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2005-08-22 by claudej1@aol.com
Among the newly announced cameras is the 5D, which is a full frame 35mm CMOS chip with over 12.8 Megapixel resolution. Lots of great features for only $3,300. So you holdouts get out your credit cards now. Shipping in early Oct. Claude [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
2005-08-22 by bwbonkers
Just been reading about this. Canon have answered my wish list, I think. 1) Full frame in a compact body - 1Ds Mk2 is just to big for my use. 2) 12 + Megapixel - using 300 ppi print resolution should give just about A3 print size. 3) Better LCD display - Please please I hope the histogram is full screen. Luminance + RGB . My 10D histogram is just too small. 4) Plus the improvements of the 20D which I do not have on my 10D, such as instant on. 5) Spot metering. 6) What looks like a sensible price. Still alot of money but you get alot too. I hope it lives up to the specs. Peter. --- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, claudej1@a... wrote: > Among the newly announced cameras is the 5D, which is a full frame 35mm CMOS > chip with over 12.8 Megapixel resolution. Lots of great features for only
> $3,300. > > So you holdouts get out your credit cards now. Shipping in early Oct. > > Claude > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
2005-08-23 by claudej1@aol.com
In a message dated 8/23/2005 4:27:28 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com writes: Will be interesting to see what the new Canon specs. are, as Nikon blew them away with the D2x. regards, Peter. "Blew away!!??" Please...........Nikon is 1-2 years late with this camera. I have owned 30 different digital cameras in the last 10 years, starting with Kodaks in Nikon and Canon bodies in the nineties, $50,000 Foveon Prism camera (as a consultant to them) in 1999. So I was one of maybe 10 people in the world to have advanced CMOS technology in 1999. The Foveon with the Canon L zooms caused me to sell all my Hasselblads (4 bodies, 6 backs and 9 Zeiss lenses) by 2000, leaving me with just the SWC (which I sold in 2001) and my Sinar 4x5 as the only remaining film camera (used once since). In the new millenium, Ihave owned all the Fuji's (save the S3), Nikons and Canons. The Canon D-30 came closest to Foveon color performance (the gold standard). I hated the consistent chalked out highlights from the Nikon CCD cameras. I could spot an Nikon image from a mile away. This is their first CMOS offering while Canon is on their 5th generation. The Canon 1D Mark II's (2 bodies) have been all-around the best cameras I have ever owned. I can do full res. family portraits to 24x36 on a 7600, shoot Weddings at only 4 megapixels, or crank 2 Megapixel Little League JPG shots at 8.5 frames per second. I can also knock out an attacking animal with the solid body, flip the camera around, and shoot 10 frames of it before it hits the ground. I can photograph Weddings in luxuious hotels, hand-held at ISO 1600 or 3200, and with the ExpoDisc for custom white balancing the tungsten illumination, render the entire room as though it was daylight. Or, I can go to an exotic location with a 50mm lens, and bring home jepegs that make incredible 12x18 BO prints on my 4000 with very minor tweaking. With the 8.2 Micron well sites, the 1Dm2's CMOS chip has the highest signal to noise of all the Canons (over 12 stops). It looks like they have just made full frame version of the same technology, with the improved, multi-stage noise reduction of the 20d. This means that 1600 ISO will have better S/N than Velvia 100 film with 645 MF resolution or ISO 800 on the 1D mkII, and 1600 on the 20d. I can guarantee you that it is Canon that will "blow away" the D2x in the real world. With superior optics to start with and a well site pitch that demands a much lower LPMM perfmance from the lens, the image quality will be just fine. Does that make Nikon's D2x bad? Of course not, but just because Nikon has just scored another goal, let's not forget who the champs are. Nikon, with it's Sony-made, 5.3 Micron well site pitch cannot possibly compete with that on the signal to noise front. It's just plain physics and material properties. I have seen ISO 800 files from the D2X (I also used to own the D1, D1x, and D1H for a brief time). They are MUCH noisier than the Canon 1D MkII, the 20d or the Digital Rebel. Let's face it. Sony's BS marketing campaign about their "fourth color" in their 8 Mpx prosumer cameras is their way of stealing some signal from the green channel in order to compensate for the fact that blue wavelengths won't penetrate a silicon well that is less than 3 microns and those chips are at 2.7!! So as a guy who has tested every major camera in the last 10 years, I respectfully disagree about your emotional assesment concerning Nikon's D2x performance vs. anything Canon. I own Canon and Nikon glass, so my choice of bodies has nothing to do with brand loyalty, only pure performance, and I assure you that Canon didn't get their 70% market share in all major portrait studios in America along with about 90% in the Sports Illustrated wannabe market by being second best at ANYTHING they have done in the last 4 years. And here's a kicker for you. I'll bet a dollar to a doughnut that Canon will announce, within a year, a 1Ds Mk III that has a full frame 24 megapixel perfmance equal to the 20d. Claude [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
2005-08-23 by James Irelan
On Aug 23, 2005, at 9:57 AM, claudej1@... wrote: > > > > Nikon, with it's Sony-made, 5.3 Micron well site pitch cannot possibly > compete with that on the signal to noise front. It's just plain > physics and > material properties. I have seen ISO 800 files from the D2X (I also > used to own the > D1, D1x, and D1H for a brief time). They are MUCH noisier than the > Canon 1D > MkII, the 20d or the Digital Rebel. Maybe this is what I saw a couple of years ago when I was considering the Digital Rebel and the Sony 8 MP camera (I can't remember the model now), both of which were pretty new at the time. The 8 MP were compelling at the time, but when I saw comparisons of images of both cameras on Steve's Digicam site, I thought the noise of the Sony was unacceptable. And I could find only a couple of favorable reviews, one of which said oh, you'll never see the noise in a real print. Maybe. I wasn't convinced, though. James
2005-08-23 by Elwood Spedden
I have a great deal of experience with CMOS sensors
produced by DALSA in Toronto. We used them in high
precision cameras to test the properties of LCD
displays at production sites at LG electronics,
Samsung, and many Japanese and Taiwanese
manufacturers.
These were simply the best CMOS large pixel count
sensors available. I am now very interested that
Mamiya has selected DALSA for the sensors for their
new ZD MF digital camera (22 MPix.)
If Nikon could break the Japan only approach and go
for the best of breed, they could probably have a 22
MPX or higher sensor available in the next 18 Months.
I would never have believed it possible until Mamiya
chose quality over Japan Inc.
Could be some very interesting times ahead and all to
the benefit of us, the shooters.
Woody Spedden
--- James Irelan <james@...> wrote:
---------------------------------
On Aug 23, 2005, at 9:57 AM, claudej1@... wrote:
>
>
>
> Nikon, with it's Sony-made, 5.3 Micron well site
pitch cannot possibly
> compete with that on the signal to noise front. It's
just plain
> physics and
> material properties. I have seen ISO 800 files from
the D2X (I also
> used to own the
> D1, D1x, and D1H for a brief time). They are MUCH
noisier than the
> Canon 1D
> MkII, the 20d or the Digital Rebel.
Maybe this is what I saw a couple of years ago when I
was considering
the Digital Rebel and the Sony 8 MP camera (I can't
remember the
model now), both of which were pretty new at the time.
The 8 MP were
compelling at the time, but when I saw comparisons of
images of both
cameras on Steve's Digicam site, I thought the noise
of the Sony was
unacceptable. And I could find only a couple of
favorable reviews,
one of which said oh, you'll never see the noise in a
real print.
Maybe. I wasn't convinced, though.
James
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---------------------------------2005-08-23 by James Irelan
I am now very interested that Mamiya has selected DALSA for the sensors for their new ZD MF digital camera (22 MPix.) This one surely seems like it will be in a class by itself, when it comes out, doubtlessly with a price tag to match. Any info on its schedule, or price? James
2005-08-23 by Adam Maas
Elwood Spedden wrote: > I have a great deal of experience with CMOS sensors > produced by DALSA in Toronto. We used them in high > precision cameras to test the properties of LCD > displays at production sites at LG electronics, > Samsung, and many Japanese and Taiwanese > manufacturers. > > These were simply the best CMOS large pixel count > sensors available. I am now very interested that > Mamiya has selected DALSA for the sensors for their > new ZD MF digital camera (22 MPix.) > > If Nikon could break the Japan only approach and go > for the best of breed, they could probably have a 22 > MPX or higher sensor available in the next 18 Months. > I would never have believed it possible until Mamiya > chose quality over Japan Inc. > > Could be some very interesting times ahead and all to > the benefit of us, the shooters. > > Woody Spedden Pentax has been playing with the DALSA sensors or so I hear. Rumour has it that's what was in the never released MZ-D and possibly what will be in the rumoured D2. -Adam
2005-08-23 by Elwood Spedden
The ZD is very competitively priced. It is estimated
(with lots of insider dope) at $12,500. This compares
to 22,000 for the Hasselblad H1D and 21,000 for the
comparably sized digital back from Phase One which can
fit a number of bodies including the H1.
The ZD uses the outstanding Mamiya 645AF lenses so
unless this puppy has major warts the other guys are
going to be running for cover.
Woody
--- James Irelan <james@...> wrote:
---------------------------------
I am now very interested that
Mamiya has selected DALSA for the sensors for their
new ZD MF digital camera (22 MPix.)
This one surely seems like it will be in a class by
itself, when it
comes out, doubtlessly with a price tag to match. Any
info on its
schedule, or price?
James
Please visit the Group Homepage to check the Files,
and other resources as they are often being updated.
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group rules and guidelines, and to abide by the
actions and decisions of the group Owner and
Moderators. See \ufffdGroup Topic, Rules and Guidelines\ufffd in
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BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE
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UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE \ufffdOWNER\ufffd AND \ufffdMODERATORS\ufffd
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LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL,
SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING
BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS,
GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN
IF THE \ufffdOWNER\ufffd AND \ufffdMODERATORS\ufffd OF DIGITAL BW, THE
PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY
OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE
INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO
GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF
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---------------------------------2005-08-23 by scott_now_coming
"I am now very interested that > Mamiya has selected DALSA for the sensors for their > new ZD MF digital camera (22 MPix.)" Hi James, Can you provide a link to where you found this info? I noticed Phase One is going to use Kodak chips in their new digital backs: http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/cameras/phase-one-0705.shtml Scroll down the page til you see "Up-Date" Scott
2005-08-23 by James Irelan
On Aug 23, 2005, at 1:15 PM, scott_now_coming wrote: > "I am now very interested that > > Mamiya has selected DALSA for the sensors for their > > new ZD MF digital camera (22 MPix.)" > > Hi James, > > Can you provide a link to where you found this info? Sorry, wasn't me who said it. It might have been Woody. James
2005-08-23 by paulvtt
--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, claudej1@a... wrote: Claude While I do not have the experience you do with different digital cameras, I have been impressed with the images I got with the 10D and now with the 20D from Canon. I do agree with your assessment of the Nikon vs. Canon image quality. Please explain further the last paragraph of your message. I don't understand what you are saying there. A 1Ds full frame 24 megapixel equal to the 20D? Thanks PV www.pbase.com/paulv99k > And here's a kicker for you. I'll bet a dollar to a doughnut that Canon will > announce, within a year, a 1Ds Mk III that has a full frame 24 megapixel
> perfmance equal to the 20d. > > Claude > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
2005-08-23 by dfaprinting
--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, Elwood Spedden <elwood@w...> wrote: > The ZD is very competitively priced. It is estimated > (with lots of insider dope) at $12,500. This compares > to 22,000 for the Hasselblad H1D and 21,000 for the > comparably sized digital back from Phase One which can > fit a number of bodies including the H1. > > The ZD uses the outstanding Mamiya 645AF lenses so > unless this puppy has major warts the other guys are > going to be running for cover. > > Woody > Don't forget that it will use the other lenses too, just not with coupled metering, or AF. Too bad they didn't make the viewfinder detachable, then they could have coupled the metering to the older lenses (as an optional part).
2005-08-24 by Elwood Spedden
Hey
The links (there are several) can be found through
google by searching for Mamiya ZD reviews. One of the
reviews was from Popular Photography and I don't
recall the other.
Good Stuff
Woody
--- James Irelan <james@...> wrote:
---------------------------------
On Aug 23, 2005, at 1:15 PM, scott_now_coming wrote:
> "I am now very interested that
> > Mamiya has selected DALSA for the sensors for
their
> > new ZD MF digital camera (22 MPix.)"
>
> Hi James,
>
> Can you provide a link to where you found this info?
Sorry, wasn't me who said it. It might have been
Woody.
James
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BY PARTICIPATING IN AND/OR POSTING MESSAGES TO THE
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UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE \ufffdOWNER\ufffd AND \ufffdMODERATORS\ufffd
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LIABLE TO YOU FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL,
SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR EXEMPLARY DAMAGES, INCLUDING
BUT NOT LIMITED TO, DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF PROFITS,
GOODWILL, USE, DATA OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES (EVEN
IF THE \ufffdOWNER\ufffd AND \ufffdMODERATORS\ufffd OF DIGITAL BW, THE
PRINT YAHOO GROUP HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY
OF SUCH DAMAGES), RESULTING FROM: (i) THE USE OR THE
INABILITY TO USE THE DIGITAL BW, THE PRINT YAHOO
GROUP; (ii) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS TO OR ALTERATION OF
YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR DATA; (iii) STATEMENTS OR
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PRINT YAHOO GROUP; OR (iv) ANY OTHER MATTER RELATING
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---------------------------------