Homebrew PCBs

Hi all,
Does anyone have a favourite make of inkjet film for printing artwork? It
looks to be expensive stuff so I would like to use a brand that others have
had success with. I am using a Lexmark Z25 printer if it makes any
difference.

TIA,
Les

Les Newell wrote:
> Hi all,
> Does anyone have a favourite make of inkjet film for printing artwork? It
> looks to be expensive stuff so I would like to use a brand that others have
> had success with. I am using a Lexmark Z25 printer if it makes any
> difference.

I use epson over-head transparencies. They have a smooth coating that
absorbs the ink, eliminating all pin-holes. It costs more than the printer
($3 per sheet), but i can make 30 sheets last a year or more. First, print
the pcb onto paper in economy mode (to save ink). Cut out some transparency
and sticky-tape it over the paper printout area. Feed back into the printer
and print using the highest resolution black ink setting. The transparency
off-cuts can be used for other boards. Unfortunately, refill ink gives bad
results, so i have to use the genuine epson stuff. With this combination,
you can do ~5mil tracks at 720dpi. To minimize ink costs, i got two printers
the same (epson stylus colour 400 which are really cheap in the trading post).
One is only used for PCB printing using the expensive ink and the other does
the usual day-to-day printing using crap refill ink.

Hi,

I use Pictorico "Premium OHP Transparency Film". The stuff is 
awesome. Heavy base, totally smear free, high resolution 
transparency film.
http://www.pictorico.com/Secure/eCommerce/Catalog.asp?prdc=5
It's just over $1/sheet.

I've not had any problems printing with a variety of inks on this 
stuff. Plus, it's highly water resistant.

They also make several other papers and stickers. I've used their 
stickers to make custom cabinet labels for projects. All their 
products work great. I'm a real fan of theirs.

-Ted
--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Les Newell" <les@l...> wrote:
> Hi all,
> Does anyone have a favourite make of inkjet film for printing 
artwork? It
> looks to be expensive stuff so I would like to use a brand that 
others have

> had success with. I am using a Lexmark Z25 printer if it makes any
> difference.
> 
> TIA,
> Les

Greetings,

I use "3M Transparency Film for Canon and Epson Ink Jet Printers"
which is about 75 cents per sheet.

I use this film with an Epson Color Stylus 400 and have successfully
produced fine pitch SMT circuit boards.

While this method works with careful trace width selection, a laser
printer would be desirable.

Ned

Thanks to all who responded about inkjet film. I think I will try the 3M
film.

Les

Hi,

I gotta disagree with the last statement - I've tried several inkjet 
printers and two laser printers and the inkjets blow away the lasers 
for this application. The feed mechanism of the inkjet printers is 
extremely accurate - it needs to be in order to achieve uniform 
printing without banding. As such, my measurements have shown that a 
full page board can be produced where every trace is in exactly the 
right position.

On the other hand, a laser printer works with a heater and charged 
drum. The medium is thus prone to thermal size changes. 
Additionally, the feed can be very non-uniform for transparencies. I 
tried several experiments using both Sharp and HP laser printers and 
neither was appropriate for PC board printing.

In addition, the inkjet is far better at producing dense areas of 
black, like you'd get on a board with large ground planes. With a 
laser, you tend to get a washed out black that has pinholes - not so 
good.

-Ted

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Ned Seith <seiths@e...>" 
<seiths@e...> wrote:
> Greetings,
> 
> I use "3M Transparency Film for Canon and Epson Ink Jet Printers"
> which is about 75 cents per sheet.
> 
> I use this film with an Epson Color Stylus 400 and have 
successfully

> produced fine pitch SMT circuit boards.
> 
> While this method works with careful trace width selection, a laser
> printer would be desirable.
> 
> Ned

On a similar note, I recently used two different inkjet printers, an 
Epson 600 and an HP 625C, to print on decal paper.  The similarity is 
that you want dense printing, as high resolution as possible, but the 
difference is that decals are usually in color.

I found no discernible differnce between the two printers, and no 
discernible increase in quality beyond 720 dpi.  Does this mean the 
1440 resolution is just hype?  Or maybe my software was not up to it.

I was using the cheapest of aftermarket ink in the Epson, but real HP 
ink in the Deskjet - no discernible difference.  The only 
disadvantage of the "clone" ink is that it tends to need cleaning of 
the jets more often.  That's for color ink:  for black, the clone ink 
isn't quite as dense, in my experience.

BTW, I had to get more ink for the HP in a hurry, so paid full price 
for HP ink.  Two cartridges for about $32 + $26 = $58 (plus tax).  
Epson is a little cheaper, but not much.  I noticed that CompUsa is 
offering the HP Deskjet 3320 1200x600 dpi for $50, so I'm wondering 
why I didn't buy another printer, instead of the ink.  To be honest, 
the $50 deskjet ships with a single ink cartridge, so you don't get 
true black without adding another cartridge ($22 additional).  Still, 
and interesting situation for one who bought his first dot matrix 
printer when they came down below $500...

Take it easy,
Jed.

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, Russell <rjshaw@i...> wrote:
> Les Newell wrote:
> > Hi all,
> > Does anyone have a favourite make of inkjet film for printing 
artwork? It
> > looks to be expensive stuff so I would like to use a brand that 
others have
> > had success with. I am using a Lexmark Z25 printer if it makes any
> > difference.
> 
> I use epson over-head transparencies. They have a smooth coating 
that
> absorbs the ink, eliminating all pin-holes. It costs more than the 
printer
> ($3 per sheet), but i can make 30 sheets last a year or more. 
First, print
> the pcb onto paper in economy mode (to save ink). Cut out some 
transparency
> and sticky-tape it over the paper printout area. Feed back into the 
printer
> and print using the highest resolution black ink setting. The 
transparency
> off-cuts can be used for other boards. Unfortunately, refill ink 
gives bad
> results, so i have to use the genuine epson stuff. With this 
combination,
> you can do ~5mil tracks at 720dpi. To minimize ink costs, i got two 
printers
> the same (epson stylus colour 400 which are really cheap in the 
trading post).
> One is only used for PCB printing using the expensive ink and the 
other does
> the usual day-to-day printing using crap refill ink.

nf1z  wrote:
> On a similar note, I recently used two different inkjet printers, an 
> Epson 600 and an HP 625C, to print on decal paper.  The similarity is 
> that you want dense printing, as high resolution as possible, but the 
> difference is that decals are usually in color.
> 
> I found no discernible differnce between the two printers, and no 
> discernible increase in quality beyond 720 dpi.  Does this mean the 
> 1440 resolution is just hype?  Or maybe my software was not up to it.
> 
> I was using the cheapest of aftermarket ink in the Epson, but real HP 
> ink in the Deskjet - no discernible difference.  The only 
> disadvantage of the "clone" ink is that it tends to need cleaning of 
> the jets more often.  That's for color ink:  for black, the clone ink 
> isn't quite as dense, in my experience.

When printing on to epson transparency, the genuine ink makes all
the difference.

In a message dated 1/7/2003 8:23:50 AM Central Standard Time, 
gweare@... writes:


> BTW, I had to get more ink for the HP in a hurry, so paid full price 
> for HP ink.  Two cartridges for about $32 + $26 = $58 (plus tax).  
> Epson is a little cheaper, but not much. 

Jed:  Did you HAVE to, or did the printer just PROMPT that the cartridge was 
running low?  Cause, on MY HP 960c, it will prompt [alternately, days apart!] 
"Color (Black-) Ink Cartridge running low;  You may want to buy a replacement 
and have it ready!".  But it quit saying anything for a week, now and all is 
fine!  It is PROBABLY a built-in "creative merchandising" trick HP learned 
from another land...


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Printer manufacturers and retailers don't make money on the 
printers, they make their money on the consumables (computers are 
the same with peripherals and accessories like cables). Its gotten 
so bad that I no longer pay attention to the price of the printer 
when shopping, I look at the price of the consumables!

Many years ago, I bough an Epson Action II laser printer. It was 
dirt cheap at only $600 (at the time). Silly me, I didn't check the 
price of toner and developer! Between the two of them they cost 
$450. $150 for the toner and $300 for the developer. Seems I needed 
a new drum every second toner too. I was kicking myself for not 
buying an LC890 instead.

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "nf1z <gweare@a...>" 
<gweare@a...> wrote:
> offering the HP Deskjet 3320 1200x600 dpi for $50, so I'm 
wondering 
> why I didn't buy another printer, instead of the ink.  To be 
honest,