Digital BW, The Print

I had the pleasure of viewing part of a portfolio of B&W images made with several different inkjet approaches yesterday.  While I favor matte paper for my display prints, the high contrast subject matter of the portfolio, at least when not under glass, looked really terrific in a high gloss print.  And by far the most impressive glossy prints were the Claria black only prints.  If you like dramatic, high gloss B&W you ought to see what the Claria inkset in a 1400 using QTR can do.

That, of course, got me wondering as to the longevity of the Claria black.  I've been told that many of the traditional dye inksets use a hybrid carbon-dye technology, in part because it bleeds less than 100% dye.  So, the longevity of the Claria black, if it uses some carbon and some of the very impressive Claria color dyes, might be good enough for many if not most uses.

There is no Aardenburg test of a Claria Black Only print that I know of.  However, we can get a few pieces of evidence that are suggestive.

In 50 MLux Hour Aardenburg tests of Claria (on Premium Luster) and Cone Portfoloio black (on HPR), the Claria black appeared to be more stable.  The Claria Max Black I* Color rating was 89.5, with a delta E of 1.6.  The Portfolio Max Black had an I* Color or 79.7 with a delta e of 3.5.  (The average Selenium Tone Piezotone rating was I* Color 85.5 and delta e 2.4.) Museum Black, of course, turned in much better ratings, with a I* color or 98.8 and delta e of 0.9.

I doubt a Claria black only print would be considered "fine art," but I'm not sure where that line is.  My reaction to the prints I saw, however, was that I'd sure like to have that ink available in bulk, or even have it be able to be loaded into a 1400 along with other inks of interest.  (The Epson and MIS chips appear to be incompatible.)  I don't think any glossy pigment prints I've seen can match the look of the Claria Black Only.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "pr_roark" <roark.paul@...> wrote:
  I don't think any glossy pigment prints I've seen can match the look of the Claria Black Only.
> 
> Paul
> www.PaulRoark.com
>

Very interesting Paul. I wonder how the Claria generics compare in longevity and appearance.

"hp9180profile" <owens@...> wrote:
 

> I wonder how the Claria generics compare in longevity and appearance.
>

I think all the alleged Claria-like third party inks are just old style dyes -- i.e., not close.  Claria is not a normal dye, it's almost a mini pigment and better than many third party color pigments.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

pr_roark schreef:
> "hp9180profile" <owens@...> wrote:
>  
> 
>> I wonder how the Claria generics compare in longevity and appearance.
>>
> 
> I think all the alleged Claria-like third party inks are just old style dyes -- i.e., not close.  Claria is not a normal dye, it's almost a mini pigment and better than many third party color pigments.
> 
> Paul
> www.PaulRoark.com 

When it was introduced there were some hints in the Epson docs that 
suggested that. We discussed that then.

-- 
Met vriendelijke groeten,   Ernst


Dinkla Gallery Canvas Wrap Actions

|      Dinkla Grafische Techniek      |
|         www.pigment-print.com        |
|                 ( unvollendet )                 |

Do you know how the Lyson CIS inks for the 1400 compare ? Lyson claim similar or better 'quality'. Certainly general colour printing is good. I wonder if the Lyson/Claria version is worth exploring.
I love my 3MK/1800 results, but there are some images that just cry out for a gloss or satin paper.
Chris
UK 

--- In DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com, "pr_roark" <roark.paul@...> wrote:

>
> I had the pleasure of viewing part of a portfolio of B&W images made with several different inkjet approaches yesterday.  While I favor matte paper for my display prints, the high contrast subject matter of the portfolio, at least when not under glass, looked really terrific in a high gloss print.  And by far the most impressive glossy prints were the Claria black only prints.  If you like dramatic, high gloss B&W you ought to see what the Claria inkset in a 1400 using QTR can do.
> 
> That, of course, got me wondering as to the longevity of the Claria black.  I've been told that many of the traditional dye inksets use a hybrid carbon-dye technology, in part because it bleeds less than 100% dye.  So, the longevity of the Claria black, if it uses some carbon and some of the very impressive Claria color dyes, might be good enough for many if not most uses.
> 
> There is no Aardenburg test of a Claria Black Only print that I know of.  However, we can get a few pieces of evidence that are suggestive.
> 
> In 50 MLux Hour Aardenburg tests of Claria (on Premium Luster) and Cone Portfoloio black (on HPR), the Claria black appeared to be more stable.  The Claria Max Black I* Color rating was 89.5, with a delta E of 1.6.  The Portfolio Max Black had an I* Color or 79.7 with a delta e of 3.5.  (The average Selenium Tone Piezotone rating was I* Color 85.5 and delta e 2.4.) Museum Black, of course, turned in much better ratings, with a I* color or 98.8 and delta e of 0.9.
> 
> I doubt a Claria black only print would be considered "fine art," but I'm not sure where that line is.  My reaction to the prints I saw, however, was that I'd sure like to have that ink available in bulk, or even have it be able to be loaded into a 1400 along with other inks of interest.  (The Epson and MIS chips appear to be incompatible.)  I don't think any glossy pigment prints I've seen can match the look of the Claria Black Only.
> 
> Paul
> www.PaulRoark.com
>

"bobtail75" <cperfect594@...> wrote:
 
> Do you know how the Lyson CIS inks for the 1400 compare ? ...

I have no experience with Lyson inks.  I think Aardenburg Imaging has some fade tests of their pigments.  I'd be pleasantly surprised if there are any third party Claria-type dyes.  If someone finds some, please let us know.  Hopefully a third party claim of comparable longevity would be backed up with some type of testing.

Paul
www.PaulRoark.com

Paul, I recently asked your advice regarding using MIS inks on top of theClaria color inks without flushing. You responded that you had no evidence of it not working. You were right. I just had my first B&W WOW using QTR as the driver. The print was good in PSCS4, but better with the QTR.

Can you explain Claira Black only for me. I want to see what you saw.
Thanks
R Craig Blackman
Professor Emeritus of IT and ENGM
Graduating Engineering
Christian Brotrhers University
Memphis, TN  34106
(O) 901.321.32823 (H) 901. 853.6946
cblack@...;blac1588@...




________________________________

From: pr_roark <roark.paul@...>
To: DigitalBlackandWhiteThePrint@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Fri, February 26, 2010 5:30:06 PM
Subject: [Digital BW] 1400 Claria Black Only

  
I had the pleasure of viewing part of a portfolio of B&W images made with several different inkjet approaches yesterday. While I favor matte paper for my display prints, the high contrast subject matter of the portfolio, at least when not under glass, looked really terrific in a high gloss print. And by far the most impressive glossy prints were the Claria black only prints. If you like dramatic, high gloss B&W you ought to see what the Claria inkset in a 1400 using QTR can do.

That, of course, got me wondering as to the longevity of the Claria black. I've been told that many of the traditional dye inksets use a hybrid carbon-dye technology, in part because it bleeds less than 100% dye. So, the longevity of the Claria black, if it uses some carbon and some of the very impressive Claria color dyes, might be good enough for many if not most uses.

There is no Aardenburg test of a Claria Black Only print that I know of. However, we can get a few pieces of evidence that are suggestive.

In 50 MLux Hour Aardenburg tests of Claria (on Premium Luster) and Cone Portfoloio black (on HPR), the Claria black appeared to be more stable. The Claria Max Black I* Color rating was 89.5, with a delta E of 1.6. The Portfolio Max Black had an I* Color or 79.7 with a delta e of 3.5. (The average Selenium Tone Piezotone rating was I* Color 85.5 and delta e 2.4.) Museum Black, of course, turned in much better ratings, with a I* color or 98.8 and delta e of 0.9.

I doubt a Claria black only print would be considered "fine art," but I'm not sure where that line is. My reaction to the prints I saw, however, was that I'd sure like to have that ink available in bulk, or even have it be able to be loaded into a 1400 along with other inks of interest. (The Epson and MIS chips appear to be incompatible. ) I don't think any glossy pigment prints I've seen can match the look of the Claria Black Only.

Paul
www.PaulRoark. com 




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