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Transferring curves from Mac to Windows

Transferring curves from Mac to Windows

2015-04-23 by jeff.grant@...

I've just been reading Tom Moore's guide on creating curves in Windows. After the Mac way, it's like fingers on a blackboard. The profiles that I have created for the Mac have been made by linearising, and then curve and ICC creation. I haven't been near the ink separation step and have had good profiles for my 3880.


Is it possible to migrate the curve TXT file from a Mac to a Windows machine?

Re: Transferring curves from Mac to Windows

2015-04-24 by donsbryant@...

Perhaps I am confused by your post but if you create your own curves then you must print an ink separation test as your first test to properly define the ink limits of your media.

Don Bryant

Re: Transferring curves from Mac to Windows

2015-04-24 by brian_downunda@...

That was my understanding too, but I've recently read some instructions that offer a simpler approach. There are some (but not all) printers for which QTR ships with a "raw" or generic set of curves. These instructions suggest that you first try linearising these curves and seeing how close you get. Only if the results are not satisfactory do you go to the next stage and print the separation page and set your own ink limits etc. I've never tried this simpler approach using raw curves, so I have no idea how well or how often it works. There don't seem to be raw curves for the high gloss printers (R1800/1900/2000).

From what I can gather and recall, the original Tom Moore instructions were written from a Windows perspective a decade ago, before there were sets of raw curves, and when the whole process of curve creation was fairly new. So it was a fairly detailed and lengthy document. The more recent instructions were written from a Mac perspective and are fairly concise. So it may initially appear that the approaches for curve creation for Mac and Windows are different, but they're not. Of course where the files are stored and how you install them is different, but the principles of curve creation are the same.

Re: [QuadtoneRIP] Re: Transferring curves from Mac to Windows

2015-04-25 by ReD Ognita

I recently made a few curves using the RAW curves as a baseline. PC.
- You choose the closest RAW curve to the type of paper. - Rename- Print a 21x4 Random target. - Read it using a spectro. - Drop it on the linearize thingy and a txt (out) file would be created. - Copy the values on the "linearise" line of the txt file- Open your the RAW curve that you have renamed via the Curve Creation- Input the Values- Click Show Curve (to save the adjustments)- Done.
-Print Print a 21x4 Random target again, using the Curve that you just did.- Read it using a spectro. 
- Drop it on the linearize thingy and a txt (out) file would be created. - Copy the values on the "linearise" line of the txt file- Open your the RAW curve that you have renamed via the Curve Creation- Input the Values- Click Show Curve (to save the adjustments)- Done.
Show quoted textHide quoted text
      From: "brian_downunda@... [QuadtoneRIP]" <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com>
 To: QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com
 Sent: Saturday, April 25, 2015 7:31 AM
 Subject: [QuadtoneRIP] Re: Transferring curves from Mac to Windows

    That was my understanding too, but I've recently read some instructions that offer a simpler approach.  There are some (but not all) printers for which QTR ships with a "raw" or generic set of curves.  These instructions suggest that you first try linearising these curves and seeing how close you get.  Only if the results are not satisfactory do you go to the next stage and print the separation page and set your own ink limits etc.  I've never tried this simpler approach using raw curves, so I have no idea how well or how often it works.  There don't seem to be raw curves for the high gloss printers (R1800/1900/2000).


From what I can gather and recall, the original Tom Moore instructions were written from a Windows perspective a decade ago, before there were sets of raw curves, and when the whole process of curve creation was fairly new.  So it was a fairly detailed and lengthy document.  The more recent instructions were written from a Mac perspective and are fairly concise.  So it may initially appear that the approaches for curve creation for Mac and Windows are different, but they're not.  Of course where the files are stored and how you install them is different, but the principles of curve creation are the same.  #yiv3166408913 #yiv3166408913 -- #yiv3166408913ygrp-mkp {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;}#yiv3166408913 #yiv3166408913ygrp-mkp hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;}#yiv3166408913 #yiv3166408913ygrp-mkp #yiv3166408913hd {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;}#yiv3166408913 #yiv3166408913ygrp-mkp #yiv3166408913ads {margin-bottom:10px;}#yiv3166408913 #yiv3166408913ygrp-mkp .yiv3166408913ad {padding:0 0;}#yiv3166408913 #yiv3166408913ygrp-mkp .yiv3166408913ad p {margin:0;}#yiv3166408913 #yiv3166408913ygrp-mkp .yiv3166408913ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;}#yiv3166408913 #yiv3166408913ygrp-sponsor #yiv3166408913ygrp-lc {font-family:Arial;}#yiv3166408913 #yiv3166408913ygrp-sponsor #yiv3166408913ygrp-lc #yiv3166408913hd {margin:10px 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Re: Transferring curves from Mac to Windows

2015-04-25 by jeff.grant@...

I'm using K7 inks now but I did make curves for K3 for a 3880 without the Inksep step. They were nice and linear and looked good to my untrained eye.

Re: Transferring curves from Mac to Windows

2015-04-25 by richard@...

Starting with those raw ink descriptor files is an option, but here are two points of caution with just linearizing the raw curves:

1: Most papers will respond to the same ink limits differently so the generic cross over points in the raw profiles might not (more likely wont) be accurate from one paper to the next. When using only three gray inks it might not be absolutely critical to have the exact cross over point from one paper to the next, but it can make linearizing easier in keeping down the "not constantly increasing" errors down.

2: Some papers might do better with a higher or lower K limit and K boost. You will see that in the measurement of the 21 step file it if stops increasing past the 90% patch. If it doesn't stop then how do you know how dense you really can make it? I've pretty much settled on keeping the ink limits for K, Lk, and LLk between 55 and 64 and then adjusting the boost depending on the paper. Changing those K limits would require changing the cross over points for the LK and LLK inks too (gray_value= in the text file or the "density" inputs on the windows gui). To do that you would need still need to print the ink separation page for the K3 inks with those new ink limits, and then follow the steps for interpolating the cross over points.

The bottom line with not printing and measuring the ink sep page is you don't know what ink load your paper is capable of holding.

Richard Boutwell

Re: Transferring curves from Mac to Windows

2015-04-25 by richard@...

ReD Ognita
I recently made a few curves using the RAW curves as a baseline. PC. - You choose the closest RAW curve to the type of paper. - Rename- Print a 21x4 Random


I am not sure if I am reading your post correctly. Are these two separate sets of instructions?

If not, then there is a pretty important point you are missing. There is no two step linearization (at least not how you describe here).

I will copy your instructions here and insert comments below

- You choose the closest RAW curve to the type of paper.
- Rename
- Print a 21x4 Random target.
- Read it using a spectro.
- Drop it on the linearize thingy and a txt (out) file would be created.
- Copy the values on the "linearise" line of the txt file
- Open your the RAW curve that you have renamed via the Curve Creation
- Input the Values
- Click Show Curve (to save the adjustments)
- Done.

Everything above is correct, and the resulting profile has now been linearized. What you wrote below is where it goes sideways.

-Print Print a 21x4 Random target again, using the Curve that you just did.
^^The curve you just did is linear and printing it again is just for checking for linearity and creating an ICC profile for soft proofing^^
- Read it using a spectro.
- Drop it on the linearize thingy and a txt (out) file would be created.
^^This part should be just checking for linearity^^
- Copy the values on the "linearise" line of the txt file
^^there is no need for this or anything that follows^^
- Open your the RAW curve that you have renamed via the Curve Creation
^^This profile/curve has already been linearized^^
- Input the Values
^^This Overwrites the linearization string with the linear measurement values from the second 21x4 target^^
- Click Show Curve (to save the adjustments)
^^The linear values entered in the previous step tells the installation script that the raw curve is already linear and does not create a correction curve and you end up with the unlinearized profile^^
- Done.
^^nope, just back where you started^^

I think what is not being understood is how the installation/ink partitioning program works through the ink descriptor file. This is a generalization, and admittedly, I don't know the specifics of the math or programming behind it, but here is roughly how it works.

It first takes the ink limits, cross over values and gray curve settings and creates a temporary set of curves. It then checks if there are toner inks used and if do creates temporary curves for those inks too. It then checks to see if there is anything in the linearize= line. If not, it creates the .quad file that contains the values from the temporary set of curves (this is an unlinearized profile). If there are values in the linearize= line, it takes those and creates an inverse correction curve to reach linearity, and applies it to the set of temporary curves and creates the final .quad file. At that point the profile has been "linearized".

Any time you change a value in any of the settings and press "show curve" (or run the install script on a mac) it goes through the whole process all over again. Since it works "top down" and doesn't "know" if there are linearization values until it gets to that point in the ink descriptor file, it always creates an unlinearized temporary set of curves from the ink limit, cross over, and gray curve settings (There are some other things that it does to check for specific ink curves, which overrides the cross over settings, but that is a whole other "can of worms").

If I completely misunderstood your post and there is something in the QTRgui I am missing please point me to it.

Richard Boutwell






Re: [QuadtoneRIP] Re: Transferring curves from Mac to Windows

2015-04-25 by ReD Ognita

The RAW curves are empty. The first process was to load up, the second to linearise.I understand what you are saying - there should only one process, but this process is outlined on the QTR website (tutorial) and I also tested it (if it actually works)And it was indeed more linear on the second run. 
sample attached.
Show quoted textHide quoted text
      From: "richard@... [QuadtoneRIP]" <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com>
 To: QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com 
 Sent: Saturday, April 25, 2015 12:40 PM
 Subject: [QuadtoneRIP] Re: Transferring curves from Mac to Windows
   
    ReD OgnitaI recently made a few curves using the RAW curves as a baseline. PC. - You choose the closest RAW curve to the type of paper. - Rename- Print a 21x4 Random

I am not sure if I am reading your post correctly. Are these two separate sets of instructions? 
If not, then there is a pretty important point you are missing. There is no two step linearization (at least not how you describe here).
I will copy your instructions here and insert comments below
- You choose the closest RAW curve to the type of paper. - Rename- Print a 21x4 Random target. - Read it using a spectro. - Drop it on the linearize thingy and a txt (out) file would be created. - Copy the values on the "linearise" line of the txt file- Open your the RAW curve that you have renamed via the Curve Creation- Input the Values- Click Show Curve (to save the adjustments)- Done.
Everything above is correct, and the resulting profile has now been linearized. What you wrote below is where it goes sideways.
-Print Print a 21x4 Random target again, using the Curve that you just did.^^The curve you just did is linear and printing it again is just for checking for linearity and creating an ICC profile for soft proofing^^- Read it using a spectro. - Drop it on the linearize thingy and a txt (out) file would be created.^^This part should be just checking for linearity^^- Copy the values on the "linearise" line of the txt file^^there is no need for this or anything that follows^^- Open your the RAW curve that you have renamed via the Curve Creation^^This profile/curve has already been linearized^^- Input the Values^^This Overwrites the linearization string with the linear measurement values from the second 21x4 target^^
- Click Show Curve (to save the adjustments)^^The linear values entered in the previous step tells the installation script that the raw curve is already linear and does not create a correction curve and you end up with the unlinearized profile^^
- Done.^^nope, just back where you started^^
I think what is not being understood is how the installation/ink partitioning program works through the ink descriptor file. This is a generalization, and admittedly, I don't know the specifics of the math or programming behind it, but here is roughly how it works.
It first takes the ink limits, cross over values and gray curve settings and creates a temporary set of curves. It then checks if there are toner inks used and if do creates temporary curves for those inks too. It then checks to see if there is anything in the linearize= line. If not, it creates the .quad file that contains the values from the temporary set of curves (this is an unlinearized profile). If there are values in the linearize= line, it takes those and creates an inverse correction curve to reach linearity, and applies it to the set of temporary curves and creates the final .quad file. At that point the profile has been "linearized". 
Any time you change a value in any of the settings and press "show curve" (or run the install script on a mac) it goes through the whole process all over again. Since it works "top down" and doesn't "know" if there are linearization values until it gets to that point in the ink descriptor file, it always creates an unlinearized temporary set of curves from the ink limit, cross over, and gray curve settings (There are some other things that it does to check for specific ink curves, which overrides the cross over settings, but that is a whole other "can of worms").
If I completely misunderstood your post and there is something in the QTRgui I am missing please point me to it. 
Richard Boutwell

Re: [QuadtoneRIP] Re: Transferring curves from Mac to Windows

2015-04-25 by ReD Ognita

Apologies to the group. I tried to include the image on the replyHere's the link to the image: http://oi57.tinypic.com/5nuw5.jpg

In any case, this derails the main topic of the discussion which is the title on the subject line (Transferring curves from Mac to Windows)
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Show quoted textHide quoted text
      From: "ReD Ognita ognita@... [QuadtoneRIP]" <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com>
 To: "QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com" <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> 
 Sent: Saturday, April 25, 2015 1:22 PM
 Subject: Re: [QuadtoneRIP] Re: Transferring curves from Mac to Windows
   
    The RAW curves are empty. The first process was to load up, the second to linearise.I understand what you are saying - there should only one process, but this process is outlined on the QTR website (tutorial) and I also tested it (if it actually works)And it was indeed more linear on the second run. 
sample attached.

From: "richard@richardboutwell.com [QuadtoneRIP]" <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com>
 To: QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com 
 Sent: Saturday, April 25, 2015 12:40 PM
 Subject: [QuadtoneRIP] Re: Transferring curves from Mac to Windows
 
  ReD OgnitaI recently made a few curves using the RAW curves as a baseline. PC. - You choose the closest RAW curve to the type of paper. - Rename- Print a 21x4 Random

I am not sure if I am reading your post correctly. Are these two separate sets of instructions? 
If not, then there is a pretty important point you are missing. There is no two step linearization (at least not how you describe here).
I will copy your instructions here and insert comments below
- You choose the closest RAW curve to the type of paper. - Rename- Print a 21x4 Random target. - Read it using a spectro. - Drop it on the linearize thingy and a txt (out) file would be created. - Copy the values on the "linearise" line of the txt file- Open your the RAW curve that you have renamed via the Curve Creation- Input the Values- Click Show Curve (to save the adjustments)- Done.
Everything above is correct, and the resulting profile has now been linearized. What you wrote below is where it goes sideways.
-Print Print a 21x4 Random target again, using the Curve that you just did.^^The curve you just did is linear and printing it again is just for checking for linearity and creating an ICC profile for soft proofing^^- Read it using a spectro. - Drop it on the linearize thingy and a txt (out) file would be created.^^This part should be just checking for linearity^^- Copy the values on the "linearise" line of the txt file^^there is no need for this or anything that follows^^- Open your the RAW curve that you have renamed via the Curve Creation^^This profile/curve has already been linearized^^- Input the Values^^This Overwrites the linearization string with the linear measurement values from the second 21x4 target^^
- Click Show Curve (to save the adjustments)^^The linear values entered in the previous step tells the installation script that the raw curve is already linear and does not create a correction curve and you end up with the unlinearized profile^^
- Done.^^nope, just back where you started^^
I think what is not being understood is how the installation/ink partitioning program works through the ink descriptor file. This is a generalization, and admittedly, I don't know the specifics of the math or programming behind it, but here is roughly how it works.
It first takes the ink limits, cross over values and gray curve settings and creates a temporary set of curves. It then checks if there are toner inks used and if do creates temporary curves for those inks too. It then checks to see if there is anything in the linearize= line. If not, it creates the .quad file that contains the values from the temporary set of curves (this is an unlinearized profile). If there are values in the linearize= line, it takes those and creates an inverse correction curve to reach linearity, and applies it to the set of temporary curves and creates the final .quad file. At that point the profile has been "linearized". 
Any time you change a value in any of the settings and press "show curve" (or run the install script on a mac) it goes through the whole process all over again. Since it works "top down" and doesn't "know" if there are linearization values until it gets to that point in the ink descriptor file, it always creates an unlinearized temporary set of curves from the ink limit, cross over, and gray curve settings (There are some other things that it does to check for specific ink curves, which overrides the cross over settings, but that is a whole other "can of worms").
If I completely misunderstood your post and there is something in the QTRgui I am missing please point me to it. 
Richard Boutwell

Re: [QuadtoneRIP] Re: Transferring curves from Mac to Windows

2015-04-25 by jeff.grant@...

The original question was sorted out a while back, so feel free to go for it. I don't dispute the need for the inksep prints, but I do wonder how K7 systems survive without it. The custom curve process is a single pass target.

Given that I'm now a K7 user, this is quite academic for me.

Re: [QuadtoneRIP] Re: Transferring curves from Mac to Windows

2015-04-25 by ReD

I was thinking the same thing - that it should be a one time print and read only. I printed the second time and pasted the linearise values and checked. And it was linear. 

The RAW curve qidf does not have any values on the linearize tab. So when used as a base, the first values that will be used are of the linearised values of the target. 

This should be it. 

But when you use the created curve to print another target, read and place  the linearise values on the already created curve, the graph shows a better linearity. 

What could be causing this if the norm is single process only. And does it cause harm?
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> On Apr 25, 2015, at 4:04 PM, jeff.grant@... [QuadtoneRIP] <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
> 
> The original question was sorted out a while back, so feel free to go for it. I don't dispute the need for the inksep prints, but I do wonder how K7 systems survive without it. The custom curve process is a single pass target.
> 
> 
> Given that I'm now a K7 user, this is quite academic for me.
>

Re: [QuadtoneRIP] Re: Unlinearizing was Transferring curves from Mac to Windows

2015-04-25 by richard@...

Jeff, the Piezography K6/K7 master curves have already gone through the partitioning stage, although it is much different than how QTR partitions the gray inks. Since there is so much overlap in the piezography curves, and since Jon Cone's linearization process is from the 256 step target, there is no interpolation or spline function with the 21-step target like there is in the QTR linearization step. In both processes the actual place on the x axis where the inks start and stop stays the same, but the values at the y axis are what change to arrive at a linear profile.

>>I printed the second time and pasted the linearise values and checked. And it was linear.<<

Where are you pasting those second measurements? Back into the linearization tab? I bet if you printed and measured the 21x4 a third time you will find that it is no longer linear.

When you look at the Linearization tab in the ink curve window after pressing "show curve" I believe what you are seeing is the correction curve that is was applied to the curves. It looks like a straight line the second time you paste the linearize= values back into the profile because it it saying, "no correction needed".

I think the confusing thing is the name of the “Linearize-Data” script where you drop the measurement files. The Linearize-Data script does not do the linearizing. It only graphs the LAB values and creates a comma separated list of the measured LAB\_L values in a format the installer script can work with. What you seeing in the -out.txt graph from printing and measuring the 2nd 21x4 target is just the result of the linearization from the first target. I always recommend that you do print the target the second time as you did, and then measure it and check the graph to make sure the linearization worked, but that is the point where you should stop.

Richard Boutwell

Re: Transferring curves from Mac to Windows

2015-04-25 by brian_downunda@...

---In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, <richard@...> wrote :

Jeff, the Piezography K6/K7 master curves have already gone through the partitioning stage, although it is much different than how QTR partitions the gray inks. .... In both processes the actual place on the x axis where the inks start and stop stays the same, but the values at the y axis are what change to arrive at a linear profile.

This isn't the case in the K7 curves for my printer - the x values shift as well as the y. Not by a lot, the y shifts more, but the x values do shift, so it's not correct to say that the Cone curves only scale up or down the quantity of each shade delivered without any changes in start and end points. His curve creation process appears to be more complex than that.

You were arguing that getting the ink limits correct for each paper type is important. If this is correct then how can the Cone custom curve creation process possibly work? There's only only master curve for each printer model. So you print a single page using the single master curve and send it off to IJM, and they send you a QTR curve. So there's no attempt to reduce or increase the amount of ink being laid down for each paper type to allow for differences in loading capacity. How can they have already gone through the partitioning phase when the ink load of the paper in question hasn't been measured? How could it work without this being measured up front?

Re: Transferring curves from Mac to Windows

2015-04-25 by richard@...

You were arguing that getting the ink limits correct for each paper type is important. If this is correct then how can the Cone custom curve creation process possibly work? There's only only master curve for each printer model. So you print a single page using the single master curve and send it off to IJM, and they send you a QTR curve. So there's no attempt to reduce or increase the amount of ink being laid down for each paper type to allow for differences in loading capacity.

Jeff, me reply below is based somewhat on speculation of Jon's piezography profiler, but also on my experience making my own external linearization process from the piezography master curves (i wont go more into this now). From what I've experimented with, the piezrogaphy master curves are designed to lay down too much ink (and they block up in the shadows). When the 256 step target is printed they can see at which point the paper blocks up and that point becomes the high limit. It is like setting the output shadow slider in a photoshop levels adjustment. and all the the x values are adjusted accordingly ( If you open some of the piezography curves in a text editor some will even say "limit 95.0"). When they run their linearization function the y values are adjusted up or down and to arrive at the needed y value or each ink to create the needed tone. So when I said the x- values don't change it was not entirely accurate, they do change based on whatever the overall limit is at the end of the scale, but the change is not dramatic.

Also take a look at the differences between the P2 K6 matte and K7 master curves: they are the same except the k6 curve doesn't have the shade 7 ink. Since the x value for shade 6 in both the k7 and k6 curves starts at 0,0 and immediately begins increasing, the y values are only shifted up to create the darker tones needed in the highlights of the k6 curves where those tones were covered by shade 7. The benefit of the really long overlaps along the x axis is that y vaules can be moved up or down for each ink at more points than with the QTR partitioning method.

Richard Boutwell

Re: Transferring curves from Mac to Windows

2015-04-26 by brian_downunda@...

You may well be right, but we will never get confirmation.


---In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, <richard@...> wrote :

below is based somewhat on speculation of Jon's piezography profiler

Re: Transferring curves from Mac to Windows

2015-04-26 by brian_downunda@...

Upon reflection, I'm not so sure about this statement. I've compared the master curve for my printer with the curves for a couple of commonly-used paper types. There are definite and quite different changes in shape of the seven component parts of each of these two curves. So it doesn't appear to me like they simply adjust for loading and then scale up or down to achieve linearity. What I see isn't consistent with that. It might be what we have to do if we want to relinearise ourselves, but it's not what IJM does.


---In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, <richard@...> wrote :

When they run their linearization function the y values are adjusted up or down and to arrive at the needed y value or each ink to create the needed tone. So when I said the x- values don't change it was not entirely accurate, they do change based on whatever the overall limit is at the end of the scale, but the change is not dramatic.

Re: Transferring curves from Mac to Windows

2015-04-28 by richard@...

>>It might be what we have to do if we want to relinearise ourselves, but it's not what IJM does.<<

Not trying to argue this to death, but...

The "problem" that needs solving is how to get from a single master curve to a finished linearized curve with just one printed target. I am not saying exactly how they are doing it, but generally what the method and result is—establishing a limit/black point and adjusting the y values up and down (which is what causes the shape to change). It wasn't obvious to me either when looking at the master curve compared to the linearized ones, but it over the course of a few months staring at the ceiling it started to make more sense, and what led me to I prototype my custom QTR toolbox. It worked and was a nice challenge at the time, and then I moved onto other things. I just use it to keep a couple of wonky printers working with some custom ink mixes. This thread got me to fix up and change a few things on my original kit to make it more flexible for different printers and ink sets. When I get some more time I might make a post about it, but there are a bunch more in the pipe, and trying to wrap up other writing first...

Do you have a specro you can measure the QTR 21x4-random and/or 51-step targets printed with the k7 or k6 P2 master curve, and then email the measurement files to me? If not, then just send me an email through my site and I will send you a few screen shots illustrating what is happening here with some tests I did for someone today.

Richard Boutwell
richard @ richardboutwell.com or the contact form on www.bwmastery.com

Re: Transferring curves from Mac to Windows

2015-05-05 by brian_downunda@...


Yes I have an i1, but as a K7 printer my interest is in re-linearising existing K7 curves for an ageing printer. i haven't had the need to create new ones, nor to create any new K3 QTR curves either, although I've done it some years ago. I have a technique for K7 re-linearisation that works pretty darn well for me. So do you I gather, as have others on this forum. No doubt all variations on a theme.

There's no point debating how IJM relinearise their curves, since any opinions that any of us have cannot be either be validated or invalidated. But having compared the K7 master curves with the shipped K7 curves, you'll have a hard time convincing me that they're simply setting the black point and rescaling. If you want to share your own demonstration of how your way of doing this changes the shape of component curves, either here or on your blog, then feel free.

But I do have a couple of questions. In a Lula thread:
http://forum.luminous-landscape.com/index.php?topic=94806.msg797910#msg797910
you advocated using at least chart with at least 51 patches for doing re-linearisation / creating curves. As you noted, these show the real unevenness in certain printer / paper combinations. Even printing several of these and averaging them can still give a linearisation plot with a lot of twists and turns.

Qu 1: Do you average these linearisation plots, to smooth out the little bumps, or use them as-is in creating curves and linearising? I'm not just referring to a single set of 51 patches, but to an average of three of them, in order to average out printer and measurement device variation.

Qu2: Have you noticed any variation between papers as to whether the linearisation plots are smooth or bumpy? I.e., if you do the 51x3 test on three papers ** on the same printer**, do you find one smooth (although with some departure from linearity), another not all that smooth, and the third somewhere in between? If so, what is your interpretation of this?


---In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, <richard@...> wrote :

The "problem" that needs solving is how to get from a single master curve to a finished linearized curve with just one printed target. I am not saying exactly how they are doing it, but generally what the method and result is—establishing a limit/black point and adjusting the y values up and down (which is what causes the shape to change).

QTR Toning

2015-06-05 by ReD Ognita

Hi guys,
Quick question. 
I am familiar with the split toning function of QTR, but what if you have a specific tone you're aiming for? I have a specific tone I have made using the Epson's ABW Horizontal and Vertical Axis, and I would like to use QTR for printing. The only thing I can think of is to print a step-wedge using my ABW settings, read it and create a QTR curve from it.
Any other way?
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