MIS UT-FS carts for 2000P
2005-05-04 by Paul D. DeRocco
These have finally shown up in their catalog after a long wait. Has anyone tried them yet? Are you using any curves? How are the results? -- Ciao, Paul D. DeRocco Paul mailto:pderocco@...
Thread
MIS UT-FS carts for 2000P
RE: [Digital BW] MIS UT-FS carts for 2000P
2005-05-05 by Paul Roark
Paul, I made a number of curves for the 2000P and UT-FS inks. The reason I bothered with this printer is that David Brooks is an acquaintance and had a 2000P lying around unused. We felt if it was OK for B&W, there might be a number of these things just sitting around that people could devote to B&W -- cheaply. At any rate, what I found is that the 2000P made an excellent matte printer with monotone inksets. It really pumps the ink out -- like the 7500. For the matte papers, it had about the highest dmax I've seen. If one compares a 4000 matte print made with the Epson driver to what the 2000P can do, you'd think the 4000 was a dog. The heavy ink loading of the 2000P is not that good for glossy papers, however. I found that papers that could not take a high ink load -- like the Ilford papers -- tended to be a bit rough. I have the usual Readme file and curves posted on my web page. (Index at http://home1.gte.net/res09aij/index.htm). I have not tried the latest MIS carts for the 2000P, but I assume the inks are unchanged. The carts are actually 1280 carts with a 2000P chip. Paul www.PaulRoark.com
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> -----Original Message----- > From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Paul D. > DeRocco > Sent: Wednesday, May 04, 2005 3:50 PM > To: Digital B&W > Subject: [Digital BW] MIS UT-FS carts for 2000P > > These have finally shown up in their catalog after a long wait. Has anyone > tried them yet? Are you using any curves? How are the results? > > -- > > Ciao, Paul D. DeRocco > Paul mailto:pderocco@... > > > > > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as > they are often being updated. > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint > > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to > unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same > page. > > Please follow these basic guidelines: > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep > them short. > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames. > Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the > membership without notice. > - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W > printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from > the membership. > - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and > guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner > and Moderators. See "Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines" in the Files > section: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/ > > BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT > YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE "OWNER" AND > "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO > YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR > EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF > PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE > "OWNER" AND "MODERATORS" OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN > ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE > OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) > UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) > STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT > YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE > PRINT YAHOO GROUP. > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >
RE: [Digital BW] MIS UT-FS carts for 2000P
2005-05-05 by Paul D. DeRocco
> From: Paul Roark > > I made a number of curves for the 2000P and UT-FS inks. The reason I > bothered with this printer is that David Brooks is an > acquaintance and had a > 2000P lying around unused. We felt if it was OK for B&W, there might be a > number of these things just sitting around that people could devote to B&W > -- cheaply. Thanks, Paul. I've put in an order for the carts, and downloaded the curves. I always felt that I wasn't atypical, having bought a 2000P when it first came out because it was the first pig ink printer, but later upgraded to the 2200. Seems like a small but worthwhile market there. Is any consideration being given to selling UT2 carts for the 2000P? If that depends upon how many FS or FSN carts they sell, they should probably mention their availability for the 2000P in the New Products page. -- Ciao, Paul D. DeRocco Paul mailto:pderocco@...
RE: [Digital BW] MIS UT-FS carts for 2000P
2005-05-05 by Paul Roark
Paul, I've tried UT2 in a 2000P. The dots were a bit too prominent, and the 1280 curves did not work. So, it was going to be too much work for me to support it, since I didn't use the printer. However, it could work well. This is what I'd do. First, I'd probably use the UT7 inks (except the LK and sepia) in the 2200 positions. The reasons the 1280 and 2200 ink positions are different is due to the dye v. pigment ink characteristics. With the 1280 spongeless carts available, this is easy to do. Second, I'd put UT-FS-Y in the yellow position. This can be used to take care of the highlight roughness. After that, you'd be on your own in terms of writing curves. However, they are not difficult, since the Epson driver takes care of most of the cross-overs. I've made a curve using the UT-FS-Y that would probably be close to what would work for most papers. The 2200 curves would then be the starting point for the rest of the curves. Paul www.PaulRoark.com
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> -----Original Message----- > From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Paul D. > DeRocco > Sent: Wednesday, May 04, 2005 5:28 PM > To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [Digital BW] MIS UT-FS carts for 2000P > > > From: Paul Roark > > > > I made a number of curves for the 2000P and UT-FS inks. The reason I > > bothered with this printer is that David Brooks is an > > acquaintance and had a > > 2000P lying around unused. We felt if it was OK for B&W, there might be > a > > number of these things just sitting around that people could devote to > B&W > > -- cheaply. > > Thanks, Paul. I've put in an order for the carts, and downloaded the > curves. > > I always felt that I wasn't atypical, having bought a 2000P when it first > came out because it was the first pig ink printer, but later upgraded to > the > 2200. Seems like a small but worthwhile market there. > > Is any consideration being given to selling UT2 carts for the 2000P? If > that > depends upon how many FS or FSN carts they sell, they should probably > mention their availability for the 2000P in the New Products page. > > -- > > Ciao, Paul D. DeRocco > Paul mailto:pderocco@... > > > > > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as > they are often being updated. > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint > > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to > unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same > page. > > Please follow these basic guidelines: > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep > them short. > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames. > Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the > membership without notice. > - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W > printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from > the membership. > - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and > guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner > and Moderators. See Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines in the Files > section: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/ > > BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT > YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE OWNER AND > MODERATORS OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO > YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR > EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF > PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE > OWNER AND MODERATORS OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN > ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE > OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) > UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) > STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT > YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE > PRINT YAHOO GROUP. > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >
RE: [Digital BW] MIS UT-FS carts for 2000P
2005-05-05 by Paul D. DeRocco
> From: Paul Roark > > I've tried UT2 in a 2000P. The dots were a bit too prominent, > and the 1280 > curves did not work. So, it was going to be too much work for me > to support it, since I didn't use the printer. > > However, it could work well. This is what I'd do. First, I'd > probably use > the UT7 inks (except the LK and sepia) in the 2200 positions. The reasons > the 1280 and 2200 ink positions are different is due to the dye v. pigment > ink characteristics. With the 1280 spongeless carts available, > this is easy > to do. > > Second, I'd put UT-FS-Y in the yellow position. This can be used to take > care of the highlight roughness. > > After that, you'd be on your own in terms of writing curves. > However, they > are not difficult, since the Epson driver takes care of most of the > cross-overs. I've made a curve using the UT-FS-Y that would probably be > close to what would work for most papers. The 2200 curves would > then be the starting point for the rest of the curves. I mostly print color, which is why I've waited for carts to be available. One set would probably last me quite a while. So I doubt I'll get into the curve building hobby. But just out of curiosity, is it possible to buy the MIS 1280 spongeless carts and replace the chips with ones yanked from used Epson 2000P carts? -- Ciao, Paul D. DeRocco Paul mailto:pderocco@...
RE: [Digital BW] MIS UT-FS carts for 2000P
2005-05-05 by Paul Roark
> ... just out of curiosity, is it possible to buy the MIS 1280 spongeless > carts and replace the chips with ones yanked from used Epson 2000P carts? Yes, the 1280 and 2000P carts are the same. MIS should have the 2000P chips, or you could just pull one off an old Epson 2000P cart. The Epson chips reset just like the others, at least with the ones I've tried. Note that with the resetter I have the 1280 color carts do not align correctly. I reset the color cart chip by temporarily putting it on a black cart first. Paul www.PaulRoark.com
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> -----Original Message----- > From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Paul D. > DeRocco > Sent: Wednesday, May 04, 2005 6:34 PM > To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [Digital BW] MIS UT-FS carts for 2000P > > > From: Paul Roark > > > > I've tried UT2 in a 2000P. The dots were a bit too prominent, > > and the 1280 > > curves did not work. So, it was going to be too much work for me > > to support it, since I didn't use the printer. > > > > However, it could work well. This is what I'd do. First, I'd > > probably use > > the UT7 inks (except the LK and sepia) in the 2200 positions. The > reasons > > the 1280 and 2200 ink positions are different is due to the dye v. > pigment > > ink characteristics. With the 1280 spongeless carts available, > > this is easy > > to do. > > > > Second, I'd put UT-FS-Y in the yellow position. This can be used to > take > > care of the highlight roughness. > > > > After that, you'd be on your own in terms of writing curves. > > However, they > > are not difficult, since the Epson driver takes care of most of the > > cross-overs. I've made a curve using the UT-FS-Y that would probably be > > close to what would work for most papers. The 2200 curves would > > then be the starting point for the rest of the curves. > > I mostly print color, which is why I've waited for carts to be available. > One set would probably last me quite a while. So I doubt I'll get into the > curve building hobby. > > But just out of curiosity, is it possible to buy the MIS 1280 spongeless > carts and replace the chips with ones yanked from used Epson 2000P carts? > > -- > > Ciao, Paul D. DeRocco > Paul mailto:pderocco@... > > > > > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as > they are often being updated. > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint > > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to > unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same > page. > > Please follow these basic guidelines: > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep > them short. > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames. > Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the > membership without notice. > - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W > printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from > the membership. > - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and > guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner > and Moderators. See Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines in the Files > section: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/ > > BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT > YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE OWNER AND > MODERATORS OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO > YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR > EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF > PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE > OWNER AND MODERATORS OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN > ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE > OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) > UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) > STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT > YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE > PRINT YAHOO GROUP. > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >
RE: [Digital BW] MIS UT-FS carts for 2000P (attn Paul Roark)
2005-05-14 by Paul D. DeRocco
> From: Paul Roark > > I made a number of curves for the 2000P and UT-FS inks. The reason I > bothered with this printer is that David Brooks is an > acquaintance and had a > 2000P lying around unused. We felt if it was OK for B&W, there might be a > number of these things just sitting around that people could devote to B&W > -- cheaply. I received my 2000P UT-FS and UT-FSN carts, and tried them out with your curves. The tonality looks fine, but I'm disappointed in the grain. Light areas show a nice clean wash of one of the lighter inks, speckled with rather widely spaced black dots from the black cart. To the naked eye, I can't see the dots, but I can sense the grain. The result is certainly better than BO printing, but not as good as I get with my 2200 and ImagePrint. I'm wondering if it's even possible to get smooth transitions among the four densities, if you're limited to talking to the printer through the Epson RGB interface. Can you tell me what densities are in each of the five chambers of the 2000P cart, so I can begin to figure this out? Also, I'm wondering if anyone has gotten QTR to work with the 2000P and any of these quadtone inks. I've never played with QTR, so am I right in assuming that it has the ability to control the inks directly, instead of having to spoof RGB values? -- Ciao, Paul D. DeRocco Paul mailto:pderocco@...
RE: [Digital BW] MIS UT-FS carts for 2000P (attn Paul Roark)
2005-05-14 by Paul Roark
Paul, I don't have a 2000P here any more, but I found my 2000P folder and looked at the EEM 21-step test strip; it looks fairly good to me. So, I'm not sure why you're not getting smooth results. Here are the visual densities on EEM: With Color Controls checked: K = 1.72, C = .41, M = .92, Y = .37, LC = .30, LM = .56; With NCA checked: K = 1.71, C = 1.31, M = 1.31, Y = .51, LC = .50, LM = .48. I would have thought that my RGB curves would have been smoother than the grayscale curves, but when I compare the PremierArt RGB and GS prints, if the GS file was 16 bit when the curve was applied, the prints look about the same. In both cases the dots are barely visible even with a loupe. PA, like PhotoRag, does tend to hide dots better than some papers. I once had a contact who had a 2000P and 1280. Even though the 2000P dots may be a bit larger than the 1280's, he was convinced that the 2000P had a better dither and looked smoother than the 1280. I was not entirely convinced of his arguments, but the high resolution scans he had comparing the 2 certainly didn't show the 1280 as being clearly smoother. They looked very close to me -- which is good. Paul www.PaulRoark.com
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> From: Paul D. DeRocco > > > > From: Paul Roark > > > > I made a number of curves for the 2000P and UT-FS inks. The reason I > > bothered with this printer is that David Brooks is an > > acquaintance and had a > > 2000P lying around unused. We felt if it was OK for B&W, there might be > a > > number of these things just sitting around that people could devote to > B&W > > -- cheaply. > > I received my 2000P UT-FS and UT-FSN carts, and tried them out with your > curves. The tonality looks fine, but I'm disappointed in the grain. Light > areas show a nice clean wash of one of the lighter inks, speckled with > rather widely spaced black dots from the black cart. To the naked eye, I > can't see the dots, but I can sense the grain. The result is certainly > better than BO printing, but not as good as I get with my 2200 and > ImagePrint. > > I'm wondering if it's even possible to get smooth transitions among the > four > densities, if you're limited to talking to the printer through the Epson > RGB > interface. Can you tell me what densities are in each of the five chambers > of the 2000P cart, so I can begin to figure this out? > > Also, I'm wondering if anyone has gotten QTR to work with the 2000P and > any > of these quadtone inks. I've never played with QTR, so am I right in > assuming that it has the ability to control the inks directly, instead of > having to spoof RGB values? > > -- > > Ciao, Paul D. DeRocco > Paul mailto:pderocco@... > > > > > Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files, and other resources as > they are often being updated. > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint > > If you wish to receive no emails or just a daily digest, or you wish to > unsubscribe, please edit your Membership preferences by visiting this same > page. > > Please follow these basic guidelines: > - As threads develop, trim off excess portions of earlier messages to keep > them short. > - Good manners are required at all time. No personal attacks or flames. > Hostile, aggressive or argumentative users may be removed from the > membership without notice. > - Keep your posts and threads related to the group topic of digital B&W > printing. Users who persistently make off-topic posts may be removed from > the membership. > - By posting on this forum you agree to abide by the group rules and > guidelines, and to abide by the actions and decisions of the group Owner > and Moderators. See Group Topic, Rules and Guidelines in the Files > section: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint/files/ > > BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT > YAHOO! GROUP YOU EXPRESSLY UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE OWNER AND > MODERATORS OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP SHALL NOT BE LIABLE TO > YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR > EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF > PROFITS, GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN IF THE > OWNER AND MODERATORS OF DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN > ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE > OR THE INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO GROUP; (ii) > UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) > STATEMENTS OR CONDUCT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT > YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING TO THE DIGITAL BW, THE > PRINT YAHOO GROUP. > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >