printer*) is very valuable.  You know about your photographs and how
they
should look.  He (usually he) knows his press and how to deliver what
you
want, down to recommending different stocks or approaches.  If you're
going choose a local shop, specifically choose to work with someone you
like and respect.  Printing jobs *can* be a hassle, and you want to be
doing this with someone whom you trust, and with whom you can chuckle
when
the first proof comes back looking shocking.

Color: Why on earth would you care about colour? You may find that your
work produces well in a single ink color (ie black). I haven't.  After
having tried everything from single ink to full process color, I now
work
almost entirely in duotone for press output. This is very much personal
preference and is all about how you want your final product to
look...and
what cost trade-offs you want to make. Working in duo- and tri-tone has
only reinforced the above comment about the value of your relationship
with a good printer.

Design: If you've got a good eye for design, by all means design the
cards
yourself.  Don't forget back-side branding, copyright etc.  Designing a
card that conveys that feeling that it's a piece of art--vs Hallmark and
the like--is a fun challenge.

Size:  The size of your card (by which I mean shape and dimensions) is
an
important design element, but it's also critical to something else:
cost.
*Card* size and shape, per se, has only tiny influence on cost:
everything
gets printed on large sheets and is cut when it comes off the back of
the
press anyway, so choosing a custom size won't have much, if any, cost
impact. BUT you need to use a standard size *envelope*, or your custom
envelope costs will kill your margin.

Stock:  Get recommendations on stock from your printer unless you
already
know what you want.  Choose a stock that suits your images (color and
weight). You're freed to some extent from the inkjet
coated/uncoated/smooth/velvet/matt/gloss/ tyranny, but you enter a world
of even more options (some of which have similar names--eg "coated"--but
different meanings, so watch your step). Furthermore, you need to keep
in
mind the card/envelope match.  Make sure the stock you choose goes well
with a readily available--ie, inexpensive--envelope size and color.

The business you're in: I'm probably talking down to you, here, and, if
so, I apologize in advance.  But this is a point that bears making, just
in case you haven't thought about it.  When you get into selling
greeting
cards, it's certainly a way of selling your photography, but go in with
your eyes open that you're getting into the business of selling greeting
cards.  The two can live in a very happy marriage, but trudging around
trying to sell your cards is time you're not spending making
photographs.
That said, if you can make money selling your images this way, more
power
to you. I'm all for people getting out and making their living (or part
of
it) from their passion.

I worry, looking back over this long screen of text, that I'm making
this
sound scary.  It's not. I jumped in with a 4-card 1000 sheet run a few
years ago, having no idea what I was doing.  They turned out nicely,
were
popular enough that I never got nervous again about recovering print
costs, and quality has only improved with each bit of knowledge accrued
in
successive runs.

So, if you've got the energy to sell 'em once you've got 'em, then go
get
'em!  And leave your inkjet to do beautiful, but high cost, master
prints
and limited editions that you sell at high prices beside your cards at
the
art fairs.

I'm surprised that Lea (from whinydogpress) hasn't piped up on this
topic.
 Are you tuned in, Lea?

Cheers. --h
...on a gobsmackingly beautiful day in Paris


* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

Message: 12
   Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 12:00:23 -0700
   From: sierra <artistasierra@...>
Subject: Re: direction

Stan,

Thank you for your response.

My ultimate goal would be to be published by a greeting card company.
Of
course, I don't know the pros and cons to that, so...  My plan was just
to
start going shop to shop and possible art fairs and sell them on a small
scale at first.

Is there a better site to explore the options available and pros/cons to
creating income with our photography.  The only other thing that I know
about is stock photog.  Does publishing our photog. legally prohibit us
from
doing any kind of art exhibits in the future?  Is this the site to
continue
to ask questions like this?

Maria




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[Digital BW] Re: direction about greeting cards

2004-05-25 by houstonspencer

Hey, Lea...

Great to hear from you.  I knew you'd be a font of wisdom.

Curious about something, given our different approaches.  I can 
understand why you would inkjet print new images that are un-proven 
in the marketplace, and images that don't move very fast.  Do you, 
however, have a number of images that are best sellers?  Or doesn't 
the old maxim hold for you, ie that a majority of sales comes from a 
small portion of your catalog?

If you sell relatively even quantities across your range, I see how 
inkjet printing on demand would lower your inventory and cashflow 
issues.  But if you sell some images consistently in large 
quantities, while the rest of your catalog moves more slowly, 
wouldn't you gain a lot of margin on your highest volume products by 
doing moderately large press runs of the popular sellers?  ...using, 
of course, same stock and quality controlling with your original 
inkjet print as the match-to proof?  I guess, if you're using CIS, 
your ink costs approach zero per card, so maybe my margin 
calculations are off. 

The difference in our approach is easy to understand given the number 
of images you're managing.  I was never making the bulk of my income 
this way, so I only ever stocked 20-30 images.  For that small number 
of products, the up-front printing costs were low and inventory was 
uncomplicated.  You've got a much, much more sophisticated business.  
And much more successful!  Good on you.

--h



--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "lea" <lea@w...> 
wrote:
> I made it!
> 
> The original post got past me somehow but I would be happy to share 
a
> bit of what I've learned in my 7+ years of running my own greeting 
card
> company full-time (my only source of income I'm proud to say).
> 
> Let me preface by saying that every card I've printed in all the 
years
> I've been doing this have been printed on an Epson 
printer...starting
> with the Epson Stylus, then the Epson 800, 850 and currently I'm on 
my
> 4th Epson 900. For me, buying new printers and ink was much cheaper 
than
> having the cards printed by a shop. For a couple of reasons...my 
full
> card line has over 300 images in it and there is no way I could 
afford
> to have enough quantity of that many images printed in bulk. The 
other
> reason I continue to self-print is so I can add an image to the line
> just as quick as a wink; I can take a shot today and have it up on 
the
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> website or in the catalog for sale by tomorrow.
> 
>

Re: [Digital BW] Re: direction about greeting cards

2004-05-25 by lea

Your question is a good one and yes, there have been consistant
good-sellers during the run of my business and indeed, if I had to cut
back to 20 cards I could do it rather easily except customers expect and
demand variety...even if they don't pick it. I never volume printed the
popular ones mostly because it never crossed my mind to do it that way.
An EXCELLENT suggestion for anyone considering getting into this though!

When I did consider having the cards run on a press I did some serious
quality control and found they could just darn near match my own output.
Shoot, now I wish I'd of gone ahead and let them do those
best-sellers...it would have saved me some time!

Lea
Show quoted textHide quoted text
----- Original Message -----
From: "houstonspencer" <houston.spencer@...>
To: <DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 25, 2004 7:33 AM
Subject: [Digital BW] Re: direction about greeting cards


Hey, Lea...

Great to hear from you.  I knew you'd be a font of wisdom.

Curious about something, given our different approaches.  I can
understand why you would inkjet print new images that are un-proven
in the marketplace, and images that don't move very fast.  Do you,
however, have a number of images that are best sellers?  Or doesn't
the old maxim hold for you, ie that a majority of sales comes from a
small portion of your catalog?

If you sell relatively even quantities across your range, I see how
inkjet printing on demand would lower your inventory and cashflow
issues.  But if you sell some images consistently in large
quantities, while the rest of your catalog moves more slowly,
wouldn't you gain a lot of margin on your highest volume products by
doing moderately large press runs of the popular sellers?  ...using,
of course, same stock and quality controlling with your original
inkjet print as the match-to proof?  I guess, if you're using CIS,
your ink costs approach zero per card, so maybe my margin
calculations are off.

The difference in our approach is easy to understand given the number
of images you're managing.  I was never making the bulk of my income
this way, so I only ever stocked 20-30 images.  For that small number
of products, the up-front printing costs were low and inventory was
uncomplicated.  You've got a much, much more sophisticated business.
And much more successful!  Good on you.

--h



--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "lea" <lea@w...>
wrote:
> I made it!
>
> The original post got past me somehow but I would be happy to share
a
> bit of what I've learned in my 7+ years of running my own greeting
card
> company full-time (my only source of income I'm proud to say).
>
> Let me preface by saying that every card I've printed in all the
years
> I've been doing this have been printed on an Epson
printer...starting
> with the Epson Stylus, then the Epson 800, 850 and currently I'm on
my
> 4th Epson 900. For me, buying new printers and ink was much cheaper
than
> having the cards printed by a shop. For a couple of reasons...my
full
> card line has over 300 images in it and there is no way I could
afford
> to have enough quantity of that many images printed in bulk. The
other
> reason I continue to self-print is so I can add an image to the line
> just as quick as a wink; I can take a shot today and have it up on
the
> website or in the catalog for sale by tomorrow.
>
>




Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources
as they are often being updated.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint

If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this
same page.

Please follow these basic guidelines:
- As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to
keep them short.
- Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames.
Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
membership without notice.
- Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W
printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed
from the membership.
- By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and
guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner
and Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines" in the Files
section:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/

BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE "OWNER" AND
"MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO
YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR
EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF
PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE
"OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN
ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE
OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii)
UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA;
(iii) STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE
PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW,
THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP.

Yahoo! Groups Links

UT1 & UT2 - mixable at all?

2004-05-26 by Allan Chen

>Hello all,

I have a 1280, currently finishing up the last of my UT1 
cartridges.  Here's my issue - I'm on my last black cartridge, but I have a 
whole other, unused "color" cartridge of UT1.  I want to move to UT2.  Can 
I mix them at all?

I tried looking into the formualtion of the UT2 black cartrdige, to see if 
it was the same as the UT1 version.  Not 100% sure, so figured I'd just ask.

thanks,
allan


------------------------------------
Technology Projects Manager
Academic Computing & The Office of Accessible Education
Stanford University
v - 650-996-0546
f - 650-725-4685

RE: [Digital BW] UT1 & UT2 - mixable at all?

2004-05-26 by Paul Roark

Allan,

The UT1 and UT2 use the same "Eboni" black ink.  The "colors" are different.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com 

For UT2 & UT7 information, curves, and settings see:
http://home1.gte.net/res09aij/

_______________________________
Show quoted textHide quoted text
-----Original Message-----
From: Allan Chen [mailto:kaiyen@...] 
Sent: Wednesday, May 26, 2004 10:09 AM
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Digital BW] UT1 & UT2 - mixable at all?


>Hello all,

I have a 1280, currently finishing up the last of my UT1 
cartridges.  Here's my issue - I'm on my last black cartridge, but I have a 
whole other, unused "color" cartridge of UT1.  I want to move to UT2.  Can 
I mix them at all?

I tried looking into the formualtion of the UT2 black cartrdige, to see if 
it was the same as the UT1 version.  Not 100% sure, so figured I'd just ask.

thanks,
allan


------------------------------------
Technology Projects Manager
Academic Computing & The Office of Accessible Education
Stanford University
v - 650-996-0546
f - 650-725-4685 




Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as
they are often being updated.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint

If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same
page.

Please follow these basic guidelines:
- As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
them short.
- Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames.
Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
membership without notice.
- Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W
printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from
the membership.
- By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and
guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner and
Moderators. See Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines in the Files section:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/

BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE OWNER AND
MODERATORS OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU
FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY
DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS,
GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  OWNER AND
MODERATORS OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE
POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY
TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR
ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY
THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER
MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
 
Yahoo! Groups Links

RE: [Digital BW] UT1 & UT2 - mixable at all?

2004-05-26 by Allan Chen

thanks Paul, as always.
allan

At 11:30 AM 5/26/2004, you wrote:
>Allan,
>
>The UT1 and UT2 use the same "Eboni" black ink.  The "colors" are different.
>
>Paul
>www.PaulRoark.com
>
>For UT2 & UT7 information, curves, and settings see:
>http://home1.gte.net/res09aij/
>
>_______________________________
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Allan Chen [mailto:kaiyen@...]
>Sent: Wednesday, May 26, 2004 10:09 AM
>To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: [Digital BW] UT1 & UT2 - mixable at all?
>
>
> >Hello all,
>
>I have a 1280, currently finishing up the last of my UT1
>cartridges.  Here's my issue - I'm on my last black cartridge, but I have a
>whole other, unused "color" cartridge of UT1.  I want to move to UT2.  Can
>I mix them at all?
>
>I tried looking into the formualtion of the UT2 black cartrdige, to see if
>it was the same as the UT1 version.  Not 100% sure, so figured I'd just ask.
>
>thanks,
>allan
>
>
>------------------------------------
>Technology Projects Manager
>Academic Computing & The Office of Accessible Education
>Stanford University
>v - 650-996-0546
>f - 650-725-4685
>
>
>
>
>Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as
>they are often being updated.
>
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
>If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to
>unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same
>page.
>
>Please follow these basic guidelines:
>- As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep
>them short.
>- Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames.
>Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the
>membership without notice.
>- Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W
>printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from
>the membership.
>- By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and
>guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner and
>Moderators. See Group Topic, Rules and Guidelinesin the Files section:
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
>
>BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT
>YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE OWNERAND
>MODERATORSOF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO YOU
>FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY
>DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS,
>GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE  OWNERAND
>MODERATORSOF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE
>POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE INABILITY
>TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR
>ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY
>THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER
>MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as 
>they are often being updated.
>
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint
>
>If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to 
>unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same 
>page.
>
>Please follow these basic guidelines:
>- As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep 
>them short.
>- Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames. 
>Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the 
>membership without notice.
>- Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W 
>printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from 
>the membership.
>- By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and 
>guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner 
>and Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines" in the Files section:
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/
>
>BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT 
>YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE "OWNER" AND 
>"MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO 
>YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR 
>EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF 
>PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF 
>THE  "OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE 
>BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE 
>USE OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) 
>UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) 
>STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT 
>YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE 
>PRINT YAHOO GROUP.
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>

------------------------------------
Technology Projects Manager
Academic Computing & The Office of Accessible Education
Stanford University
v - 650-996-0546
f - 650-725-4685

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