Doepfer

Hi all, great group, long time lurker, first time poster. 

Since I've got a bit of spare time (as if) I thought I might build an
interesting controller for my modular (doepfer, AS, harvestman). I
need something to send gates and control voltages, but not scaled as a
keyboard since a lot of my stuff is microtonal, or involves switching
between odd frequencies that work well together through eg ring
modulators, or by setting controls on eg A112. I've got some vague
troubleshooting and assembly skills but I am no electronics ninja, so
I'd be grateful for pointers on the circuitry which should be very
simple. 

What I am planning is this, and it's rudimentary:

1. Obviously I want a control surface which looks pretty. This one
will be very pretty once I have attacked it with the dremel and my
extensive collection of nice knobs.

http://uk.rs-online.com/web/search/searchBrowseAction.html?method=getProduct&R=2071515#header

2. Nice big buttons (got lots lying around) to send gates

3. Nice big knobs on potentiometers which will let me set control
voltages, with momentary switches etc to choose between them.

As far as I can see the electronics side of it is going to be pretty
simple. Here is my kludge plan, please forgive/assist me if it is loopy:

For the gates, which are a positive going 5v, to avoid messing around
with voltage regulators etc, I will just take the 5v from the power
supply ribbon, and use that to feed my gate switches, with a 470 ohm
resistor to avoid short circuits. 

For CV I will just take the 12v +ve from the power supply, feed it
into linear 10k-100k pots, using those as attenuators, and then I'll
have my nice CV out the other side in a minijack. Should I bung
something in there so that I can use the full travel of the pots,
instead of being stuck with 0-12v?

Then I will have momentary switches, and selectors, etc, to choose
between eg which CV is going to an oscillator at a given time.
Switching between those will of course produces horrible glitches, I'm
sure. No problem.

Does this sound okay, or do I need to delve into it more deeply and
have some proper circuity in there? Hopefully not.

Later I'll built some fun stuff into the controller too. I want to
make a mechanical sequencer with a rotating wiper on metal plates.

This sounds great. I've been wanting to create something
like this for about a year also. I'm curious to hear folks
thoughts. I'd also like to contact you off line to speak
in person.
Herman/Soy Sos

If you want some inspiration on a different direction for what to make  
synth hardware look like - check out the stuff done by Folktek:

http://ariusblaze.com/soundart.html

http://folktek.com/benhouston/instruments.html

http://folktek.com/ariusandben.html

Very cool looking "Steam-punk" like stuff done in old test instrument  
cases. Very creative. Functional stuff that looks like it came out of  
a lab in the 1800s. This is what is the coolest thing about analog -  
you can make controllers out of almost anythin that works like a  
switch or resistive element.

-James

On Feb 19, 2008, at 4:58 PM, partlydrone wrote:

> Hi all, great group, long time lurker, first time poster.
>
> Since I've got a bit of spare time (as if) I thought I might build an
> interesting controller for my modular (doepfer, AS, harvestman). I
> need something to send gates and control voltages, but not scaled as a
> keyboard since a lot of my stuff is microtonal, or involves switching
> between odd frequencies that work well together through eg ring
> modulators, or by setting controls on eg A112. I've got some vague
> troubleshooting and assembly skills but I am no electronics ninja, so
> I'd be grateful for pointers on the circuitry which should be very
> simple.
>
> What I am planning is this, and it's rudimentary:
>
> 1. Obviously I want a control surface which looks pretty. This one
> will be very pretty once I have attacked it with the dremel and my
> extensive collection of nice knobs.
>
> http://uk.rs-online.com/web/search/searchBrowseAction.html?method=getProduct&R=2071515#header
>
> 2. Nice big buttons (got lots lying around) to send gates
>
> 3. Nice big knobs on potentiometers which will let me set control
> voltages, with momentary switches etc to choose between them.
>
> As far as I can see the electronics side of it is going to be pretty
> simple. Here is my kludge plan, please forgive/assist me if it is  
> loopy:
>
> For the gates, which are a positive going 5v, to avoid messing around
> with voltage regulators etc, I will just take the 5v from the power
> supply ribbon, and use that to feed my gate switches, with a 470 ohm
> resistor to avoid short circuits.
>
> For CV I will just take the 12v +ve from the power supply, feed it
> into linear 10k-100k pots, using those as attenuators, and then I'll
> have my nice CV out the other side in a minijack. Should I bung
> something in there so that I can use the full travel of the pots,
> instead of being stuck with 0-12v?
>
> Then I will have momentary switches, and selectors, etc, to choose
> between eg which CV is going to an oscillator at a given time.
> Switching between those will of course produces horrible glitches, I'm
> sure. No problem.
>
> Does this sound okay, or do I need to delve into it more deeply and
> have some proper circuity in there? Hopefully not.
>
> Later I'll built some fun stuff into the controller too. I want to
> make a mechanical sequencer with a rotating wiper on metal plates.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

Yes, the Folktek stuff is beautiful. I was looking
to pick up one his pieces last year. They really are
works of art. I just didn't have the bread for it.
I'm thinking at this point of a 2 space rack panel full
of switches, pots, sliders, keys, ect that can kind
of be a work in progress. Trying different combinations
of performance controllers and at the same time attempting
to teach myself more about electronics.

So before I start drilling and fiddling, nobody can see any obvious
electronic flaws in my evil kludgy masterplan?

Is it possible to purchase the mounting rails alone? I would like to build a custom "slim line" case for modules that are not deep. I have a supply and a case in mind. Wondering if there is any way to buy those super nice rails used in the G6 and Suitcase.

I see the DIY case option, but I do not need the supply.

Tony
_________________________________________________________________
Connect and share in new ways with Windows Live.
http://www.windowslive.com/share.html?ocid=TXT_TAGHM_Wave2_sharelife_012008

schneiders buro in berlin certainly sell the rails alone, cheap and
easy solution. 

you can also order them from that supply company that doepfer buy
from, which they link to from their site, but i looked once and it was
such a hassle to work out which component to order i, er, gave up... 



--- In Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com, Anthony Rolando <goldenechos@...>
wrote:
>
> 
> Is it possible to purchase the mounting rails alone? I would like to
build a custom "slim line" case for modules that are not deep. I have
a supply and a case in mind. Wondering if there is any way to buy
those super nice rails used in the G6 and Suitcase.
> 
> I see the DIY case option, but I do not need the supply.
> 
> Tony
> _________________________________________________________________
> Connect and share in new ways with Windows Live.
>
http://www.windowslive.com/share.html?ocid=TXT_TAGHM_Wave2_sharelife_012008
>

> Is it possible to purchase the mounting rails alone? I would like
> to build a custom "slim line" case for modules that are not deep.
> I have a supply and a case in mind. Wondering if there is any way
> to buy those super nice rails used in the G6 and Suitcase.
>
> I see the DIY case option, but I do not need the supply.
>
> Tony

The mounting rails used in the DIY cases will be discontinued. The problem
is that our supplier has increased the price by 150% (no typing error, the
new price is 2.5 times the original price). As soon as the mounting rails of
the DIY kits we have in stock are used up we will change even for the DIY
kits to the same rails (manufacturer: ProMa) as used in the standard frames
and suitcases, but with M3 nuts inserted into the slots because that's more
economical that threaded inserts. And one has the advantage to combine
modules of different manufacturers (e.g. Analogue Systems) with Doepfer
modules (b.t.w. that's also possible for standard frames and suitcases, one
has to replace the threaded insert by a couple of M3 nuts).

The rails and threaded inserts are available from our supplier ProMa.
Details on our website www.doepfer.com > PRODUCTS > A-100 > mechanical
details. But as 19" rails are standard products such rails are available
from a lot of other shops too, especially for DIY applications as in this
case the rails do not have to fit 100% to the ProMa parts. It is too costly
for us to have all such parts in stock as standard products. We decided to
offer the DIY kits but it's impossible to have each single part available.

Best wishes
Dieter Doepfer

does anyone know the actual part number at ProMa for the rails which i
can then bung some m3 nuts in? that's much better than having the long
thread inserts since i mix manufacturers a lot. 

--- In Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com, <hardware@...> wrote:
>
> > Is it possible to purchase the mounting rails alone? I would like
> > to build a custom "slim line" case for modules that are not deep.
> > I have a supply and a case in mind. Wondering if there is any way
> > to buy those super nice rails used in the G6 and Suitcase.
> >
> > I see the DIY case option, but I do not need the supply.
> >
> > Tony
> 
> The mounting rails used in the DIY cases will be discontinued. The
problem
> is that our supplier has increased the price by 150% (no typing
error, the
> new price is 2.5 times the original price). As soon as the mounting
rails of
> the DIY kits we have in stock are used up we will change even for
the DIY
> kits to the same rails (manufacturer: ProMa) as used in the standard
frames
> and suitcases, but with M3 nuts inserted into the slots because
that's more
> economical that threaded inserts. And one has the advantage to combine
> modules of different manufacturers (e.g. Analogue Systems) with Doepfer
> modules (b.t.w. that's also possible for standard frames and
suitcases, one
> has to replace the threaded insert by a couple of M3 nuts).
> 
> The rails and threaded inserts are available from our supplier ProMa.
> Details on our website www.doepfer.com > PRODUCTS > A-100 > mechanical
> details. But as 19" rails are standard products such rails are available
> from a lot of other shops too, especially for DIY applications as in
this
> case the rails do not have to fit 100% to the ProMa parts. It is too
costly
> for us to have all such parts in stock as standard products. We
decided to
> offer the DIY kits but it's impossible to have each single part
available.

> 
> Best wishes
> Dieter Doepfer
>

> does anyone know the actual part number at ProMa for the rails which i
> can then bung some m3 nuts in? that's much better than having the long
> thread inserts since i mix manufacturers a lot.

Look at the ProMa website > PRODUCTS > HOUSING PROFILES > 19 Inch Carrier
Frames  > 19 Inch Carrier Frame 1

The order no depends upon the length

Best wishes
Dieter Doepfer

It seems ProMa don't offer mounting rails via their website any more.
Anybody have any ideas about sourcing mounting rails in the UK? Is
there a specific or correct technical name for these items? That would
be a good start - I'm finding it tricky stuff to even search for right
now.

thanks
sean

Hi Sean, 

Its entirely possible to buy the parts you need here in the uk, but you need to be carefull with part numbers and the like.

Farnell will sell all that you need, made by schroff (spelling?) rather than proma.  Rittal will also deal direct (i think their main office is in southhampton)

...but, again, you need to know exactly what youre after, as there are so many variants.  Simply asking for subrack mounting rails will get you, well, nowhere.

I dont have any part numbers to hand, but you basically want 2/4 etc off 84hp front rails "with lip" and 2/4 etc off m3 threadded inserts (assuming youre using these for a wooden case or the like)

When you start getting into rear rails, end pannels and the like, it gets worse.

Be warned, these parts are not cheap (believe it or not, i dont belive there's a huge markup on the cases doepfer sells)

Indeed, i think schroff's website has a fairly accessible section with technical drawings.  Spend some time there, and youll have a better idea of whats going on.

Julian

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: sean_process 
  To: Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Monday, January 05, 2009 12:05 PM
  Subject: [Doepfer_a100] Re: diy case RAILS


  It seems ProMa don't offer mounting rails via their website any more.
  Anybody have any ideas about sourcing mounting rails in the UK? Is
  there a specific or correct technical name for these items? That would
  be a good start - I'm finding it tricky stuff to even search for right
  now.

  thanks
  sean



   

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> It seems ProMa don't offer mounting rails via their website any more.
> Anybody have any ideas about sourcing mounting rails in the UK? Is
> there a specific or correct technical name for these items? That would
> be a good start - I'm finding it tricky stuff to even search for right
> now.
>
> thanks
> sean

The complete product range of ProMa has been taken over by the new company
Gie-Tec (www.gie-tec.com). As far as I know they offer all products that
were available from ProMa.

Best wishes
Dieter Doepfer

Just for the record, these rails are normally available from two places 
here in Berlin:

http://www.schneidersbuero.de/ (currently out of stock, however)
http://www.segor.de/ (plenty in stock, I don't know if they ship out of 
Germany, however)

In fact, I rode my bike through the ice and snow to both places just 
yesterday picking some up ;-)

best!
Derek

yahoo@doepfer.de wrote:
>> It seems ProMa don't offer mounting rails via their website any more.
>> Anybody have any ideas about sourcing mounting rails in the UK? Is
>> there a specific or correct technical name for these items? That would
>> be a good start - I'm finding it tricky stuff to even search for right
>> now.
>>
>> thanks
>> sean
> 
> The complete product range of ProMa has been taken over by the new company
> Gie-Tec (www.gie-tec.com). As far as I know they offer all products that
> were available from ProMa.
> 
> Best wishes
> Dieter Doepfer

-- 
derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista
---Oblique Strategy # 95:
"Is something missing?"

Oh yes, and as far as I know ProMa doesn't deal with "private persons", 
only larger orders. Maybe Gie-Tec does?

best,
d.

yahoo@doepfer.de wrote:
>> It seems ProMa don't offer mounting rails via their website any more.
>> Anybody have any ideas about sourcing mounting rails in the UK? Is
>> there a specific or correct technical name for these items? That would
>> be a good start - I'm finding it tricky stuff to even search for right
>> now.
>>
>> thanks
>> sean
> 
> The complete product range of ProMa has been taken over by the new company
> Gie-Tec (www.gie-tec.com). As far as I know they offer all products that
> were available from ProMa.
> 
> Best wishes
> Dieter Doepfer

-- 
derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista
---Oblique Strategy # 78:
"Go outside.  Shut the door."

thanks for all the info. I found some rails and other parts in the UK 
available through Schroff who were happy to deal with a small order 
and were very helpful and efficient. Now I just need to get my 
woodworking skills up to speed!

>Oh yes, and as far as I know ProMa doesn't deal with "private persons",
>only larger orders. Maybe Gie-Tec does?
>
>best,
>d.
>
><mailto:yahoo%40doepfer.de>yahoo@doepfer.de wrote:
>>>  It seems ProMa don't offer mounting rails via their website any more.
>>>  Anybody have any ideas about sourcing mounting rails in the UK? Is
>>>  there a specific or correct technical name for these items? That would
>>>  be a good start - I'm finding it tricky stuff to even search for right
>>>  now.
>>>
>>>  thanks
>>>  sean
>>
>>  The complete product range of ProMa has been taken over by the new company
>>  Gie-Tec (www.gie-tec.com). As far as I know they offer all products that
>>  were available from ProMa.
>>
>>  Best wishes
>>  Dieter Doepfer
>
>--
>derek holzer ::: <http://www.umatic.nl>http://www.umatic.nl ::: 
><http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista>http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista
>---Oblique Strategy # 78:
>"Go outside. Shut the door."
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]