Digital BW, The Print

Since I've started to learn monochrome printing I'm trying to figure out the best set of inks. I put results of my experiments in article in my blog http://photo3dart.com/wordpress/?p=334

What do you think?

Thanks, Jacob Mann
http://www.photo3dart.com

"Jacob" <flashinet@...> wrote:
>
> Since I've started to learn monochrome printing I'm trying to figure out the best set of inks. I put results of my experiments in article in my blog http://photo3dart.com/wordpress/?p=334

I think you've basically got it.  You don't mention what printer you're using, and the results will differ with different generations of printer.  The 1400 and other 1.5 picoliter drop drop printers are acceptably smooth with black only printing for many people and types of images.

Note that the 3-MK workflow of the 1800 used 3 mostly because the 1800 is subject to microbanding with less.

The full hextone monotone printers, also known as K6 or the like, are the smoothest, whether it's the Eboni-6 or Piezo/K6 from Jon Cone.  

However, one category of inkset that you might also want to explore is the variable tone inksets.  The UT14 for the 1400 is one.  These inksets are made to be very flexible, printing on matte or glossy paper, neutral-cool or carbon-warm without changing any inks.  Any inkset that is neutral or cool does, however, have color ink mixed in with the carbon.

The Eboni-6 inkset is the more neutral inkset that uses 100% carbon as far as I know.

Good luck with your B&W.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

Paul,
I'm using 1400. Probably for 1800 3K makes more sense.
Now I want to try to cool off Eb6, I saw your advice to try LC from UT14, I'll get it today. I'll try to use it as toner in QTR.
From what you are saying I understand that this ink has colorant in it which makes it cool, is it right?
Eboni-6 is close to neutral in dark prints, but for dark prints I like  BO, with increased luminosity it looks better and also cooler than EB6, probably because it doesn't use diluted inks that are very warm.

Is your Eboni 1400 set with HP PK has less colorants?

I understand that I could get neutral look with certain papers but I don't like to exchange colorants for OBA.

Is Piezography K6 less or more neutral than Eboni6? Do they use colorants?

Thank you,
Jacob
http://www.photo3dart.com

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "pr_roark" <pr_roark@...> wrote:

>
> "Jacob" <flashinet@> wrote:
> >
> > Since I've started to learn monochrome printing I'm trying to figure out the best set of inks. I put results of my experiments in article in my blog http://photo3dart.com/wordpress/?p=334
> 
> I think you've basically got it.  You don't mention what printer you're using, and the results will differ with different generations of printer.  The 1400 and other 1.5 picoliter drop drop printers are acceptably smooth with black only printing for many people and types of images.
> 
> Note that the 3-MK workflow of the 1800 used 3 mostly because the 1800 is subject to microbanding with less.
> 
> The full hextone monotone printers, also known as K6 or the like, are the smoothest, whether it's the Eboni-6 or Piezo/K6 from Jon Cone.  
> 
> However, one category of inkset that you might also want to explore is the variable tone inksets.  The UT14 for the 1400 is one.  These inksets are made to be very flexible, printing on matte or glossy paper, neutral-cool or carbon-warm without changing any inks.  Any inkset that is neutral or cool does, however, have color ink mixed in with the carbon.
> 
> The Eboni-6 inkset is the more neutral inkset that uses 100% carbon as far as I know.
> 
> Good luck with your B&W.
> 
> Paul
> www.PaulRoark.com
>

"flashinet" <flashinet@...> wrote:
>
> I'm using 1400. 

> Now I want to try to cool off Eb6, 

I often print Eb6 (in Eb1400) profile 50% and Eboni BO 50%, using the QTR sliders.  That is, since the BO is more neutral, you can mix the 2 profiles compromise warmth v. smoothness by how much or each profile you use, and it's still 100% carbon.

> I saw your advice to try LC from UT14, I'll get it today. 
> I'll try to use it as toner in QTR.

I actually use HP-PK, which I think will be more stable in terms of color shift.  With the HP-PK you can also mix a 30% PK light version with the C6 generic base.  I found a mix of even the 100% HP PK with Eb6 and even a bit of Eb BO gave a largely carbon print that was smoother and would probably be more stable than any other combination.  The MIS UT-LC is less expensive than the 100% HP PK, but a 30% PK-HP is about the same as the MIS ink price.  I personally don't think the 30% HP-PK is needed.  So, I just use it at 100% concentration.

> From what you are saying I understand that this ink has colorant
> in it which makes it cool, is it right?

Yes, all of the neutral inks have colorants in them.  100% Eboni black only is the most neutral pure carbon I've found.  Dilute Eboni is the most neutral pure carbon dilute carbon I've found.

You'll note that with the K4+ ink arrangement I was using for a while, I used Epson light magenta.  The third party magentas tend to be weak.    This causes a green shift with age.  It showed up in my fade tests, and it showed up in the Piezotone selenium Aardenburg fade test, even at only 10 Mlux hours of exposure.  Getting the best color pigments that are matched in terms of fade rate is the trick, and I think HP PK has done the best job of that.

> Is your Eboni 1400 set with HP PK has less colorants?

The HP-PK is the only ink that has colorants in it.  
See page 2 of http://www.paulroark.com/BW-Info/Eb1400.pdf 

> I understand that I could get neutral look with certain papers 
> but I don't like to exchange colorants for OBA.

I hear you.  You'll see the direction I'm exploring -- Arches HP BW watercolor paper.  Cheap full sheets at Dick Blick's, no OBAs, no coating to pop off, far easier retouching, the lowest delta Lab B with dilute carbon, and I suspect higher acceptance in the fine art market.    

> Is Piezography K6 less or more neutral than Eboni6? 
> Do they use colorants?

The Piezotones use colorants (except the sepia) and are about the same as the MIS inks in that respect.  No one has come up with a more neutral carbon than Eboni as far as I know.  Even the large companies want one of these but so far have failed.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

Paul,
I'm really appreciated for your help.
Your idea to use BO and EB6 with QTR is brilliant.
I've used split toning, set highlights to BO 100%, midtones 30% BO and dark tones to 100% EB6. Resuls: brilliant silver-toned neutral highlights, slightly warm midtones and almost neutral blacks.
The print was printed on Moab 190 Natural. 
I think this is great, pretty close to neutral print with carbon inks only.

Jacob