Digital BW, The Print

Hi all,
I am writing today because I am totally confused about printig. I am
going to start printing in black and white, and after all the reading
i did on the web i am even more confused about what I need to do to
get good quality prints. This is something I would like to get serious
about but it seems like all the joy is being drained out of it when i
start to try to educate my self about printing.
I am using a Epson 1280. I use photo shop to edit my images. I am
thinking about starting to use duotone instead of grey scale
conversions. My question's are.
1. do I need to have a printer icc profile for my printer?
2. what is the easyest way to get quality prints?
3. I allready have a spyder monitor calibrator is there any thing else
that i need?
4. I am just plain fed up and confused with reading and trying to
understand all of this on my own, can some one please guide me.
Thank you very much in advanced for your help. Troy

and i'm going to feel it even more, tonight, when i "upgrade" from 
the 1280 to R2400! and i may very well end up regretting it because 
i've had really good luck using the "Black Only" BO printing method 
w/ MIS inks and Red River Dourian and Aurora Art Papers.

BO Printing I learned here -  http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm

                 http://www.cjcom.net/articles/digiprn3.htm

and with the help of a really nice guy named Jim Arnold: 
http://www.jimarnold.org/


Even these this "simple" method took me a good week to get right. 

If you want to try BO printing feel free to contact me w/ specific 
questions. I'll do my best to help you.

All you need is Eboni Black Ink w/ a Color Cleaning Cart from MIS.

The Red River Papers are very nice and recommended by Clayton Jones.

Good Luck.

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Troy" 
<troy93955@...> wrote:
>
> Hi all,
> I am writing today because I am totally confused about printig. I am
> going to start printing in black and white, and after all the 
reading
> i did on the web i am even more confused about what I need to do to
> get good quality prints. This is something I would like to get 
serious
> about but it seems like all the joy is being drained out of it when 
i
> start to try to educate my self about printing.
> I am using a Epson 1280. I use photo shop to edit my images. I am
> thinking about starting to use duotone instead of grey scale
> conversions. My question's are.
> 1. do I need to have a printer icc profile for my printer?
> 2. what is the easyest way to get quality prints?
> 3. I allready have a spyder monitor calibrator is there any thing 
else

> that i need?
> 4. I am just plain fed up and confused with reading and trying to
> understand all of this on my own, can some one please guide me.
> Thank you very much in advanced for your help. Troy
>

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Troy" <troy93955@...> wrote:
>
Hello Troy,

Printing can seem daunting, but it really isn't as bad as it's sometimes made out to be. The 
worst thing is finding the paper you like! I understand you want to print duotones. There 
are some approaches I can talk about. 

1. Use the photoshop duotone filter. For this approach you'll need to use color inks with 
an ICC profile for the paper your using. This is a simple matter of downloading the profile 
from the maker of the paper, or using one of the profiles that came with your 1280 if you 
want. Keep in mind that the more greyscale the duotone, the more tweaking you'll need to 
do to get the tone just right. Custom profiles (if you can do that) should solve that 
problem. In my experience this is the hardest to successfully print, but maybe because I 
don't have the ability to develop custom profiles.

2. Use the MIS UltraTone inks for the 1280. For more information see Paul Roarks website. 
It's very informative and Paul's photos speak for themselves (he's very good!!). With the UT 
inks you can tone from cool to warm by "dialing up" a curve Paul provides. I've used 
variable tone MIS inks using P. Roark's instructions and they work very well.

3. Use Jon Cone's Piezography Neutral K6/7 inks from InkjetMall. You can vary the tones 
from cool to warm by using different papers. Cone has just released a Sepia K6/7 inkset 
and a Sepia split-tone inkset. A selenium tone inkset and selenium split-tone inkset will 
be released in the near future according to J. Cone. I'm currently using the Cone Neutral 
K7 (for my Epson 2200) on cool paper (Hahnemule Bright White) with great results. 
Sometimes I use neutral to warm papers such as Innova Smooth Cotton and Inkpress 
Picture Rag Warm. Cone's inks cost a bit more but they don't clog!!!!!! A huge advantage. 
As my preference is for selenium tone prints I'm waiting for the selenium split-tone inkset 
to be released.


At the end of the day I would stay away from using color inks for duotone because color 
inks fade faster and fade at varying rates, thus degrading your image. So I would  say to 
try the MIS variable tone inkset first because they are less expensive than Cone's inks and 
see how it works out for you. Follow Paul's instructions and recommdations as a starting 
point and you won't go wrong. If it doesn't work out for you try Cone's inks; they work 
very well for me.

Steve Harris

> Hi all,
> I am writing today because I am totally confused about printig. I am
> going to start printing in black and white, and after all the reading
> i did on the web i am even more confused about what I need to do to
> get good quality prints. This is something I would like to get serious
> about but it seems like all the joy is being drained out of it when i
> start to try to educate my self about printing.
> I am using a Epson 1280. I use photo shop to edit my images. I am
> thinking about starting to use duotone instead of grey scale
> conversions. My question's are.
> 1. do I need to have a printer icc profile for my printer?
> 2. what is the easyest way to get quality prints?
> 3. I allready have a spyder monitor calibrator is there any thing else
> that i need?
> 4. I am just plain fed up and confused with reading and trying to
> understand all of this on my own, can some one please guide me.
> Thank you very much in advanced for your help. Troy
>

I'm a newbie, and I'm just black only on my 1270 and quadtone blacks on my
3000 - quadtone 100% black in the 1270. And I use cheap paper. My market
doesn't require bug expenditures.

You can make it as difficult as you want.

gar

PS a few of the images I've prepared are duo-tone, so I'm heading there once
I get a handle on BO.

  -----Original Message-----
  From: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Troy
  Sent: Thursday, August 10, 2006 2:00 PM
  To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
  Subject: [Digital BW] printing


  Hi all,
  I am writing today because I am totally confused about printig. I am
  going to start printing in black and white, and after all the reading
  i did on the web i am even more confused about what I need to do to
  get good quality prints. This is something I would like to get serious
  about but it seems like all the joy is being drained out of it when i
  start to try to educate my self about printing.
  I am using a Epson 1280. I use photo shop to edit my images. I am
  thinking about starting to use duotone instead of grey scale
  conversions. My question's are.
  1. do I need to have a printer icc profile for my printer?
  2. what is the easyest way to get quality prints?
  3. I allready have a spyder monitor calibrator is there any thing else
  that i need?
  4. I am just plain fed up and confused with reading and trying to
  understand all of this on my own, can some one please guide me.
  Thank you very much in advanced for your help. Troy



  


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hello Troy,

>I am writing today because I am totally confused about printing
>...after all the reading i did on the web i am even more confused 
>...seems like all the joy is being drained out of it when i start 
>to try to educate my self about printing.
>...I am just plain fed up and confused with reading and trying to
>understand all of this on my own, can some one please guide me.
>Thank you very much in advanced for your help. 

Understood.  Been there.  There are a number of easy ways to get
started.  Please see the series of articles at this link for an
overview, especially article #2

  http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm


>using a Epson 1280. I use photo shop to edit my images. 

>1. do I need to have a printer icc profile for my printer?

Not necessarily.  Please see article #8 "It Doesn't Have To Be
Complicated" at the above link.


>2.what is the easyest way to get quality prints?

The absolutely easiest way IMO is Black Only (BO) printing, and the
1280 does a fine job with that (article #3 and 3b at above link).  

After that, for your 1280, is probably using the MIS UT2 inks.  This
requires a bigger investment in ink (an entire set), dedicating the
printer to BW, and  is a bit more challenging to use.  See Paul
Roark's UT2 web page for details

    http://home1.gte.net/res09aij/UT2-Readme.htm

Reading these articles should clarify a lot of the issues and make it
easier to decide what first step to take.  I too had a difficult time
in the beginning, and starting out with BO printing "got me on first
base", so to speak.   It enabled me to get started with small expense
and easy learning curve, and to have some success and reduce the
frustration.  The experience gained working that way is invaluable,
and any time you feel ready you can branch out and try other things.

Regards,
Clayton


Info on black and white digital printing at    
http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm

Hi folks -- I'm a little disheartened too, but glad to see this post
-- I will follow it and see.  I had such phenomenal results with the
EZ MIS inks on my C84 that I went ahead and got a 1280 and UT2 set,
but no comparison yet.  I'm out in the weeds here.  The four curves I
have for the UT2s with the 1280 are nowhere near the "warm" EZs I was
using and getting such good results with.  I have to either figure how
to warm u0p the neutral or cool off the carbon.  

Clayton -- let me know how you fare!

Michael

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "Clayton Jones"
<cj@...> wrote:

>
> Hello Troy,
> 
> >I am writing today because I am totally confused about printing
> >...after all the reading i did on the web i am even more confused 
> >...seems like all the joy is being drained out of it when i start 
> >to try to educate my self about printing.
> >...I am just plain fed up and confused with reading and trying to
> >understand all of this on my own, can some one please guide me.
> >Thank you very much in advanced for your help. 
> 
> Understood.  Been there.  There are a number of easy ways to get
> started.  Please see the series of articles at this link for an
> overview, especially article #2
> 
>   http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm
> 
> 
> >using a Epson 1280. I use photo shop to edit my images. 
> 
> >1. do I need to have a printer icc profile for my printer?
> 
> Not necessarily.  Please see article #8 "It Doesn't Have To Be
> Complicated" at the above link.
> 
> 
> >2.what is the easyest way to get quality prints?
> 
> The absolutely easiest way IMO is Black Only (BO) printing, and the
> 1280 does a fine job with that (article #3 and 3b at above link).  
> 
> After that, for your 1280, is probably using the MIS UT2 inks.  This
> requires a bigger investment in ink (an entire set), dedicating the
> printer to BW, and  is a bit more challenging to use.  See Paul
> Roark's UT2 web page for details
> 
>     http://home1.gte.net/res09aij/UT2-Readme.htm
> 
> Reading these articles should clarify a lot of the issues and make it
> easier to decide what first step to take.  I too had a difficult time
> in the beginning, and starting out with BO printing "got me on first
> base", so to speak.   It enabled me to get started with small expense
> and easy learning curve, and to have some success and reduce the
> frustration.  The experience gained working that way is invaluable,
> and any time you feel ready you can branch out and try other things.
> 
> Regards,
> Clayton
> 
> 
> Info on black and white digital printing at    
> http://www.cjcom.net/digiprnarts.htm
>

>... 1280 and UT2 set,...
> The four curves I have for the UT2s with the 1280 are 
> nowhere near the "warm" EZs I was
> using and getting such good results with. ...

See my Readme file at http://home1.gte.net/res09aij/UT2-Readme.htm

There are 2 basic workflows -- sliders and curves.  The sliders can't reach
a very warm tone.  The curves can print as warm as the C84 warm.  You want
the carbon curve.  For even warmer, use the sepia curve.

My curves are downloaded from http://home1.gte.net/res09aij/UT2-curves.html

Note that when using curves the driver should be set to "No Color
Adjustment."  For the curves, you want to follow the workflow #2 in the
Readme file, above.

Good luck with your system.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com