Doepfer

Andreas, 
 
I hear you. The A-155 is a no-go for now - I'm not up to
spending another 230 $ for something just to get what I'm 
considering more as an incremental improvement (as 
opposed to a completely new feature set). Midi / cheapo
sequencer would definitely do the trick, but didn't I
buy my A-100 not to go back to the world I just 
came from...? So I guess I'd buy one of the three module
combinations instead (see previous post). 
 
About the dynamics of Mr. D and his community. Know
what, this is really interesting in a way. Without being involved
too long, this is sort-of the classic behaviour. I guess
Mr. D never had a vision of himself steering an online
community, but building cool products. Those are like two
really different mindsets. 
 
Like having seen lots of communities, my guess is Mr. D 
is experiencing all this for the first time. You really need
practice handling such "one-to-many" virtual relationships.
And you only learn once its over. While you're inside
your first community you've built from scratch, you get
a slightly distorted, god-like feeling (hey, people wrote
entire books about this). The tough part essentially is that
you see yourself reflected in the market. And if your
reflection knows more about you than you yourself 
(ie. the community knows best what modules to do next)
you get this strange feeling of being obsolete, or better,
becoming predictable. And everyone hates that at first
and reacts with doing something deliberately unpredictable.
 
So I'd say you can't really blame Mr D, it's all just natural
behaviour.
 
- Sebastian

	-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- 
	Von: Andreas Lindholm 
	Gesendet: Do 25.07.2002 07:50 
	An: Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com 
	Cc: 
	Betreff: Re: [Doepfer_a100] Making it groove...
	
	

	Easy trick... no I don't think so. It is probably most possible
to get your
	seqencer from an 155 and a few other modules together, but not
easiely done
	I guess. I once proposed that timing offset should be added to
the note
	steps in any doepfer module or seqencer box, but as usual I am
talking to a
	wall. That was five years back or so... I wonder if Doepfer
responds to user
	wishes and then how many of us will it take or perhaps "whom of
us"? To me
	it seems like they spawn an idea at doepfer and just test it on
us to find
	out if we dislike it, don't really care of if enough of us are
exited about
	it rather than actually take a suggestion from the outside.
	
	My way of doin what you want is midi and a cheapo sequencer(no
werk box).
	
	/Andreas

	----- Original Message -----
	From: "Sebastian Schnitzenbaumer" <schnitz@mozquito.com>
	To: <Doepfer_a100@yahoogroups.com>
	Sent: Thursday, July 25, 2002 1:18 AM
	Subject: [Doepfer_a100] Making it groove...
	
	
	> I ended up using my A100 as a drum computer in live
perfomance.
	> The hardest part I find is to get this thing to swing. Like it
all
	> works,
	> generating really interesting percussion-oriented patterns
based on
	> the LFO. Band-wise this means: Fire the drummer, hire another
	> keyboarder ... ,-)
	>
	> But then it often just really is "too straight". Thru some
magic, you
	> sometimes get a cool off-beat effect and there you go on to
the more
	> jazzy side I prefer most...
	>
	> Any simple trick? Or any special Module that, for example,
let's me
	> gradually delay every second beat (I sort-of mimic this my
syncing
	> a VCO with my LFO and then add another LFO output to the
	> "PW CV1" jack in my VCO, but it doesn't give me enough
control...)
	>
	> Thanks,
	>
	> - Sebastian
	>
	>
	>
	>
	>
	> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
	>
	>
	>
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	>
	>
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	>
	
	
	
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

One important thing to remember is that this isn't about one world 
or another.  It's about using the entire spectrum available.  If 
MIDI will do the trick, why not use it?  MIDI should not prevent you 
from experimenting, nor used as an excuse to become pedestrian.  As 
a matter of fact, using MIDI frees me up to concentrate on the sound 
itself.

But, that's just my opinion.

Regards,
Kevin

> Midi / cheapo sequencer would definitely do the trick, but didn't I
> buy my A-100 not to go back to the world I just came from...?

Some dime-store philosophy: To me, Keven and Sebastion's views aren't 
really so different.

"Using the entire spectrum of technologies available" is best done by 
becoming proficient in all of them. Rather than "the world I just came 
from", maybe "the world I just temporarily put aside in order to 
become immersed and proficient in analog" would be another way to 
think of it.

Midi, by its nature and pervasiveness, is always going to attempt to 
impose itself on your analog world, come what may. Actively resisting 
midi can be a way to ensure that the forces are in balance, ultimately 
resulting in Kevin's vision.

Just my opinion.

Joe

--- In Doepfer_a100@y..., "code_pig" <code_pig@y...> wrote:
> One important thing to remember is that this isn't about one world 
> or another.  It's about using the entire spectrum available.  If 
> MIDI will do the trick, why not use it?  MIDI should not prevent you 
> from experimenting, nor used as an excuse to become pedestrian.  As 
> a matter of fact, using MIDI frees me up to concentrate on the sound 
> itself.
> 
> But, that's just my opinion.
> 
> Regards,
> Kevin
> 
> > Midi / cheapo sequencer would definitely do the trick, but didn't 
I
> > buy my A-100 not to go back to the world I just came from...?

Joe,

Correct in all aspects, only put in a slightly different way.

I wish I could remember who said it, but "when a man only uses a 
hammer, everything starts looking like a nail".

In other words, we have a number of tools, why not exploit them all?

Regards,
Kevin


--- In Doepfer_a100@y..., "buechlerjoe" <buechlerjoe@t...> wrote:
> Some dime-store philosophy: To me, Keven and Sebastion's views 
aren't 
> really so different.
> 
> "Using the entire spectrum of technologies available" is best done 
by 
> becoming proficient in all of them. Rather than "the world I just 
came 
> from", maybe "the world I just temporarily put aside in order to 
> become immersed and proficient in analog" would be another way to 
> think of it.
> 
> Midi, by its nature and pervasiveness, is always going to attempt 
to 
> impose itself on your analog world, come what may. Actively 
resisting 
> midi can be a way to ensure that the forces are in balance, 
ultimately 

> resulting in Kevin's vision.
> 
> Just my opinion.
> 
> Joe

More late-night musings: When I first got involved with the A100, I 
thought I was going to primarily use it as a funky sort of midi sound 
module. Some days it's that, but other days it's a funky sort of drum 
machine. Yet other times it's a performance instrument, or an effects 
processor. Tomorrow the magic carpet might take me somewhere 
completely unexpected.

My all-time favorite quote from the group, though, was Florian's: "I 
think a hardware based modular system is something that is more to be 
used as a violin: The art is to concentrate more on the possibilities 
for expression than on playing the right notes."

Midi, of course, creates all sorts of possibilities for musical 
expressiveness. That's why I was suprised Dieter's message said that 
the A191 wasn't selling well. To me, more than any other module, it's 
the one that allow for the most musical expression (unless, of course, 
you have an MCV24 or Encore Expressionist instead).

Joe

--- In Doepfer_a100@y..., "code_pig" <code_pig@y...> wrote:

> Joe,
> 
> Correct in all aspects, only put in a slightly different way.
> 
> I wish I could remember who said it, but "when a man only uses a 
> hammer, everything starts looking like a nail".
> 
> In other words, we have a number of tools, why not exploit them all?
> 
> Regards,
> Kevin
> 
> 
> --- In Doepfer_a100@y..., "buechlerjoe" <buechlerjoe@t...> wrote:
> > Some dime-store philosophy: To me, Keven and Sebastion's views 
> aren't 
> > really so different.
> > 
> > "Using the entire spectrum of technologies available" is best done 
> by 
> > becoming proficient in all of them. Rather than "the world I just 
> came 
> > from", maybe "the world I just temporarily put aside in order to 
> > become immersed and proficient in analog" would be another way to 
> > think of it.
> > 
> > Midi, by its nature and pervasiveness, is always going to attempt 
> to 
> > impose itself on your analog world, come what may. Actively 
> resisting 
> > midi can be a way to ensure that the forces are in balance, 
> ultimately 
> > resulting in Kevin's vision.
> > 
> > Just my opinion.
> > 
> > Joe

> Midi, of course, creates all sorts of possibilities for musical
> expressiveness. That's why I was suprised Dieter's message said that
> the A191 wasn't selling well. To me, more than any other module, it's
> the one that allow for the most musical expression (unless, of course,
> you have an MCV24 or Encore Expressionist instead).
>
> Joe

I think one simple answer to sales it price. The 191 is expensive compared
to lfo's and envs... I think the same goes for pitchshifter and stuff, we
like to have them but paying 500 euro for a bode (Analog systems) is mostly
a nono.

/Andy

There's a lot of truth to that. I suspect the other part of the 
problem is historical baggage. The A191 was originally conceived as a 
Shepard function generator. While it was being developed, it morphed 
into an A190 expander, but kept the Shepard generator as an ancillary 
function. 

Unfortunately, it's still mostly described by Doepfer, and thought of 
by the user community, as a Shepard function generator: an expensive 
and highly specialized module of limited utility. It wasn't until I 
read the details carefully that it finally occurred to me what the 
A191 was really for. Then the price made more sense.

Joe

--- In Doepfer_a100@y..., "Andreas Lindholm" <andreas.k.lindholm@t...> 
wrote:
> > Midi, of course, creates all sorts of possibilities for musical
> > expressiveness. That's why I was suprised Dieter's message said 
that
> > the A191 wasn't selling well. To me, more than any other module, 
it's
> > the one that allow for the most musical expression (unless, of 
course,
> > you have an MCV24 or Encore Expressionist instead).
> >
> > Joe
> 
> I think one simple answer to sales it price. The 191 is expensive 
compared
> to lfo's and envs... I think the same goes for pitchshifter and 
stuff, we
> like to have them but paying 500 euro for a bode (Analog systems) is 
mostly

> a nono.
> 
> /Andy