Digital BW, The Print

Hello,

I'm new to digital.  I have no equipment yet and I'm currently 
investigating the best way to spend my money to get started.  This 
group has been a great resource for me and I saw the recent posting 
of newbie advice which was very helpful.  In general I plan on buying 
a film scanner, imaging software, an Epson printer, and quadtone 
inks.  I have a few questions that I couldn't find answers to by 
searching the archives here and in Google groups.

- Can I use the MIS workflows with Photoshop Elements?  Do I really 
need Photoshop 6.0 instead?

- So far I've narrowed my printer choices to the Epson 890 or the 
1280.  I would obviously prefer the 1280 but price may be an issue.  
Are there workflows for the 890?  If not, would creating transfer 
functions be the way to go with the 890?

- How important is monitor calibration for black and white?  Would 
the gamma tool with Photoshop be sufficient or do I need to buy other 
software and/or hardware?

Please keep in mind that I've never used Photoshop, a film scanner, 
etc.  Any other suggestions on getting started are very welcome.  
Thank you for your help.

Doug Santoli
Waterbury, CT

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@y..., dsantoli@y... wrote:
> 
> Hello,
> 
> I'm new to digital.  I have no equipment yet and I'm currently 
> investigating the best way to spend my money to get started.  This 
> group has been a great resource for me and I saw the recent posting 
> of newbie advice which was very helpful.  In general I plan on 
buying 
> a film scanner, imaging software, an Epson printer, and quadtone 
> inks.  I have a few questions that I couldn't find answers to by 
> searching the archives here and in Google groups.
> 
> - Can I use the MIS workflows with Photoshop Elements?  Do I really 
> need Photoshop 6.0 instead?

Doug,

You cannot apply adjustment curves in PS Elements so you would not be 
able to use the MIS VM curves. PS LE might work but I don't have a 
copy installed to tell you for sure. Remember you will want and need 
the full version of PS at some point so don't spend much on these 
stripped down versions. 

> 
> - So far I've narrowed my printer choices to the Epson 890 or the 
> 1280.  I would obviously prefer the 1280 but price may be an issue.

Hold out for the 1280. Most likely you will want to make some bigger 
prints than the 890 can produce.
  
> Are there workflows for the 890?  If not, would creating transfer 
> functions be the way to go with the 890?

I don't think there is much available for the 890 in terms of work 
flows and it would take more than a transfer function to get you to 
where you need to be. Another good reason to go with the 1280 is that 
it is more popular and there is and will be more support available.
> 
> - How important is monitor calibration for black and white?  Would 
> the gamma tool with Photoshop be sufficient or do I need to buy 
other 
> software and/or hardware?

Start with the gamma tool and use the money you save to get the 1280.

> 
> Please keep in mind that I've never used Photoshop, a film scanner, 
> etc.  Any other suggestions on getting started are very welcome.  
> Thank you for your help.

Come on in the waters fine! Big learning curve but worth the effort.

Martin

Doug,

If you are looking for a cheaper alternative to PS 6.0, you might check out 
Picture Window, a photo editing program created by Jonathan Sachs, the 
developer of Lotus 1-2-3.  At the request of some users (including me) he 
has enabled the latest version (3.1d) to support the Photoshop ACV curves 
necessary to use MIS VM quadtones.  I've been using it successfully with 
Paul Rourke's curves.  The basic version of the program goes for under $50, 
and the "Pro" version (which supports 16-bit per channel editing and color 
management) goes for under $100.  It is an extremely capable and powerful 
program designed specifically for photo editing (i.e., it doesn't have 
Photoshop's graphics tools).  From what I can tell, it's far superior to 
the stripped-down Photoshop versions.  You can check it out at www.dl-c.com 
and can  download a 30-day trial version.

Chris Patti

  At 08:16 PM 11/14/01 +0000, you wrote:

> > - Can I use the MIS workflows with Photoshop Elements?  Do I really
> > need Photoshop 6.0 instead?
>
>Doug,
>
>You cannot apply adjustment curves in PS Elements so you would not be
>able to use the MIS VM curves. PS LE might work but I don't have a
>copy installed to tell you for sure. Remember you will want and need
>the full version of PS at some point so don't spend much on these
>stripped down versions.

Doug,
  If you *do* decide to go with a full PhotoShop
application, I would have to recommend version 6.0
over 5.5.  From my experience,(w/ 1280 on PC) the MIS
VM curves work better in PhotoShop 6.0 than 5.5.
  Of course, I don't think you can even get 5.5 new,
but if that were an option for you, I'd go for 6.0.

 daniel perez


--- dsantoli@... wrote:
> 
> Hello,
> 
> I'm new to digital.  I have no equipment yet and I'm
> currently 
> investigating the best way to spend my money to get
> started.  This 
> group has been a great resource for me and I saw the
> recent posting 
> of newbie advice which was very helpful.  In general
> I plan on buying 
> a film scanner, imaging software, an Epson printer,
> and quadtone 
> inks.  I have a few questions that I couldn't find
> answers to by 
> searching the archives here and in Google groups.
> 
> - Can I use the MIS workflows with Photoshop
> Elements?  Do I really 
> need Photoshop 6.0 instead?
> 
> - So far I've narrowed my printer choices to the
> Epson 890 or the 
> 1280.  I would obviously prefer the 1280 but price
> may be an issue.  
> Are there workflows for the 890?  If not, would
> creating transfer 
> functions be the way to go with the 890?
> 
> - How important is monitor calibration for black and
> white?  Would 
> the gamma tool with Photoshop be sufficient or do I
> need to buy other 
> software and/or hardware?
> 
> Please keep in mind that I've never used Photoshop,
> a film scanner, 
> etc.  Any other suggestions on getting started are
> very welcome.  
> Thank you for your help.
> 
> Doug Santoli
> Waterbury, CT
> 
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An inexpensive way to get into Photoshop is on e-bay.  One can purchase an older version (like Photoshop 5),
unused, and sealed, for a reasonable amount (like $50) and then buy the upgrade to PS6 new.   Costs half the
price of buying the full version of
PS6.

Harvey Ferdschneider
partner, SKID Photography, NYC

Daniel Perez wrote:

> Doug,
>   If you *do* decide to go with a full PhotoShop
> application, I would have to recommend version 6.0
> over 5.5.  From my experience,(w/ 1280 on PC) the MIS
> VM curves work better in PhotoShop 6.0 than 5.5.
>   Of course, I don't think you can even get 5.5 new,
> but if that were an option for you, I'd go for 6.0.
>
> daniel perez
>
>
> --- dsantoli@... wrote:
> >
> > Hello,
> >
> > I'm new to digital.  I have no equipment yet and I'm
> > currently
> > investigating the best way to spend my money to get
> > started.  This
> > group has been a great resource for me and I saw the
> > recent posting
> > of newbie advice which was very helpful.  In general
> > I plan on buying
> > a film scanner, imaging software, an Epson printer,
> > and quadtone
> > inks.  I have a few questions that I couldn't find
> > answers to by
> > searching the archives here and in Google groups.
> >
> > - Can I use the MIS workflows with Photoshop
> > Elements?  Do I really
> > need Photoshop 6.0 instead?
> >
> > - So far I've narrowed my printer choices to the
> > Epson 890 or the
> > 1280.  I would obviously prefer the 1280 but price
> > may be an issue.
> > Are there workflows for the 890?  If not, would
> > creating transfer
> > functions be the way to go with the 890?
> >
> > - How important is monitor calibration for black and
> > white?  Would
> > the gamma tool with Photoshop be sufficient or do I
> > need to buy other
> > software and/or hardware?
> >
> > Please keep in mind that I've never used Photoshop,
> > a film scanner,
> > etc.  Any other suggestions on getting started are
> > very welcome.
> > Thank you for your help.
> >
> > Doug Santoli
> > Waterbury, CT
> >


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