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Oh no, blank fibreglass again!

Oh no, blank fibreglass again!

2003-04-26 by Max Davies

Hi everyone.

A newbie to this group, I am (perhaps over-ambitiously) attempting 
to set up a micro through-hole plating line at home.  It's a lot 
more involved than I ever thought it would be, but I now have most 
of it working fine.  ...Except what should be the easy bit - the 
final stage - the etching!


To give a brief description of what I do...

STAGE 1:  Starting with plain, copper-clad board, I do the drilling.
STAGE 2:  Apply photopolymer laminate, then expose & develop. (This 
is positive photopolymer, so the copper which will ultimately become 
tracks is exposed to the air on developing the pattern)
STAGE 3:  Go through a 6-stage process to electroless-plate the 
entire thing (including the holes & edges). The copper cover it puts 
on is pretty thin, but uniform at 1-2 microns.
STAGE 4:  Electroplate the copper - this gives reasonable thickness 
to the copper applied in stage 3 - I aim for 25 microns.
STAGE 5:  Electroplate with tin to 10 microns.  This 
(theoretically!) protects the copper from etchant.
STAGE 6:  Remove remaining resist.  Then etch.  This should leave 
the tin-plated areas untouched, everything else should be zapped.


But alas no!  Stage 6 fails, because both tin *and* copper are 
etched, leaving me with a fine, blank piece of fibreglass!  It 
matters not whether I use Ferric Chloride or Sulphuric/Peroxide 
etchant - they both destroy what has been so lovingly created!!  So 
I reckon there must be something awry with my tin plating.

It's a total impasse, and nothing I do, from increasing/decreasing 
current to re-formulating the tin plating bath according to 
manufacturer's instructions seems to change things.

Does anyone else use a similar process, or have any clue about what 
might be the problem here?

Max.

Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Oh no, blank fibreglass again!

2003-04-26 by Mike Putnam

Max,
After drilling the holes, you have to clean the copper thoroughly, then seed
the holes. You cannot plate the holes without something to plate inside the
holes. After that, you should be able to apply negative pattern of the
desired circuit by silkscreen or other process and plate the panel. If the
plating process is correct, then the panel can be cleaned and etched with no
harm to the plating. The plate should not etch away.

Mike Putnam

----- Original Message -----
Show quoted textHide quoted text
From: "Max Davies" <max.davies@...>
To: <Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2003 10:46 AM
Subject: [Homebrew_PCBs] Oh no, blank fibreglass again!


> Hi everyone.
>
> A newbie to this group, I am (perhaps over-ambitiously) attempting
> to set up a micro through-hole plating line at home.  It's a lot
> more involved than I ever thought it would be, but I now have most
> of it working fine.  ...Except what should be the easy bit - the
> final stage - the etching!
>
>
> To give a brief description of what I do...
>
> STAGE 1:  Starting with plain, copper-clad board, I do the drilling.
> STAGE 2:  Apply photopolymer laminate, then expose & develop. (This
> is positive photopolymer, so the copper which will ultimately become
> tracks is exposed to the air on developing the pattern)
> STAGE 3:  Go through a 6-stage process to electroless-plate the
> entire thing (including the holes & edges). The copper cover it puts
> on is pretty thin, but uniform at 1-2 microns.
> STAGE 4:  Electroplate the copper - this gives reasonable thickness
> to the copper applied in stage 3 - I aim for 25 microns.
> STAGE 5:  Electroplate with tin to 10 microns.  This
> (theoretically!) protects the copper from etchant.
> STAGE 6:  Remove remaining resist.  Then etch.  This should leave
> the tin-plated areas untouched, everything else should be zapped.
>
>
> But alas no!  Stage 6 fails, because both tin *and* copper are
> etched, leaving me with a fine, blank piece of fibreglass!  It
> matters not whether I use Ferric Chloride or Sulphuric/Peroxide
> etchant - they both destroy what has been so lovingly created!!  So
> I reckon there must be something awry with my tin plating.
>
> It's a total impasse, and nothing I do, from increasing/decreasing
> current to re-formulating the tin plating bath according to
> manufacturer's instructions seems to change things.
>
> Does anyone else use a similar process, or have any clue about what
> might be the problem here?
>
> Max.
>
>
>
> Be sure to visit the group home and check for new Bookmarks and files:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBs
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> Homebrew_PCBs-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Oh no, blank fibreglass again!

2003-04-26 by Leon Heller

>From: "Max Davies" <max.davies@...>
>Reply-To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
>To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: [Homebrew_PCBs] Oh no, blank fibreglass again!
>Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2003 17:46:40 -0000
>
>Hi everyone.
>
>A newbie to this group, I am (perhaps over-ambitiously) attempting
>to set up a micro through-hole plating line at home.  It's a lot
>more involved than I ever thought it would be, but I now have most
>of it working fine.  ...Except what should be the easy bit - the
>final stage - the etching!
>I reckon there must be something awry with my tin plating.
>
>It's a total impasse, and nothing I do, from increasing/decreasing
>current to re-formulating the tin plating bath according to
>manufacturer's instructions seems to change things.
>
>Does anyone else use a similar process, or have any clue about what
>might be the problem here?

Professional PCB suppliers use a different etching chemistry - I think it's 
based on ammonia, it's alkaline, anyway. Perhaps that doesn't affect the 
tin.

A good book on all this stuff is by Bishop. It's rather expensive but some 
public libraries in the UK have a copy.

Leon
--
Leon Heller, G1HSM Tel: +44 1424 423947
Email:leon_heller@...
My web page: http://www.geocities.com/leon_heller




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Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Oh no, blank fibreglass again!

2003-04-26 by Stefan Trethan

have you tried with sulphuric acid and H2O2 added to it?
this should not eat up your plating.
it blackens it but shouldn't eat it up.


regards
st

26.04.2003 19:46:40, "Max Davies" <max.davies@...> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
>Hi everyone.
>
>A newbie to this group, I am (perhaps over-ambitiously) attempting 
>to set up a micro through-hole plating line at home.  It's a lot 
>more involved than I ever thought it would be, but I now have most 
>of it working fine.  ...Except what should be the easy bit - the 
>final stage - the etching!
>
>
>To give a brief description of what I do...
>
>STAGE 1:  Starting with plain, copper-clad board, I do the drilling.
>STAGE 2:  Apply photopolymer laminate, then expose & develop. (This 
>is positive photopolymer, so the copper which will ultimately become 
>tracks is exposed to the air on developing the pattern)
>STAGE 3:  Go through a 6-stage process to electroless-plate the 
>entire thing (including the holes & edges). The copper cover it puts 
>on is pretty thin, but uniform at 1-2 microns.
>STAGE 4:  Electroplate the copper - this gives reasonable thickness 
>to the copper applied in stage 3 - I aim for 25 microns.
>STAGE 5:  Electroplate with tin to 10 microns.  This 
>(theoretically!) protects the copper from etchant.
>STAGE 6:  Remove remaining resist.  Then etch.  This should leave 
>the tin-plated areas untouched, everything else should be zapped.
>
>
>But alas no!  Stage 6 fails, because both tin *and* copper are 
>etched, leaving me with a fine, blank piece of fibreglass!  It 
>matters not whether I use Ferric Chloride or Sulphuric/Peroxide 
>etchant - they both destroy what has been so lovingly created!!  So 
>I reckon there must be something awry with my tin plating.
>
>It's a total impasse, and nothing I do, from increasing/decreasing 
>current to re-formulating the tin plating bath according to 
>manufacturer's instructions seems to change things.
>
>Does anyone else use a similar process, or have any clue about what 
>might be the problem here?
>
>Max.
>
>
>
>Be sure to visit the group home and check for new Bookmarks and files:
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBs
>
>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>Homebrew_PCBs-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> 
>
>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ 
>
>
>

Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Oh no, blank fibreglass again!

2003-04-26 by Leon Heller

>From: "Leon Heller" <leon_heller@...>
>Reply-To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
>To: Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Oh no, blank fibreglass again!
>Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2003 18:10:29 +0000
>
>Professional PCB suppliers use a different etching chemistry - I think it's
>based on ammonia, it's alkaline, anyway. Perhaps that doesn't affect the
>tin.

I've just checked the above with a web search, and it's basically correct. 
The etchant is ammonia, ammonium chloride and cupric chloride. The excess 
copper needs to be removed regularly. This stuff doesn't dissolve tin or 
tin/lead, unlike FeCl3 and other acidic etchants.

Leon
--
Leon Heller, G1HSM Tel: +44 1424 423947
Email:leon_heller@...
My web page: http://www.geocities.com/leon_heller



_________________________________________________________________
Hotmail messages direct to your mobile phone http://www.msn.co.uk/mobile

Re: Oh no, blank fibreglass again!

2003-04-26 by twb8899

Max,

We always used solder plating as a resist and it worked fine. After 
etching either reflow the solder or strip it off and apply one of the 
newer "white tin" coatings if you want tin plating. Are you using 
immersion tin or really electroplating it? Immersion tin is worthless 
as a metallic resist but some electroplated tins will work if they 
are plated heavy enough. By switching to solder plating you will 
eliminate the problem. The same plating bath can probably be used.

Ferric chloride will not work unless gold is being used as the etch 
resist. Sulfuric/peroxide will work as an etchant for solder plated 
boards. After stripping the photoresist dip the panel in a 10% 
peroxide dip and then etch. This keeps the black crud from forming on 
the solder plated surface for a better reflow finish. After etching 
dip the panels in a 10% hydrochloric acid dip for about five minutes 
to brighten the solder plating for reflow. Skip the peroxide and 
hydrochloric dips if the solder is being stripped after etching. They 
are only required for solder reflow quality.

Bake the boards for at least 30 minutes at 300 degrees F after 
etching and before reflowing. This is for outgassing any trapped 
moisture and will keep the plated through holes from blowing out when 
soldering.

BTW, are you using the newer activated palladium cataylyst and 
skipping the electroless copper stage?  Good luck on your new system!

Tom


--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Max Davies" <max.davies@b...> 
wrote:
> Hi everyone.
> 
> A newbie to this group, I am (perhaps over-ambitiously) attempting 
> to set up a micro through-hole plating line at home.  It's a lot 
> more involved than I ever thought it would be, but I now have most 
> of it working fine.  ...Except what should be the easy bit - the 
> final stage - the etching!
> 
> 
> To give a brief description of what I do...
> 
> STAGE 1:  Starting with plain, copper-clad board, I do the drilling.
> STAGE 2:  Apply photopolymer laminate, then expose & develop. (This 
> is positive photopolymer, so the copper which will ultimately 
become 
> tracks is exposed to the air on developing the pattern)
> STAGE 3:  Go through a 6-stage process to electroless-plate the 
> entire thing (including the holes & edges). The copper cover it 
puts 
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> on is pretty thin, but uniform at 1-2 microns.
> STAGE 4:  Electroplate the copper - this gives reasonable thickness 
> to the copper applied in stage 3 - I aim for 25 microns.
> STAGE 5:  Electroplate with tin to 10 microns.  This 
> (theoretically!) protects the copper from etchant.
> STAGE 6:  Remove remaining resist.  Then etch.  This should leave 
> the tin-plated areas untouched, everything else should be zapped.
> 
> 
> But alas no!  Stage 6 fails, because both tin *and* copper are 
> etched, leaving me with a fine, blank piece of fibreglass!  It 
> matters not whether I use Ferric Chloride or Sulphuric/Peroxide 
> etchant - they both destroy what has been so lovingly created!!  So 
> I reckon there must be something awry with my tin plating.
> 
> It's a total impasse, and nothing I do, from increasing/decreasing 
> current to re-formulating the tin plating bath according to 
> manufacturer's instructions seems to change things.
> 
> Does anyone else use a similar process, or have any clue about what 
> might be the problem here?
> 
> Max.

Re: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: Oh no, blank fibreglass again!

2003-04-26 by Mike Putnam

I have to differ with you, Tom. I used Tin Plate (Electrolysis) in my shop
for many years and not Gold. Gold plating was too expensive. I etched with
Ferric Chloride with no problems ever. Perhaps the trick is in how fast you
are able to etch the panel.
-Mike

----- Original Message -----
Show quoted textHide quoted text
From: "twb8899" <twb8899@...>
To: <Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2003 11:40 AM
Subject: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: Oh no, blank fibreglass again!


> Max,
>
> We always used solder plating as a resist and it worked fine. After
> etching either reflow the solder or strip it off and apply one of the
> newer "white tin" coatings if you want tin plating. Are you using
> immersion tin or really electroplating it? Immersion tin is worthless
> as a metallic resist but some electroplated tins will work if they
> are plated heavy enough. By switching to solder plating you will
> eliminate the problem. The same plating bath can probably be used.
>
> Ferric chloride will not work unless gold is being used as the etch
> resist. Sulfuric/peroxide will work as an etchant for solder plated
> boards. After stripping the photoresist dip the panel in a 10%
> peroxide dip and then etch. This keeps the black crud from forming on
> the solder plated surface for a better reflow finish. After etching
> dip the panels in a 10% hydrochloric acid dip for about five minutes
> to brighten the solder plating for reflow. Skip the peroxide and
> hydrochloric dips if the solder is being stripped after etching. They
> are only required for solder reflow quality.
>
> Bake the boards for at least 30 minutes at 300 degrees F after
> etching and before reflowing. This is for outgassing any trapped
> moisture and will keep the plated through holes from blowing out when
> soldering.
>
> BTW, are you using the newer activated palladium cataylyst and
> skipping the electroless copper stage?  Good luck on your new system!
>
> Tom
>
>
> --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Max Davies" <max.davies@b...>
> wrote:
> > Hi everyone.
> >
> > A newbie to this group, I am (perhaps over-ambitiously) attempting
> > to set up a micro through-hole plating line at home.  It's a lot
> > more involved than I ever thought it would be, but I now have most
> > of it working fine.  ...Except what should be the easy bit - the
> > final stage - the etching!
> >
> >
> > To give a brief description of what I do...
> >
> > STAGE 1:  Starting with plain, copper-clad board, I do the drilling.
> > STAGE 2:  Apply photopolymer laminate, then expose & develop. (This
> > is positive photopolymer, so the copper which will ultimately
> become
> > tracks is exposed to the air on developing the pattern)
> > STAGE 3:  Go through a 6-stage process to electroless-plate the
> > entire thing (including the holes & edges). The copper cover it
> puts
> > on is pretty thin, but uniform at 1-2 microns.
> > STAGE 4:  Electroplate the copper - this gives reasonable thickness
> > to the copper applied in stage 3 - I aim for 25 microns.
> > STAGE 5:  Electroplate with tin to 10 microns.  This
> > (theoretically!) protects the copper from etchant.
> > STAGE 6:  Remove remaining resist.  Then etch.  This should leave
> > the tin-plated areas untouched, everything else should be zapped.
> >
> >
> > But alas no!  Stage 6 fails, because both tin *and* copper are
> > etched, leaving me with a fine, blank piece of fibreglass!  It
> > matters not whether I use Ferric Chloride or Sulphuric/Peroxide
> > etchant - they both destroy what has been so lovingly created!!  So
> > I reckon there must be something awry with my tin plating.
> >
> > It's a total impasse, and nothing I do, from increasing/decreasing
> > current to re-formulating the tin plating bath according to
> > manufacturer's instructions seems to change things.
> >
> > Does anyone else use a similar process, or have any clue about what
> > might be the problem here?
> >
> > Max.
>
>
>
> Be sure to visit the group home and check for new Bookmarks and files:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBs
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> Homebrew_PCBs-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

Re: Oh no, blank fibreglass again!

2003-04-26 by Max Davies

Liam/Tom/Mike

Thanks all for your suggestions.  It sounds as if there are several 
routes I could go from here.

Liam - your suggestion of a different type of etchant sounds like an 
obvious one to try.  I see you're UK based - can you direct me to a 
UK supplier of this etchant and I'll give it a go.  In fact my 
process is an industrial one (www.vantage.co.uk) - I have tried to 
stick with just one supplier to have half a chance of making it work!

Tom - It is electro-tin (I tried immersion tin before, and quickly 
realized the limitations!)  The surface is matt by design - does 
that sound like white tin?  In fact, since my post, I have managed 
to get a persistent coating, but it has required a *ridiculous* 
thickness of tin - a step of some 100 microns, and of course with an 
appalling surface topology.  It should definitely require less than 
this!

I didn't know you could plate solder - I'd always seen solder as a 
substance to be applied molten (therefore melting the resist).  It's 
definitely an avenue to look into if I remain unsuccessful with the 
tin.

My catalyst is indeed Palladium based.  Your suggestion of missing 
out the e/less copper is alluring - the fewer baths the better.  How 
does this work?

Thanks again all.  Max.

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Putnam" <circuit@g...> 
wrote:
> I have to differ with you, Tom. I used Tin Plate (Electrolysis) in 
my shop
> for many years and not Gold. Gold plating was too expensive. I 
etched with
> Ferric Chloride with no problems ever. Perhaps the trick is in how 
fast you
> are able to etch the panel.
> -Mike
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "twb8899" <twb8899@y...>
> To: <Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2003 11:40 AM
> Subject: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: Oh no, blank fibreglass again!
> 
> 
> > Max,
> >
> > We always used solder plating as a resist and it worked fine. 
After
> > etching either reflow the solder or strip it off and apply one 
of the
> > newer "white tin" coatings if you want tin plating. Are you using
> > immersion tin or really electroplating it? Immersion tin is 
worthless
> > as a metallic resist but some electroplated tins will work if 
they
> > are plated heavy enough. By switching to solder plating you will
> > eliminate the problem. The same plating bath can probably be 
used.
> >
> > Ferric chloride will not work unless gold is being used as the 
etch
> > resist. Sulfuric/peroxide will work as an etchant for solder 
plated
> > boards. After stripping the photoresist dip the panel in a 10%
> > peroxide dip and then etch. This keeps the black crud from 
forming on
> > the solder plated surface for a better reflow finish. After 
etching
> > dip the panels in a 10% hydrochloric acid dip for about five 
minutes
> > to brighten the solder plating for reflow. Skip the peroxide and
> > hydrochloric dips if the solder is being stripped after etching. 
They
> > are only required for solder reflow quality.
> >
> > Bake the boards for at least 30 minutes at 300 degrees F after
> > etching and before reflowing. This is for outgassing any trapped
> > moisture and will keep the plated through holes from blowing out 
when
> > soldering.
> >
> > BTW, are you using the newer activated palladium cataylyst and
> > skipping the electroless copper stage?  Good luck on your new 
system!
> >
> > Tom
> >
> >
> > --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Max Davies" 
<max.davies@b...>
> > wrote:
> > > Hi everyone.
> > >
> > > A newbie to this group, I am (perhaps over-ambitiously) 
attempting
> > > to set up a micro through-hole plating line at home.  It's a 
lot
> > > more involved than I ever thought it would be, but I now have 
most
> > > of it working fine.  ...Except what should be the easy bit - 
the
> > > final stage - the etching!
> > >
> > >
> > > To give a brief description of what I do...
> > >
> > > STAGE 1:  Starting with plain, copper-clad board, I do the 
drilling.
> > > STAGE 2:  Apply photopolymer laminate, then expose & develop. 
(This
> > > is positive photopolymer, so the copper which will ultimately
> > become
> > > tracks is exposed to the air on developing the pattern)
> > > STAGE 3:  Go through a 6-stage process to electroless-plate the
> > > entire thing (including the holes & edges). The copper cover it
> > puts
> > > on is pretty thin, but uniform at 1-2 microns.
> > > STAGE 4:  Electroplate the copper - this gives reasonable 
thickness
> > > to the copper applied in stage 3 - I aim for 25 microns.
> > > STAGE 5:  Electroplate with tin to 10 microns.  This
> > > (theoretically!) protects the copper from etchant.
> > > STAGE 6:  Remove remaining resist.  Then etch.  This should 
leave
> > > the tin-plated areas untouched, everything else should be 
zapped.
> > >
> > >
> > > But alas no!  Stage 6 fails, because both tin *and* copper are
> > > etched, leaving me with a fine, blank piece of fibreglass!  It
> > > matters not whether I use Ferric Chloride or Sulphuric/Peroxide
> > > etchant - they both destroy what has been so lovingly 
created!!  So
> > > I reckon there must be something awry with my tin plating.
> > >
> > > It's a total impasse, and nothing I do, from 
increasing/decreasing
> > > current to re-formulating the tin plating bath according to
> > > manufacturer's instructions seems to change things.
> > >
> > > Does anyone else use a similar process, or have any clue about 
what
> > > might be the problem here?
> > >
> > > Max.
> >
> >
> >
> > Be sure to visit the group home and check for new Bookmarks and 
files:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBs
> >
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > Homebrew_PCBs-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> >
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to 
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >

Re: Oh no, blank fibreglass again!

2003-04-27 by twb8899

Max,

For solder plating just use solder bars as the anodes. I'm not sure 
what plating chemistry in used in your process. We used LeaRonal 
products for years but they merged with another firm. I don't know if 
their products are available any more. 

The solder plating chemistry was called Solderon NF. Solder plating 
will always plate tin and lead which must be "reflowed" after 
etching. After etching the plated traces have a dull gray color. Coat 
the panel with flux and dip it in soldering oil at about 450 degrees 
F for around ten seconds to reflow. The tin and lead will melt into 
the solder alloy and bond to the copper trace. Remove the panel from 
the hot oil and quench in warm water.

On the subject of etching, Mike is correct about using tin for a 
resist if it's thick enough. Like he said, it's all in the timing.
We always used sulfuric peroxide etchant for solder plated boards and 
ferric chloride for print and etch. The peroxide etchant was used in 
a heated PVC tank and the ferric chloride was used in a Chemcut 315 
spray etcher. We never had much success with tin resist in the spray 
etcher. It seemed to blow right through the tin but copper etched in 
about 1 minute in this machine. 

I have even etched with no resist at all. This is not hard to do if 
you are pattern plating on 1/8 ounce copper laminate. We used this 
type of copper laminate for extremely fine line circuitry. The plated 
copper pattern is much thicker than the laminate copper. In the spray 
etcher this thin background copper would etch in about 10 to 15 
seconds with minimal attack to the thicker circuit pattern. 

I now have a very small shop and only use ferric chloride in a small 
spray etcher. On plated through boards I just "tent" the holes by 
exposing the dry film right over the plated holes. This keeps out the 
etchant while removing the background copper. This method does 
require the artwork to have solid pads with no center dot.

After etching I solder mask and then solder coat the board if 
required. Most of my products use single sided boards so I just 
solder them and don't worry much about solder masking and solder 
coating.

The newer activated palladium catalyst method leaves a conductive 
film through the holes. This deposit is conductive enough to allow 
direct copper plating without using electroless copper. Electroless 
copper is the largest source of pollution in a pwb shop not to 
mention it's high cost of operation. There are no "plate out" 
problems when using the activated palladium process and there is 
little to no odor as well. This process is offered by several 
companies and the one I use was made by Solution Technology.

Tom

--- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Max Davies" <max.davies@b...> 
wrote:
> Liam/Tom/Mike
> 
> Thanks all for your suggestions.  It sounds as if there are several 
> routes I could go from here.
> 
> Liam - your suggestion of a different type of etchant sounds like 
an 
> obvious one to try.  I see you're UK based - can you direct me to a 
> UK supplier of this etchant and I'll give it a go.  In fact my 
> process is an industrial one (www.vantage.co.uk) - I have tried to 
> stick with just one supplier to have half a chance of making it 
work!
> 
> Tom - It is electro-tin (I tried immersion tin before, and quickly 
> realized the limitations!)  The surface is matt by design - does 
> that sound like white tin?  In fact, since my post, I have managed 
> to get a persistent coating, but it has required a *ridiculous* 
> thickness of tin - a step of some 100 microns, and of course with 
an 
> appalling surface topology.  It should definitely require less than 
> this!
> 
> I didn't know you could plate solder - I'd always seen solder as a 
> substance to be applied molten (therefore melting the resist).  
It's 
> definitely an avenue to look into if I remain unsuccessful with the 
> tin.
> 
> My catalyst is indeed Palladium based.  Your suggestion of missing 
> out the e/less copper is alluring - the fewer baths the better.  
How 
> does this work?
> 
> Thanks again all.  Max.
> 
> --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Putnam" <circuit@g...> 
> wrote:
> > I have to differ with you, Tom. I used Tin Plate (Electrolysis) 
in 
> my shop
> > for many years and not Gold. Gold plating was too expensive. I 
> etched with
> > Ferric Chloride with no problems ever. Perhaps the trick is in 
how 
> fast you
> > are able to etch the panel.
> > -Mike
> > 
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "twb8899" <twb8899@y...>
> > To: <Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2003 11:40 AM
> > Subject: [Homebrew_PCBs] Re: Oh no, blank fibreglass again!
> > 
> > 
> > > Max,
> > >
> > > We always used solder plating as a resist and it worked fine. 
> After
> > > etching either reflow the solder or strip it off and apply one 
> of the
> > > newer "white tin" coatings if you want tin plating. Are you 
using
> > > immersion tin or really electroplating it? Immersion tin is 
> worthless
> > > as a metallic resist but some electroplated tins will work if 
> they
> > > are plated heavy enough. By switching to solder plating you will
> > > eliminate the problem. The same plating bath can probably be 
> used.
> > >
> > > Ferric chloride will not work unless gold is being used as the 
> etch
> > > resist. Sulfuric/peroxide will work as an etchant for solder 
> plated
> > > boards. After stripping the photoresist dip the panel in a 10%
> > > peroxide dip and then etch. This keeps the black crud from 
> forming on
> > > the solder plated surface for a better reflow finish. After 
> etching
> > > dip the panels in a 10% hydrochloric acid dip for about five 
> minutes
> > > to brighten the solder plating for reflow. Skip the peroxide and
> > > hydrochloric dips if the solder is being stripped after 
etching. 
> They
> > > are only required for solder reflow quality.
> > >
> > > Bake the boards for at least 30 minutes at 300 degrees F after
> > > etching and before reflowing. This is for outgassing any trapped
> > > moisture and will keep the plated through holes from blowing 
out 
> when
> > > soldering.
> > >
> > > BTW, are you using the newer activated palladium cataylyst and
> > > skipping the electroless copper stage?  Good luck on your new 
> system!
> > >
> > > Tom
> > >
> > >
> > > --- In Homebrew_PCBs@yahoogroups.com, "Max Davies" 
> <max.davies@b...>
> > > wrote:
> > > > Hi everyone.
> > > >
> > > > A newbie to this group, I am (perhaps over-ambitiously) 
> attempting
> > > > to set up a micro through-hole plating line at home.  It's a 
> lot
> > > > more involved than I ever thought it would be, but I now have 
> most
> > > > of it working fine.  ...Except what should be the easy bit - 
> the
> > > > final stage - the etching!
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > To give a brief description of what I do...
> > > >
> > > > STAGE 1:  Starting with plain, copper-clad board, I do the 
> drilling.
> > > > STAGE 2:  Apply photopolymer laminate, then expose & develop. 
> (This
> > > > is positive photopolymer, so the copper which will ultimately
> > > become
> > > > tracks is exposed to the air on developing the pattern)
> > > > STAGE 3:  Go through a 6-stage process to electroless-plate 
the
> > > > entire thing (including the holes & edges). The copper cover 
it
> > > puts
> > > > on is pretty thin, but uniform at 1-2 microns.
> > > > STAGE 4:  Electroplate the copper - this gives reasonable 
> thickness
> > > > to the copper applied in stage 3 - I aim for 25 microns.
> > > > STAGE 5:  Electroplate with tin to 10 microns.  This
> > > > (theoretically!) protects the copper from etchant.
> > > > STAGE 6:  Remove remaining resist.  Then etch.  This should 
> leave
> > > > the tin-plated areas untouched, everything else should be 
> zapped.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > But alas no!  Stage 6 fails, because both tin *and* copper are
> > > > etched, leaving me with a fine, blank piece of fibreglass!  It
> > > > matters not whether I use Ferric Chloride or 
Sulphuric/Peroxide
> > > > etchant - they both destroy what has been so lovingly 
> created!!  So
> > > > I reckon there must be something awry with my tin plating.
> > > >
> > > > It's a total impasse, and nothing I do, from 
> increasing/decreasing
> > > > current to re-formulating the tin plating bath according to
> > > > manufacturer's instructions seems to change things.
> > > >
> > > > Does anyone else use a similar process, or have any clue 
about 
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> what
> > > > might be the problem here?
> > > >
> > > > Max.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Be sure to visit the group home and check for new Bookmarks and 
> files:
> > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Homebrew_PCBs
> > >
> > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > > Homebrew_PCBs-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to 
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> > >
> > >

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