Doepfer

If I plug a gate signal into the sync input of the A-111 VCO, will it 
reset the VCO every time the gate goes on? With my Analogue Systems 
VCO, a gate signal does not reset the VCO. Instead it makes the VCO 
clicky and unusable. What I want to happen is that when there's a 
Gate-on signal, the VCO simply resets and continues instead of 
stopping like the Analogue Systems VCO.

Hi argitoth

> If I plug a gate signal into the sync input of the A-111 VCO, will it 
> reset the VCO every time the gate goes on? With my Analogue Systems 
> VCO, a gate signal does not reset the VCO. Instead it makes the VCO 
> clicky and unusable. What I want to happen is that when there's a 
> Gate-on signal, the VCO simply resets and continues instead of 
> stopping like the Analogue Systems VCO.
The A110 and the A111 can be reset by a trigger to the sync-input.

The A110 expects a positive transition.

But the CEM3340-chip in the A111 expects a negative transition.


At both VCOs Dieter added a capacitor in series with to the sync in, 
which will make a resetting trigger-spike from the start of the gate 
and(!) from the end of the gate.
If you want to create drumsounds, you may provide extremely short gates.

If the gate is intended for a longer note (e.g bass sound), then the 
best would be to get a gate to trigger converter, which produces a 
trigger only from the start. You might send the gate to a A165 and then 
combine the trigger-out with the gate in an AND-gate (A166). This 
provides a trigger only at the start.

This should work also with te AS-VCO.

Florian

Florian, so with a few more modules I could actually make my Analogue
Systems VCO restart with a gate? I just need an A165 and A166? I don't
understand completely what you're trying to help me understand.

hi,

alternatively, the a142 vcd or the a162 trigger delay with zero delay
time should work, too. in both modules you can vary the gate length to
short triggers...

regards,
andreas

--- In Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com, Florian Anwander <fanwander@...>
wrote:

>
> Hi argitoth
> 
> > If I plug a gate signal into the sync input of the A-111 VCO, will it 
> > reset the VCO every time the gate goes on? With my Analogue Systems 
> > VCO, a gate signal does not reset the VCO. Instead it makes the VCO 
> > clicky and unusable. What I want to happen is that when there's a 
> > Gate-on signal, the VCO simply resets and continues instead of 
> > stopping like the Analogue Systems VCO.
> The A110 and the A111 can be reset by a trigger to the sync-input.
> 
> The A110 expects a positive transition.
> 
> But the CEM3340-chip in the A111 expects a negative transition.
> 
> 
> At both VCOs Dieter added a capacitor in series with to the sync in, 
> which will make a resetting trigger-spike from the start of the gate 
> and(!) from the end of the gate.
> If you want to create drumsounds, you may provide extremely short gates.
> 
> If the gate is intended for a longer note (e.g bass sound), then the 
> best would be to get a gate to trigger converter, which produces a 
> trigger only from the start. You might send the gate to a A165 and then 
> combine the trigger-out with the gate in an AND-gate (A166). This 
> provides a trigger only at the start.
> 
> This should work also with te AS-VCO.
> 
> Florian
>

Ok, I finally understand a little bit how to restart my AS-VCOs. I
took the square output of the A-146 LFO and when the square is
positive, the AS-VCO stops. Then the square goes negative, the AS-VCO
restarts. I then multiplied, inverted, and routed the A-146 to my
envelopes.

Here's the problem, and I think Florian and Andreas have the solution.
The problem is that the GATE output of my A-190 Midi-CV does not work
to reset the AS-VCO so I need to convert the GATE into something that
will work. The other problem is that when the square for the A-146
goes positive, the AS-VCO stops.

Florian says that a gate-to-trigger conversion will work. However, if
I ONLY have the A-162, will it be able to take a gate, turn it into a
trigger, and not cause the AS-VCO to stop?

Hello Argitoth

> Ok, I finally understand a little bit how to restart my AS-VCOs. I
> took the square output of the A-146 LFO and when the square is
> positive, the AS-VCO stops. Then the square goes negative, the AS-VCO
> restarts. 
Yes: as long as the sync-in has a voltage at the input, the VCO stops 
oscillating. In the end the hardsync is nothing else than an electonic 
switch which shortens the capacitor that is the core of the oscillator. 
As long as a voltage (and the gate is a voltage) is fed into the input, 
as long the capacitor will be shortened. That is why I said: you need a 
"spike".


> Florian says that a gate-to-trigger conversion will work. However, if
> I ONLY have the A-162, will it be able to take a gate, turn it into a
> trigger, and not cause the AS-VCO to stop?
I doubt, that the minimum duration (parameter "length") of the trigger 
delay is short enough for a real not hearable reset. Still the waveform 
will be flat for some 10th seconds. But ofcourse this is much better 
than nothing. ;)

Florian

Two more questions, Florian. I need the shortest trigger possible. In
the manual it says, the A-165 creates a 50ms trigger. Is that the
shortest possible? And, can you tell me more about this spike that the
A-111 VCO creates when it resets? Does this spike create a nice
definitive attack?

On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 11:46 AM, Florian Anwander
<fanwander@mnet-online.de> wrote:
> Hello Argitoth
>
>> Ok, I finally understand a little bit how to restart my AS-VCOs. I
>> took the square output of the A-146 LFO and when the square is
>> positive, the AS-VCO stops. Then the square goes negative, the AS-VCO
>> restarts.
> Yes: as long as the sync-in has a voltage at the input, the VCO stops
> oscillating. In the end the hardsync is nothing else than an electonic
> switch which shortens the capacitor that is the core of the oscillator.
> As long as a voltage (and the gate is a voltage) is fed into the input,
> as long the capacitor will be shortened. That is why I said: you need a
> "spike".
>
>> Florian says that a gate-to-trigger conversion will work. However, if
>> I ONLY have the A-162, will it be able to take a gate, turn it into a
>> trigger, and not cause the AS-VCO to stop?
> I doubt, that the minimum duration (parameter "length") of the trigger
> delay is short enough for a real not hearable reset. Still the waveform
> will be flat for some 10th seconds. But ofcourse this is much better
> than nothing. ;)
>
> Florian
>
> 



-- 
www.elanhickler.com

Hi Argitoth

> Two more questions, Florian. I need the shortest trigger possible. In
> the manual it says, the A-165 creates a 50ms trigger. Is that the
> shortest possible? 
the length is defined by the values of two parts (a capacitor and a 
resistor). You might replace those parts, to get shorter triggers.

> And, can you tell me more about this spike that the
> A-111 VCO creates when it resets? Does this spike create a nice
> definitive attack?
The A111 does NOT PRODUCE a spike(=extreme short trigger) but it 
REQUIRES to RECEIVE a short spike(=extreme short trigger) at the 
hardsync input. "Spike" may be the wrong word, but I am a poor german 
boy and don't know any better.

Florian

Florian, I reread what you said and now I understand it better.

So I want an a-165 to convert a gate into a trigger spike. Does the
A-165 convert both the GATE ON and GATE OFF signals into trigger
spikes? So that's why I need an a-166 to make the A-165 only send out
a trigger spike on the GATE ON of the gate signal from my A-190 midi
interface?

...perhaps even easier to use for this purpose would be the AS MT-16
MIDI to trigger module?

...as it happens i still have two of them on offer:
http://tinyurl.com/9skpwm ;o)

2009/1/19 Argitoth <argitoth@gmail.com>:
> a trigger spike on the GATE ON of the gate signal from my A-190 midi
> interface?

This doesn't help with Analogue Systems oscillators, but:

As I wrote in another forum, the Cwejman oscillators do not stop when 
receiving a gate at their sync input. They just restart (get hard 
synced) at the upward edge. Perhaps a short trigger is internally 
generated to achieve this.

I was thinking about creating this for myself:
http://www.cgs.synth.net/modules/cgs24_gatetotrigger.html

On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 1:37 PM, jalmari3 <jari.jokinen@netikka.fi> wrote:
> This doesn't help with Analogue Systems oscillators, but:
>
> As I wrote in another forum, the Cwejman oscillators do not stop when
> receiving a gate at their sync input. They just restart (get hard
> synced) at the upward edge. Perhaps a short trigger is internally
> generated to achieve this.
>
> 



-- 
www.elanhickler.com

> Florian, I reread what you said and now I understand it better.
>
> So I want an a-165 to convert a gate into a trigger spike. Does the
> A-165 convert both the GATE ON and GATE OFF signals into trigger
> spikes? So that's why I need an a-166 to make the A-165 only send out
> a trigger spike on the GATE ON of the gate signal from my A-190 midi
> interface?

Provided that you own an A-162 Dual Trigger Delay and are a bit experienced
with electronics e.g. the second unit of the A-162 can be modified very
easily for shorter trigger lenght. Finally each unit of the A-162 is nothing
but two daisy-chained gate-to-trigger converters with adjustable trigger
lengths. From the factory the time range is about 2 ms ... 10 s. But it can
be modified if C2 and/or C5 are replaced by smaller values. For details
please refer to the updated A-162 info page and the updated document "Timing
capacitors of A-100 modules" (www.doepfer.com > PRODUCTS > A-100 > DIY page
> Timing capacitors ...).

Best wishes
Dieter Doepfer

Thank you Deiter!