QTR-Quadtone RIP

Be sure to evaluate test prints under various kinds of light. Excess ink 
can show up as strange surface texture, strange irregular blacks.

QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com wrote:
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> QTR-Quadtone RIP 
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>   Messages In This Digest (4 Messages)
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> 1.
>     OT: My list of Yahoo Groups <#1> From: Luther Hert 
> 
> 2a.
>     Re: qtr 2.6.1.0 - creating curves - EPSON 2100 - some questions abou
>     <#2a> From: simontindemans 
> 
> 3a.
>     Ink Limit ? <#3a> From: handyman856 
> 3b.
>     Re: Ink Limit ? <#3b> From: Joost Horsten 
> 
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>   Messages
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> 1.
> 
> 
>         OT: My list of Yahoo Groups
>         <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/message/7284;_ylc=X3oDMTJyY2I1c2VmBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzE0ODM0MzQ3BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTAxOTE4MgRtc2dJZAM3Mjg0BHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawN2bXNnBHN0aW1lAzEyMjQ1NTI0MjA->
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> 
>           Posted by: "Luther Hert" hertl@...
>           <mailto:hertl@...?Subject=
>           Re%3AOT%3A%20My%20list%20of%20Yahoo%20Groups>   hilbyave2
>           <http://profiles.yahoo.com/hilbyave2>
> 
> 
>             Sun Oct 19, 2008 10:17 pm (PDT)
> 
>     Hi,
> 
>     You can see a list of my groups on Grouply at the link below. Maybe
>     you'll find
>     some you want to join.
> 
>     Luther
> 
>     Here's the link:
>     http://www.grouply.com/register.php?tmg=1168120&vt=11214771
>     <http://www.grouply.com/register.php?tmg=1168120&vt=11214771>
> 
>     ====================
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>     [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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>     Back to top <#toc>
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>     (1)
> 
> 2a.
> 
> 
>         Re: qtr 2.6.1.0 - creating curves - EPSON 2100 - some questions
>         abou
>         <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/message/7285;_ylc=X3oDMTJybThlb2w4BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzE0ODM0MzQ3BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTAxOTE4MgRtc2dJZAM3Mjg1BHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawN2bXNnBHN0aW1lAzEyMjQ1NTI0MjA->
> 
> 
> 
>           Posted by: "simontindemans" simpy.lists@...
>           <mailto:simpy.lists@...?Subject=
>           Re%3A%20qtr%202%2E6%2E1%2E0%20-%20creating%20curves%20-%20EPSON%202100%20-%20some%20questions%20abou>
>             simontindemans <http://profiles.yahoo.com/simontindemans>
> 
> 
>             Mon Oct 20, 2008 3:28 am (PDT)
> 
>     Hello Roy,
> 
>     I hope you don't mind me saying so, but if I have analyzed things
>     correctly, the ICC profiles created by create-ICC have some anomalies
>     of their own. Maybe this accounts for some of the observed behavior.
> 
>     ICC output profiles contain 6 tables: perceptual, relative
>     colorimetric and saturation intents, each in both directions. I'll
>     ignore the saturation intent tables because they have little to do
>     with photography. In the profiles constructed by create-ICC, the BtoA0
>     (perceptual Lab to printer) and AtoB1 (colorimetric printer to Lab)
>     tables are correct. These are the tables used for printing and soft
>     proofing in perceptual mode. However, their inverse tables (AtoB0 and
>     BtoA0) are *not* the inverse, but rather a copy of the same table in
>     the other mode: AtoB0 is a copy of AtoB1 and BtoA0 is a copy of BtoA1.
> 
>     This breaks the use of the absolute and relative colorimetric
>     rendering intents. In addition, it makes it impossible to convert
>     *back* from the ICC profile space without affecting the look of the
>     image, because the inverse tables are not really inverse tables. The
>     QTR-Create-ICC-RGB-bpc application fixes the AtoB0 table (making an
>     invertible perceptual mapping), but changes the (correct) AtoB1 table,
>     thereby breaking soft proofing.
> 
>     For more info, see the following post that I have written a little
>     over a month ago:
>     http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/message/7113
>     <http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/message/7113>
> 
>     I think that the create-ICC application should be updated to create
>     AtoB0 and BtoA1 tables that are true inverse mappings of the BtoA0 and
>     AtoB1 tables, respectively. This would enable the use of the absolute
>     and relative colorimetric intents and my guess is that it would also
>     obviate the need for the separate create-ICC-RGB-bpc application.
> 
>     Best Regards,
>     Simon
> 
>     --- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com
>     <mailto:QuadtoneRIP%40yahoogroups.com>, "Roy Harrington" <roy@...>
>     wrote:
>      >
>      > Hi Peter,
>      >
>      > There are 3 create icc programs because some editing programs have
>      > restrictions and anomolies.
>      >
>      > QTR-Create-ICC makes a grayscale ICC for printing and softproofing.
>      > Photoshop handles these and works great.
>      >
>      > QTR-Create-ICC-RGB makes a functionally identical ICC but it's in
>     RGB format.
>      > Programs such as Lightroom, Qimage, and I think others don't work in
>      > grayscale so you need an RGB format ICC file.
>      >
>      > QTR-Create-ICC-RGB-bpc is similar to the above but maps
>     black-to-black
>      > directly. This takes away softproofing with simulate-ink-black
>     capability.
>      > But some programs seem to get the "Black Point Compensation"
>     wrong with
>      > the above ICC profiles so this ensures that everything is correct.
>      >
>      > It's unfortunate that there seems to be variation of how different
>     programs
>      > handle B&W issue but that is the current state of things -- so
>     different ICCs
>      > are needed for them.
>      >
>      > Roy
>      >
>      >
> 
>     Back to top <#toc>
>     Reply to sender
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>     (10)
> 
> 3a.
> 
> 
>         Ink Limit ?
>         <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/message/7286;_ylc=X3oDMTJyaGpobjZuBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzE0ODM0MzQ3BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTAxOTE4MgRtc2dJZAM3Mjg2BHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawN2bXNnBHN0aW1lAzEyMjQ1NTI0MjA->
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> 
> 
>           Posted by: "handyman856" avr@...
>           <mailto:avr@...?Subject= Re%3AInk%20Limit%20%3F>
>             handyman856 <http://profiles.yahoo.com/handyman856>
> 
> 
>             Mon Oct 20, 2008 9:02 am (PDT)
> 
>     Just want to be clear on the Ink Limit setting:
> 
>     Is INCREASING the Ink Limit mean you are increasing the LIMIT, thus
>     causing less ink to be put down (and v-v for reducing the Ink Limit)?
> 
>     I don't want to create a whole profile for a particular paper but it
>     seems to be printing quite heavy in the shadows - otherwise the image
>     is reasonably close to the monitor.
> 
>     So I'd like to just, (trial and error) reduce the ink and hopefully
>     unblock the shadow/deep shadow areas. Is Ink Limit the right place
>     to be?
> 
>     (Latest QTR - OS X Tiger to Epson 1400 with Piezo inks.)
> 
>     =Alan R.
> 
>     Back to top <#toc>
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>     (2)
> 3b.
> 
> 
>         Re: Ink Limit ?
>         <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/message/7287;_ylc=X3oDMTJydHFzcmhrBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzE0ODM0MzQ3BGdycHNwSWQDMTcwNTAxOTE4MgRtc2dJZAM3Mjg3BHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawN2bXNnBHN0aW1lAzEyMjQ1NTI0MjA->
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> 
> 
>           Posted by: "Joost Horsten" j.h.j.h@...
>           <mailto:j.h.j.h@...?Subject= Re%3A%20Ink%20Limit%20%3F>
>             horstenj <http://profiles.yahoo.com/horstenj>
> 
> 
>             Mon Oct 20, 2008 11:51 am (PDT)
> 
>     --- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com
>     <mailto:QuadtoneRIP%40yahoogroups.com>, "handyman856" <avr@...> wrote:
>      >
>      > Just want to be clear on the Ink Limit setting:
>      >
>      > Is INCREASING the Ink Limit mean you are increasing the LIMIT, thus
>      > causing less ink to be put down (and v-v for reducing the Ink
>     Limit)?
> 
>     No, if you increase the ink limit you increase the amount of ink laid
>     down.
> 
>      >
>      > I don't want to create a whole profile for a particular paper but it
>      > seems to be printing quite heavy in the shadows - otherwise the
>     image
>      > is reasonably close to the monitor.
>      >
>      > So I'd like to just, (trial and error) reduce the ink and hopefully
>      > unblock the shadow/deep shadow areas. Is Ink Limit the right place
>     to be?
> 
>     In itself yes, but (to do it "right") you need relinearize
>     afterwards. A properly created QTR will most likely get more out of
>     your print. But no-one stops you from being pragmatic and if you
>     yourself are happy with the results who is there to blame you?
> 
>     Joost
> 
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