2014-07-12 by phinius363@...
I have an Epson PRO 3800 & have used Lightroom for printing for years. I'd read that I could improve the tonality of my B&W images through use of QuadTone RIP so I recently purchased it. The current user guide is fairly inscrutable once one has determined an ink limit for black (K). Is there something better out there for determining ink limits for LK, LLK, LC & LM inks (I usually cool tone my B&W's)?
2014-07-13 by richard@...
I had the same issue when I started learning all this 7 years ago. I hacked my way though it until the lights came on and it all made sense. I have the process down to a (figurative) science, and have actually automated much of it and making 6 shade profiles can be done in 1 1/2 sheets of 8.5x11 paper.
I am in the middle of writing an updated a user guide, and should be done by the end of the summer. It is much easier when using a photospectromter, and creating ink limits and crossover points is not an arbitrary process.
2014-07-13 by Jacques Caron
Hi
Having working myself my way through ebb and QTR, I finally bought a spectrometer and still, I try my best to wor a process.
A new user guide would be great!
I had the same issue when I started learning all this 7 years ago. I hacked my way though it until the lights came on and it all made sense. I have the process down to a (figurative) science, and have actually automated much of it and making 6 shade profiles can be done in 1 1/2 sheets of 8.5x11 paper.
I am in the middle of writing an updated a user guide, and should be done by the end of the summer. It is much easier when using a photospectromter, and creating ink limits and crossover points is not an arbitrary process.
2014-07-16 by paulmwhiting@...
Richard,
That sounds wonderful, I look forward to it. Aren't spectrometer's expensive? I haven't used one since my college physics course! Are there viable alternatives, such as measuring densities with the eyedropper in Photoshop?
This is not to criticize or take away from your work... I do see a need for some clarifying of the QTR learning curve - thanks so much for contributing to that!
Regards,
Paul
2014-07-16 by paul@...
I would also be very keen to see a new guide. I have managed to get some good results, but always have this feeling that I could be doing better. Look forward to that one.
2014-07-17 by Alan Vlach
Is there a way to import QTR profiles from the PC version to the mac and vice versa?
Thanks
Alan
2014-07-17 by Paul Roark
The profiles are the same. The procedures & workflows are different.
Paul
Show quoted textHide quoted text
On Thu, Jul 17, 2014 at 3:27 AM, Alan Vlach
alanvlach@... [QuadtoneRIP]
<QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
Is there a way to import QTR profiles from the PC version to the mac and vice versa?
Thanks
Alan
2014-07-17 by Alan Vlach
So does that mean I can copy a qdif file into the Mac folder and run install?
The profiles are the same. The procedures & workflows are different.
Paul
2014-07-17 by Douglas Taylor
Replace .qdif with .txt and install the file
Sent from my iPad
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> On Jul 17, 2014, at 1:43 PM, "Alan Vlach alanvlach@... [QuadtoneRIP]" <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>
> So does that mean I can copy a qdif file into the Mac folder and run install?
>
>
>> On Jul 17, 2014, at 11:05 AM, Paul Roark roark.paul@... [QuadtoneRIP] <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> The profiles are the same. The procedures & workflows are different.
>>
>> Paul
>> www.PaulRoark.com
>>
>>
>>> On Thu, Jul 17, 2014 at 3:27 AM, Alan Vlach alanvlach@... [QuadtoneRIP] <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Is there a way to import QTR profiles from the PC version to the mac and vice versa?
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>>
>>> Alan
>
>
2014-07-17 by Alan Vlach
then can I replace .txt with .qdif on a PC. There is no install on a PC.
Replace .qdif with .txt and install the file
Sent from my iPad
So does that mean I can copy a qdif file into the Mac folder and run install?
The profiles are the same. The procedures & workflows are different.
Paul
2014-07-17 by Douglas Taylor
Yes
Sent from my iPad
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> On Jul 17, 2014, at 2:08 PM, "Alan Vlach alanvlach@... [QuadtoneRIP]" <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>
> then can I replace .txt with .qdif on a PC. There is no install on a PC.
>
>
>
>> On Jul 17, 2014, at 2:05 PM, Douglas Taylor dougtaylor13@... [QuadtoneRIP] <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Replace .qdif with .txt and install the file
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>>> On Jul 17, 2014, at 1:43 PM, "Alan Vlach alanvlach@... [QuadtoneRIP]" <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> So does that mean I can copy a qdif file into the Mac folder and run install?
>>>
>>>
>>>> On Jul 17, 2014, at 11:05 AM, Paul Roark roark.paul@... [QuadtoneRIP] <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The profiles are the same. The procedures & workflows are different.
>>>>
>>>> Paul
>>>> www.PaulRoark.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Jul 17, 2014 at 3:27 AM, Alan Vlach alanvlach@gmail.com [QuadtoneRIP] <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Is there a way to import QTR profiles from the PC version to the mac and vice versa?
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>
>>>>> Alan
>>>
>
>
2014-07-19 by paulmwhiting@...
Richard,
I've already posted a note of thanks and encouragement, but just to mention the part of the process that I have most trouble with: linearization. What's particularly confusing for me is that the Kodak scale has 20 steps whereas Curve Creator has 21 steps to fill in. I do understand that the Kodak scale is a reference but I have trouble interpolating my data using the Kodak scale's reference. Also, I use PS Elements which does not have an L work space. If you could suggest something on converting the eyedropper RGB values to L values that would be helpful too.
Thanks again for undertaking this project,
Paul
2014-07-19 by paulmwhiting@...
I said spectrometers are expensive, but just ran across this:
Desktop Spectrometry KitHow does this look? Very tempting. There's also a version that's an app for a Smartphone.
Paul
2014-07-19 by paulmwhiting@...
Here's the Smarphone version:
Smartphone Spectrometer Kit2014-07-20 by Jim Thyer
As a retired physicist I find this desktop spectrometer most interesting, I would love to have had it 20 years ago to measure wavelengths of spectral lines.
However from what I have seen on the website it is not a spectrophotometer as in the Eye-1, Colorvision or Colormunki type to measure colour balances and intensity to calibrate printers. From a brief look at their website I could not see it as being of use for calibrating QTR curves.
So do not rush in to buy one without a lot more checking.
Jim Thyer
Show quoted textHide quoted text
From: mailto:QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, July 20, 2014 12:39 AM
To: QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [QuadtoneRIP] Re: New User Guide
I said spectrometers are expensive, but just ran across this:
Desktop Spectrometry Kit
How does this look? Very tempting. There's also a version that's an app for a Smartphone.
Paul
2014-07-20 by Tinchohs@...
Richard, you can add another person to the list. I'm most definitely interested in this new guide. Please make sure yo keep us on the loop when you do release it. Appreciated. Martin.
2014-07-20 by paulmwhiting@...
Good points, Jim, thanks. I was a physics major but I can't call myself a physicist... I went on to languages! But you're probably right - "you get what you pay for".
Just wondering... how do you linearize your curves, ie the last step in the process? Like I say, that's where I have trouble. A member very kindly gave me a lot of help off-line, he plots step number against measured rgb values (referencing a Kodak grey scale) in Excel and comes up with a set of data whereby you can enter your own rgb values after printing and measuring a 21-step grey scale. He did a set for me, however each time I mix up a fresh batch of Carbon6 inks for my 1400 I'm supposed to re-linearize. I don't want to burden him each time I mix up fresh inks and would like to to learn how myself.
Thank you,
Paul
2014-07-20 by Paul Roark
Is the QTR Step Wedge Tool --
not working for you?
Paul
Show quoted textHide quoted text
On Sun, Jul 20, 2014 at 7:56 AM,
paulmwhiting@... [QuadtoneRIP]
<QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
Good points, Jim, thanks. I was a physics major but I can't call myself a physicist... I went on to languages! But you're probably right - "you get what you pay for".
Just wondering... how do you linearize your curves, ie the last step in the process? Like I say, that's where I have trouble. A member very kindly gave me a lot of help off-line, he plots step number against measured rgb values (referencing a Kodak grey scale) in Excel and comes up with a set of data whereby you can enter your own rgb values after printing and measuring a 21-step grey scale. He did a set for me, however each time I mix up a fresh batch of Carbon6 inks for my 1400 I'm supposed to re-linearize. I don't want to burden him each time I mix up fresh inks and would like to to learn how myself.
Thank you,
Paul
2014-07-20 by paulmwhiting@...
Thanks, Paul,
I looked at it some time ago, printed out the documentation, but apparently it's a script, and requires CS3 or C4. I'm only using PS Elements, ver. 9. Also, it uses L values, and I don't have that option in my Mode tab. :(
Paul
2014-07-20 by Greg Franco
I use the free chart throb script to get my curves..it's scanner based. Or you can also use a scanner based manual method as explained in Dan Burkholder's or Ron Reeder's first books.
Show quoted textHide quoted text
On Jul 20, 2014 11:13 AM, "
paulmwhiting@... [QuadtoneRIP]" <
QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
Thanks, Paul,
I looked at it some time ago, printed out the documentation, but apparently it's a script, and requires CS3 or C4. I'm only using PS Elements, ver. 9. Also, it uses L values, and I don't have that option in my Mode tab. :(
Paul
2014-07-20 by paulmwhiting@...
Thanks, Gary,
However the chart throb script would require full version of PhotoShop or CS, and I'm only using Elements.
As for those two photographers, I've explored their websites but... could you point me to one of the first books you referred to? Thanks!
Paul
2014-07-20 by Terry Ritz
I just uploaded the file "QTRworkflow - Diallo Photography" to our group files section. This is an excellent resource, covering both workflow and curve creation. It is written by Amadou
Diallo (
http://www.diallophotography.com/) who deserves a big "Thank You".
This will be a tremendous help in building your curve creation skills.
Best \u2013 Terry.
I have an Epson PRO 3800 & have used Lightroom for printing for years. I'd read that I could improve the tonality of my B&W images through use of QuadTone RIP so I recently purchased it. The current user guide is fairly inscrutable once one has determined an ink limit for black (K). Is there something better out there for determining ink limits for LK, LLK, LC & LM inks (I usually cool tone my B&W's)?
2014-07-20 by Greg Franco
Dan Burkholder has his book available on his website. ..The Ron Reeder/ Brad Hinkel book is on amazon. Basically both methods require scanning a test tablet, blurring it to average the local values and then reading points on the tablet with the eyedropper tool to build your curve. The same thing that the chart throb script has automated.
Show quoted textHide quoted text
On Jul 20, 2014 12:59 PM, "
paulmwhiting@... [QuadtoneRIP]" <
QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
Thanks, Gary,
However the chart throb script would require full version of PhotoShop or CS, and I'm only using Elements.
As for those two photographers, I've explored their websites but... could you point me to one of the first books you referred to? Thanks!
Paul
2014-07-21 by paulmwhiting@...
Thanks, Terry, but it looks like his Level 3 approach (which is the approach I'd like) requires a spectrometer.
Paul
2014-07-21 by paulmwhiting@...
Thanks, Dan, that helps narrow it down. I found them easily and will check them out.
Paul
2014-07-25 by richard@...
I have been traveling and getting ready for a show for the past few weeks and am sorry I wasn't able to respond to this sooner.
I am happy to hear that there is so much interest in a new user guide. In the mean time, the Diallo workflow is a good place to start. I am expanding on and simplifying the process of setting ink limits, defining cross-over points, and easily linearization.
Like others have mentioned, photospectometers like the i1 used in measuring ink density and test charts are different than those used in other applications in that they emit a specific wavelength of light and measure the reflected values at various wavelengths. The software takes that data and uses internal formulas to translate it into CIE Lab or CIExyz values. Those values can then be translated into density with a different formulas. I don't worry about the math; that is software is for ("damn it, jim. I'm an artist, not a color scientist).
I think a used i1 can be one of the most valuable tools for creating QTR curves because it allows you to quickly, accurately, and consistently record the densities. Those data can then be copied and pasted into spreadsheets to evaluate density or used with the linearization tools within QTR (as well as to create ICC profiles for softproofing). I think the scanner and photoshop script workflows are useful when one doesn't have access to a photospectometer, but those tools/workflows can be inconsistent, and the QTR curve tool is dependent on comparing to known values to work with linearization. I am considering making prints of 21-step charts that include the Lab measurements for people to use as a reference for the QTR Curve Tool photoshop script.
Linearization seems to be the main issue for people, so I will try to give some attention to the subject in the future. The QTR tools are very good at doing the linearization job without the need for spreadsheet transfer functions or phootshop .acv curves. QTR allows you simply measure the values, either density or L*, and enter them in the descriptor file. The linearization correction curve is created automatically though the install script on the Mac or when you save the profile in the QTRgui for the PC. Because I started making curves/profiles as a text file on a mac I still prefer to do it that way on the PC. I just open the .txt file in the QTRqui and save it to create the .quad file.
2014-11-10 by bill@...
Has the new user manual been lost at sea? I've had decent but not great luck building profiles for PtPd printing (and much better luck with straight BW inkjet printing, which has fewer moving parts). But it's a tedious business stapling together various people's insights and explanations. For a software program used by so many people, frequently with substantial frustration, it's disappointing that there's no all-in-one-place manual or whatever explaining the profile creation process.
2014-11-10 by Elliot Puritz
It must be exceedingly difficult to create a "QTR book" ( sic ) that is both technical AND accessible Bill. Reading the comments here suggests that there are a considerable number of questions, misunderstandings, and confused photographers! Imagine having to deal with two operating systems, a full range of computers, and many printers AND papers!
I know Richard quite well and suggest that he is working assiduously to complete his "Users Guide". I also know that the effort is taking a prodigious amount of time.
Patience! :}
Elliot
From: QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com [mailto:QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Monday, November 10, 2014 9:02 AM
To: QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [QuadtoneRIP] Re: New User Guide
Has the new user manual been lost at sea? I've had decent but not great luck building profiles for PtPd printing (and much better luck with straight BW inkjet printing, which has fewer moving parts). But it's a tedious business stapling together various people's insights and explanations. For a software program used by so many people, frequently with substantial frustration, it's disappointing that there's no all-in-one-place manual or whatever explaining the profile creation process.
2014-11-14 by richard@...
Not exactly lost at sea, just a bit of an extended cruise. An end of summer timeline was really ambitious...
As I started with it I realized that there were a few difference ways I needed to go about approaching the subject, and then create more detailed explanations and workflows for taking the confusion out of the process. Part of that includes integrating the newer measurement devices and software that can be used with current operating systems. I am including new reference files and spreadsheet templates that take make the curve creation process more exacting and without needing to scratch down density measurements and plug them in by hand.
I am not sure if I will be able to include information on digital negatives, since I am losing my current darkroom space at the end of the year and will be a bit at drift for my own platinum/palladium work (I might end up back washing prints in the bathtub...)
Tentatively, there will be detailed explanations on all the inputs for every aspect of the profile creation process, with special attention paid to ink limits and cross overs, overlaps and linearization. Then I will have an updated methods for making OEM K3 Profiles with toner inks, and completely different section on creating K4-K7 profiles using all or some Cone inks or MIS EB-6 inks, which is more time consuming to do, but is completely possible to easily create smooth linear profiles without banding or posterization—these are not piezography profiles but approach the tonal separation and smoothness of them. There might be a different section of the book geared toward people who want to experiment with different inks and blending different grey toning inks or mixes of two different quad inksets, etc.
Like I said in another thread, the more I got into it, the more it became a full on book rather than just an updated workflow for creating custom profiles (that I could writing in an week) but I am focusing the next few months on the larger, expanded version.
I'll keep you all updated with the progress.
Richard Boutwell
2014-11-15 by bill@...
Richard,
Glad to know there is hope. Remember that the perfect can be the enemy of the good. In my case, my problems are more those of threshold concepts than the workflows that follow. While various people have of course offered very helpful explanations, I am not aware of a single place that provides a clear explanation of what each of the input fields for creating an ink profile does, and in what order they should be refined. Paul Roark's posts may come closest, but don't get me quite there. As for digital negatives, I don't think they present any unique conceptual issues. The problem is that testing a profile by making an actual PtPd print, is time-consuming and offers a number of other places where things can go wrong (chemicals, humidity, coating, processing, the state of the moon, etc.). Keep up the good work.
Bill Iverson
2014-11-15 by Jacques Caron
If you get your book out, I'll be a sure buyer!
Keep the good work!
Jacques
Not exactly lost at sea, just a bit of an extended cruise. An end of summer timeline was really ambitious...
As I started with it I realized that there were a few difference ways I needed to go about approaching the subject, and then create more detailed explanations and workflows for taking the confusion out of the process. Part of that includes integrating the newer measurement devices and software that can be used with current operating systems. I am including new reference files and spreadsheet templates that take make the curve creation process more exacting and without needing to scratch down density measurements and plug them in by hand.
I am not sure if I will be able to include information on digital negatives, since I am losing my current darkroom space at the end of the year and will be a bit at drift for my own platinum/palladium work (I might end up back washing prints in the bathtub...)
Tentatively, there will be detailed explanations on all the inputs for every aspect of the profile creation process, with special attention paid to ink limits and cross overs, overlaps and linearization. Then I will have an updated methods for making OEM K3 Profiles with toner inks, and completely different section on creating K4-K7 profiles using all or some Cone inks or MIS EB-6 inks, which is more time consuming to do, but is completely possible to easily create smooth linear profiles without banding or posterization—these are not piezography profiles but approach the tonal separation and smoothness of them. There might be a different section of the book geared toward people who want to experiment with different inks and blending different grey toning inks or mixes of two different quad inksets, etc.
Like I said in another thread, the more I got into it, the more it became a full on book rather than just an updated workflow for creating custom profiles (that I could writing in an week) but I am focusing the next few months on the larger, expanded version.
I'll keep you all updated with the progress.
Richard Boutwell
2014-11-15 by joel
Thanks for the good work Richard, I’m in for a copy also.
Joel
If you get your book out, I'll be a sure buyer!
Keep the good work!
Jacques
Not exactly lost at sea, just a bit of an extended cruise. An end of summer timeline was really ambitious...
As I started with it I realized that there were a few difference ways I needed to go about approaching the subject, and then create more detailed explanations and workflows for taking the confusion out of the process. Part of that includes integrating the newer measurement devices and software that can be used with current operating systems. I am including new reference files and spreadsheet templates that take make the curve creation process more exacting and without needing to scratch down density measurements and plug them in by hand.
I am not sure if I will be able to include information on digital negatives, since I am losing my current darkroom space at the end of the year and will be a bit at drift for my own platinum/palladium work (I might end up back washing prints in the bathtub...)
Tentatively, there will be detailed explanations on all the inputs for every aspect of the profile creation process, with special attention paid to ink limits and cross overs, overlaps and linearization. Then I will have an updated methods for making OEM K3 Profiles with toner inks, and completely different section on creating K4-K7 profiles using all or some Cone inks or MIS EB-6 inks, which is more time consuming to do, but is completely possible to easily create smooth linear profiles without banding or posterization—these are not piezography profiles but approach the tonal separation and smoothness of them. There might be a different section of the book geared toward people who want to experiment with different inks and blending different grey toning inks or mixes of two different quad inksets, etc.
Like I said in another thread, the more I got into it, the more it became a full on book rather than just an updated workflow for creating custom profiles (that I could writing in an week) but I am focusing the next few months on the larger, expanded version.
I'll keep you all updated with the progress.
Richard Boutwell
2014-11-16 by Norman Christie
Richard, if you manage to complete this work you will have done a great service for the community. As you have pointed out it is very complex subject and it is this that proves too much
for newbys. I look forward to reading your ebook.
Regards,
NormanC
Sent from my iPad
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> On 14 Nov 2014, at 21:19, richard@... [QuadtoneRIP] <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>
> Not exactly lost at sea, just a bit of an extended cruise. An end of summer timeline was really ambitious...
>
>
> As I started with it I realized that there were a few difference ways I needed to go about approaching the subject, and then create more detailed explanations and workflows for taking the confusion out of the process. Part of that includes integrating the newer measurement devices and software that can be used with current operating systems. I am including new reference files and spreadsheet templates that take make the curve creation process more exacting and without needing to scratch down density measurements and plug them in by hand.
>
> I am not sure if I will be able to include information on digital negatives, since I am losing my current darkroom space at the end of the year and will be a bit at drift for my own platinum/palladium work (I might end up back washing prints in the bathtub...)
>
> Tentatively, there will be detailed explanations on all the inputs for every aspect of the profile creation process, with special attention paid to ink limits and cross overs, overlaps and linearization. Then I will have an updated methods for making OEM K3 Profiles with toner inks, and completely different section on creating K4-K7 profiles using all or some Cone inks or MIS EB-6 inks, which is more time consuming to do, but is completely possible to easily create smooth linear profiles without banding or posterization—these are not piezography profiles but approach the tonal separation and smoothness of them. There might be a different section of the book geared toward people who want to experiment with different inks and blending different grey toning inks or mixes of two different quad inksets, etc.
>
> Like I said in another thread, the more I got into it, the more it became a full on book rather than just an updated workflow for creating custom profiles (that I could writing in an week) but I am focusing the next few months on the larger, expanded version.
>
> I'll keep you all updated with the progress.
>
> Richard Boutwell
>
2014-11-16 by paulmwhiting@...
Richard,
Let me join the others and say "bravo" for taking this on.
With the off-line help of a member here, I'm using a technique which he developed with some success. Maybe you're already including this, but if not I'd be happy to describe it to you. You'll be using a flatbed scanner and Photoshop, even Elements will do. Here's a very rough outline of the linearization procedure:
You start with a Kodak greyscale, call up a scan of it in Photoshop, and with the eyedropper get an rgb readout of each step. Then enter these in Open Office Calc (or Excel, I used Calc because it's free!) in one column and the Densities as printed on the greyscale in another column. In Calc, create a curve and right click on the trend line and you will obtain a logarithmic curve for the curve. No need to understand logarithms, Calc will crunch the numbers for you.
Next print the 21 step file supplied in the QTR download using the inkset you are linearizing, and make a note of those rgb values. Expand the column of densities to include values between the 20 steps. Using that logarithmic equation at the top of rgb column you can then generate the densities for how your printer reads those 20 grey scale steps. The last step is to enter those densities in the final step of QTR.
This is very sketchy, I'm simply trying to outline it for you to ask if you have anything like this in your book-in-progress. I haven't linearized for a few months and I'm a little fuzzy on the details. I've recently mixed a new batch for the 2% black cartridge and I would benefit from retuning my curve. Going through the process again I'll be able to make this description more complete and comprehensible. (Am using Paul's Eboni-6 inkset but mixing my own inks using his Carbon-6 method.)
I hope this is of interest... it's easier than it looks!
Paul
2014-11-16 by richard@...
Thanks everyone for the continued support with this. I am happy to hear there is such an interest, but now i'm feeling the pressure... I guess it is time to deliver.
Paul W: This is similar to using the QTR Stepwedge Tool Photoshop plugin and the tiffin/kodak q-13 grayscale target. I will have a small section on using alternative means of linearizing profiles, including the scanner and spreadhsheet as well as theQTR stepwedge tool. I think a densitometer/spectro is much much much more useful and accurate, especially when making the six-gray profiles. I just don't know if consumer-level scanners will provide precise enough readings to make the calculations necessary for establishing the five gray_val= settings. I will test it out and will be happy if I am am proved wrong since it will be easier for people to make better profile.
I am finishing up my testing of the 1430 and EB-6 inks this week and will be writing a post about what makes a good profile along with scans of problem prints and measurements. Its too bad that the inks are changing, I hope ther is enough in stock at MIS to last a while before the replacements are available.
Richard Boutwell
2014-11-16 by sanking@...
You can also linearize with a scanner using a greyscale with the QTR Stepwedge Tool, available as a download from the Quadtone RIP web site. Directions indicate it works with CS3 and CS4, I also found it to work with CS5, not sure about CC.
The linearization process is virtually identical for digital negatives and inkjet prints. For the negative you first make a print with your process, then linearize as you would with a regular print. At the end the lab values need to be inverted to insert into the QTR profile. In fact, the QTR-Linearize-Data-Tool offers choice of normal lab values for prints, or inverted for digital negatives.
The more problematic issue for digital negatives is selection of the inks. In the case of the Epson K3 inkset the only useful UV blockers in a profile for digital negatives are PK, Y and LK. You could also use MK but it tends to give more grain. With digital negatives it is important to be as efficient as possible with the inks since they don't dry as fast on OHP as on paper. Instead of the overlapping curves typical of print profiles, where you have several gray values, I have found that with digital negatives the use of a single gray value where all values follow the K, is simpler and easier to adjust for density range. You can find examples of profiles that I use with carbon transfer with the Epson 7800 and R3000 in the Files section of the Carbon Transfer group on Yahoo.
Sandy
2014-11-17 by paulmwhiting@...
Richard,
Please don't take all the replies as pressure! You are providing a service, and what you are working on will come in due time. I also look forward to Paul's update on a new 2MK profile for the 1400, but we know he's working on it and it will come by and by.
Richard and Sandy,
I'm only using PS Elements and although I looked at Stepwedge with great interest, it requires something called scripts (is that the word?) which is not available to Elements users. One of Paul's goals is to make quality b/w printing affordable and simple, so being a crabby and stingy old curmudgeon I'm trying to linearize with what I have on hand.
I've spent some time today creating a detailed step-by-step set of instructions for linearizing using simple Elements, a basic Epson flatbed scanner, and the open source version of Excel known as Open Office Calc. It's been a few months since I did this, and I've hit a bit of a wall, so give me a few days.
A breakthrough would be a consumer-level spectrometer!
Best,
Paul
2014-12-03 by paulmwhiting@...
Richard et al,
I finally completed my file "Using a flat-bed scanner to measure the ink densities and linearize a curve in QTR".
I decided to use Dropbox instead of our Files section here because it seemed easier to work the link into an existing thread. Richard, if you find this useful for your manual, please feel free to do so. I can't claim to have developed this method, I got the idea from a member who wishes to remain anonymous. I simply condensed our lengthy e-mail exchange, and I made this is as concise and clear as I could.
This is my first attempt to use Dropbox so please tell me if this doesn't work for you. You don't need Dropbox installed on your computer if I've done this correctly.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/tw68s4q0dha3ild/QTR%20curve%20making.pdf?dl=0I may start a new thread but I wanted to mention it here first because I promised to do so.
Enjoy the journey, as Paul R. would say!
Paul W.
2016-01-30 by James Hajicek
A very beginning question.
I can not get Photoshop CS5 to recognize the QTR StepWedge Tool.jsx. file
I dragged it into the CS5 Preset/scripts folder and always get the "no step wedge currently loaded" when I try to open under "file",
I have quit CS5 after dragging it into that folder as well as rebooting my computer. Any help on what I am doing wrong will be greatly appreciated.
In advance,
many thanks,
James
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On Sun, Nov 16, 2014 at 3:08 PM,
richard@... [QuadtoneRIP]
<QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
Thanks everyone for the continued support with this. I am happy to hear there is such an interest, but now i'm feeling the pressure... I guess it is time to deliver.
Paul W: This is similar to using the QTR Stepwedge Tool Photoshop plugin and the tiffin/kodak q-13 grayscale target. I will have a small section on using alternative means of linearizing profiles, including the scanner and spreadhsheet as well as theQTR stepwedge tool. I think a densitometer/spectro is much much much more useful and accurate, especially when making the six-gray profiles. I just don't know if consumer-level scanners will provide precise enough readings to make the calculations necessary for establishing the five gray_val= settings. I will test it out and will be happy if I am am proved wrong since it will be easier for people to make better profile.
I am finishing up my testing of the 1430 and EB-6 inks this week and will be writing a post about what makes a good profile along with scans of problem prints and measurements. Its too bad that the inks are changing, I hope ther is enough in stock at MIS to last a while before the replacements are available.
Richard Boutwell
2016-01-30 by richard@...
It's been a while since I've use me the scanner step wedge tool, but I think you might need the scan open in photoshop first before trying to run the plugin/script.
RB
2016-01-31 by James Hajicek
Thanks Richard. Resolved the issue by finding another file that had a positive step wedge tablet in order to begin this daunting process.
Best,
James
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On Sat, Jan 30, 2016 at 4:59 PM,
richard@... [QuadtoneRIP]
<QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
It's been a while since I've use me the scanner step wedge tool, but I think you might need the scan open in photoshop first before trying to run the plugin/script.
RB