Digital BW, The Print

Searching this subject is just not working well....

Is ANYONE getting neutral (or even close to neutral) prints on semi-
gloss (or lustre) using QTR under Windows?

Mine are brown.....a very pleasing brown, but brown.  I can get cold 
neutral easily on matte, but on glossy type papers, no go.  I'm okay 
if it comes out a little warm, but these are just too much so.  Don't 
care about bronzing either....I can always spray.  But I would like to 
hit B&W or close to it.

Anyone having any luck on this with QTR?  (Using UC inks)

No luck here either Andy, I'm also getting a deep brown tone to my 
prints using the QTR and Epson semi gloss paper. I don't like it at 
all. I prefer a cooler looking print. Someone had told me to use the 
NoK profile in the QTR curves to print and when I did that, the prints 
came out really faded and gray. I sure wish someone had the right 
answer for us semi-gloss people.



--

- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Andy" <andy-
j1959@m...> wrote:
> 
> Searching this subject is just not working well....
> 
> Is ANYONE getting neutral (or even close to neutral) prints on semi-
> gloss (or lustre) using QTR under Windows?
> 
> Mine are brown.....a very pleasing brown, but brown.  I can get cold 
> neutral easily on matte, but on glossy type papers, no go.  I'm okay 
> if it comes out a little warm, but these are just too much so.  
Don't 
> care about bronzing either....I can always spray.  But I would like 
to 

> hit B&W or close to it.
> 
> Anyone having any luck on this with QTR?  (Using UC inks)

Well, my previous experiment/post with 2k printing was partly in 
response to this problem. I had managed to get a fairly neutral B&W by 
mixing, (if I remember) the warm-1 curve with the neutral curve. Took a 
a few tries, everytime I shifted the curve balance I had to fine tune 
the ink limit, etc. Printing with two neutral K inks gives you a tone 
that's influenced only by the paper base-and if you need more color you 
can get into the curves that include color and go cold or moderately 
warm.

Steve Karafyllakis

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Andy" <andy-
j1959@m...> wrote:
> 
> Searching this subject is just not working well....
> 
> Is ANYONE getting neutral (or even close to neutral) prints on semi-
> gloss (or lustre) using QTR under Windows?
> 
> Mine are brown.....a very pleasing brown, but brown.  I can get cold 
> neutral easily on matte, but on glossy type papers, no go.  I'm okay 
> if it comes out a little warm, but these are just too much so.  Don't 
> care about bronzing either....I can always spray.  But I would like 
to 

> hit B&W or close to it.
> 
> Anyone having any luck on this with QTR?  (Using UC inks)

Hmmm.  Not sure what 2k printing is, and I dont see a warm-1 or 
neutral curve in my QTR .... but

just of the hell of it, I printed a couple images on Epson premium 
glossy (gasp!), using (1) MIS eboni black and (2) the permajet oyster 
cool curve at 100%.  It came out cold black  - BUT, I have only 
printed this at 4x5 which is too small to see what huge expanses of 
black really look like.  I also printed the same image using Epson 
premium semi-matte curve at 100%.  It was noticably warmer - but not 
quite the brown I am used to, so the particular print I have chosen in 
probably not the best for a test, BUT, there is clear improvement 
using permajet oyster and eboni ink.

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Steven 
Karafyllakis" <steve@s...> wrote:
> 
> Well, my previous experiment/post with 2k printing was partly in 
> response to this problem. I had managed to get a fairly neutral B&W 
by 
> mixing, (if I remember) the warm-1 curve with the neutral curve. 
Took a 
> a few tries, everytime I shifted the curve balance I had to fine 
tune 
> the ink limit, etc. Printing with two neutral K inks gives you a 
tone 
> that's influenced only by the paper base-and if you need more color 
you 

> can get into the curves that include color and go cold or moderately 
> warm.
> 
> Steve Karafyllakis

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Andy" <andy-
j1959@m...> wrote:
> 
> Hmmm.  Not sure what 2k printing is, and I dont see a warm-1 or 
> neutral curve in my QTR .... but


2K is what I'm calling printing with black and light black inks and 
nothing else.  You can find out which curves use just those inks by 
right-clicking on the curve in the drop down box, and then clicking 
on the 'show curve graph' option that pops up. Should be something 
like 'EEhmMatte-warm-1' Any of the curves regardless of paper type 
with the 'warm' tag will give you just the two black inks. With UC 
inks that curve will give you a nice warm brown tone. then go 
through the rest of the curves for something with blue (magenta and 
cyan) in it, like the 'neutral' curve. Start with a 50% mix, and 
adjust as needed. My modified 2K setup eliminates the 'adjust as 
needed' part for neutral prints, but creates a bit more work for 
other things like normal color printing.

Steve K

Hi Folks,

Ok, so I've got a Epson C86 on the way, and I'd like to get up and 
running with MIS inks. Money is tight at the moment, though, and I don't 
want to make any silly mistakes. I'd like to be able to mix the neutral 
and warm tone inks and use both resin coated and matte papers. Here's 
what I plan on buying:

Eboni Black              EZ-T0441-K
Photo Black              EZ-T0441-PK
Cyan Position          EZN-T0442-C
Magenta Position    EZN-T0443-M
Yellow Position        EZW-T0444-Y

I'm assuming that these are the new easy refill cartridges. Would it be 
smarter to buy empty cartridges and bulk ink, or is this asking for 
trouble when starting out?

*SK168* Universal Chip Resetter For Epson Printers
MIS-BADP     BOTTOM FILL ADAPTER
MIS-NEEDLE-4      16 GA LURE LOCK NEEDLE 4
*MIS-SYRINGE* 10 CC LURE LOCK
*P-SHIELD* PREMIER ART PRINT SHIELD

For paper, I planned on getting some Epson premium semi-matte, korkland 
glossy, and Permajet Alpha.

Does this sound like a reasonable plan?

Regards,
Peter De Smidt
www.desmidt.net

Hey, thanks!  Much playing ahead......

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Steven 
Karafyllakis" <steve@s...> wrote:
> 
> --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Andy" <andy-
> j1959@m...> wrote:
> > 
> > Hmmm.  Not sure what 2k printing is, and I dont see a warm-1 or 
> > neutral curve in my QTR .... but
> 
> 
> 2K is what I'm calling printing with black and light black inks 
and 
> nothing else.  You can find out which curves use just those inks 
by 
> right-clicking on the curve in the drop down box, and then 
clicking 
> on the 'show curve graph' option that pops up. Should be something 
> like 'EEhmMatte-warm-1' Any of the curves regardless of paper type 
> with the 'warm' tag will give you just the two black inks. With UC 
> inks that curve will give you a nice warm brown tone. then go 
> through the rest of the curves for something with blue (magenta 
and 

> cyan) in it, like the 'neutral' curve. Start with a 50% mix, and 
> adjust as needed. My modified 2K setup eliminates the 'adjust as 
> needed' part for neutral prints, but creates a bit more work for 
> other things like normal color printing.
> 
> Steve K

Kind of hard to say without knowing what you arer trying to accomplish.

If money is tight, I'd key on one system (paper and ink tone) and get that
down first.  Mixing could get expensive before you lock on.

Seth

==-----Original Message-----

==Behalf Of Peter De Smidt
==
==Ok, so I've got a Epson C86 on the way, and I'd like to get 
==up and running with MIS inks. Money is tight at the moment, 
==though, and I don't want to make any silly mistakes. I'd like 
==to be able to mix the neutral and warm tone inks and use both 
==resin coated and matte papers. Here's what I plan on buying:
==
==Eboni Black              EZ-T0441-K
==Photo Black              EZ-T0441-PK
==Cyan Position          EZN-T0442-C
==Magenta Position    EZN-T0443-M
==Yellow Position        EZW-T0444-Y
==
==I'm assuming that these are the new easy refill cartridges. 
==Would it be smarter to buy empty cartridges and bulk ink, or 
==is this asking for trouble when starting out?
==
==*SK168* Universal Chip Resetter For Epson Printers
==MIS-BADP     BOTTOM FILL ADAPTER
==MIS-NEEDLE-4      16 GA LURE LOCK NEEDLE 4
==*MIS-SYRINGE* 10 CC LURE LOCK
==*P-SHIELD* PREMIER ART PRINT SHIELD
==
==For paper, I planned on getting some Epson premium 
==semi-matte, korkland glossy, and Permajet Alpha.
==
==Does this sound like a reasonable plan?
==