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Poor quality on A3

Poor quality on A3

2016-03-12 by tattobe@...

Hello,

When I print on A3 (saying this because it does not happen on A4) the first and the last 1,5cm (1/2 inch) are visibly of poorer quality than the rest of the print (on 2880dpi). Does anybody knows why?

Thank you

Re: [QuadtoneRIP] Poor quality on A3

2016-03-12 by forums@walkerblackwell.com

This happens with most small-format printers at 2880 dpi (the R1430 etc).

It’s a function of the low-quality printheads.

Best bet is to simply use larger paper and cut-down or print with 1” top/bottom margins.

Regards,
Walker

Re: [QuadtoneRIP] Poor quality on A3

2016-03-12 by tattobe@...

Thank you Walker.
I thought something was wrong because this does not happen when I print from Photoshop.
Only with QuadtoneRIP.
And I also didn't have it with A3+ format.
My printer is R2880.
Regars
Tatjana

Re: [QuadtoneRIP] Poor quality on A3

2016-03-12 by forums@walkerblackwell.com

I stand corrected and really didn’t think that through outside of the really cheepo printers. The R2880 (for example) uses the DX5 head so . . .

You’re correct. It has to be in-softw. ehh. These small formats are indeed pesky.

regards,
Walker
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> On Mar 12, 2016, at 5:22 PM, brian_downunda@... [QuadtoneRIP] <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
> 
> I disagree with Walker that it's caused by low-quality print heads.  This has been explained here previously by Roy Harrington.  See this blog post for a detailed explanation and workarounds:
> 
> http://www.cyberhalides.com/piezography-printing/microbanding-and-gloss-printing-issues-with-qtr/ <http://www.cyberhalides.com/piezography-printing/microbanding-and-gloss-printing-issues-with-qtr/>
> 
> 
>  
> 
>

Re: [QuadtoneRIP] Poor quality on A3

2016-03-12 by jeff.grant@...

Nowhere near as pesky as keeping ink flowing in the lines in the bigger ones. Microbanding is not always obvious, sedimentation in ink lines is.

Re: Poor quality on A3

2016-03-13 by brian_downunda@...

If the R1430 is that low-grade, then why has IJM put so much effort into developing the forthcoming Piezo digital negative system for it?

Re: [QuadtoneRIP] Poor quality on A3

2016-03-13 by forums@walkerblackwell.com

A few reasons for doing the 1430.

1. Because it’s actually a really very high-quality K6 head after the first inch and before the last. It’s dither pattern is almost superior to the x900s frankly (what I’m seeing in-lab right now). We are putting a CISS on it that (when raised to the proper level) increases pressure to the head decreases any small micro-banding.

2. This lowers the barrier-of-entry for anyone wanting to do alt-process at really high quality! We are seeing resolutions at a 1point-text level with Platinum right now . . . .

3. It’s a $300.00 printer that you can get new, that doesn’t have insane DRM built into it that excludes alternative inks.

cheers,
Walker


On Mar 12, 2016, at 9:36 PM, brian_downunda@... [QuadtoneRIP] <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

If the R1430 is that low-grade, then why has IJM put so much effort into developing the forthcoming Piezo digital negative system for it?


Re: Poor quality on A3

2016-03-13 by tattobe@...

Thank you very much Brian!!! This makes it clear...

Thanks again
Tatjana

Re: [QuadtoneRIP] Poor quality on A3

2016-03-13 by Jacques Caron

Hi Walker

I'm with you all the way! I've been printing on a 1430 for more than a year now. Aside from some air in the lines when I refill (a 24 hrs sitting time cures it) the 1430 been printing like a charm and the quality I get is the quality I like ( many of my "clients" too!).

Although I'm feeding a paper not "permitted" by Epson (too thick) a slight push on it and away it goes. I keep my rollers pretty clean and I added a 1" piece of blue Styrofoam at the receiving end. It takes cure of the dreaded "tick" at the end meaning that the head is striking the paper.

And on that subject, I saw many posts relating to paper curving. My two bits : if you are like me and buying your paper by the box, the more you print (and empty the box) the more chance that you will have slightly curled sheets. I went to my glazing shop and they made me a piece of glass (1/4" thick) 13"x19" that I put on the remaining sheets in the box; paper is always flat up to the last sheet.

Jacques

Jacques Caron

Le 2016-03-13 à 10:16, "'forums@walkerblackwell.com' forums@walkerblackwell.com [QuadtoneRIP]" <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> a écrit :



A few reasons for doing the 1430.

1. Because it’s actually a really very high-quality K6 head after the first inch and before the last. It’s dither pattern is almost superior to the x900s frankly (what I’m seeing in-lab right now). We are putting a CISS on it that (when raised to the proper level) increases pressure to the head decreases any small micro-banding.

2. This lowers the barrier-of-entry for anyone wanting to do alt-process at really high quality! We are seeing resolutions at a 1point-text level with Platinum right now . . . .

3. It’s a $300.00 printer that you can get new, that doesn’t have insane DRM built into it that excludes alternative inks.

cheers,
Walker


On Mar 12, 2016, at 9:36 PM, brian_downunda@... [QuadtoneRIP] <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

If the R1430 is that low-grade, then why has IJM put so much effort into developing the forthcoming Piezo digital negative system for it?





Re: [QuadtoneRIP] Poor quality on A3

2016-03-13 by Larry Beach

Any chance on a similar CISS for the R2000?

R2000:  
better paper handling,
Refurbs are just $50 more than a new 1430
refurbed R2000 may be newer than refurbed R2880

I must admit I don't see how pressurization reduces microbanding.  I thought microbanding was due to how Epson was feeding paper during the first and last inch, now how ink was delivered.  Perhaps I need to reread the microbanding issues.

Larry

--------------------------------------------
On Sun, 3/13/16, 'forums@...' forums@walkerblackwell.com [QuadtoneRIP] <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
Show quoted textHide quoted text
 Subject: Re: [QuadtoneRIP] Poor quality on A3
 To: "QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com" <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com>
 Received: Sunday, March 13, 2016, 7:16 AM
 
 
  
 
 
 
   
 
 
     
       
       
       A few reasons
 for doing the 1430.
 1. Because
 it’s actually a really very high-quality K6 head after
 the first inch and before the last. It’s dither pattern is
 almost superior to the x900s frankly (what I’m seeing
 in-lab right now). We are putting a CISS on it that (when
 raised to the proper level) increases pressure to the head
 decreases any small micro-banding.
 2. This lowers the
 barrier-of-entry for anyone wanting to do alt-process at
 really high quality! We are seeing resolutions at a
 1point-text level with Platinum right now . . . .
 3. It’s a $300.00 printer that
 you can get new, that
 doesn’t have insane DRM built into it that excludes
 alternative inks.
 cheers,Walker
 
 On Mar 12, 2016, at 9:36 PM, brian_downunda@...
 [QuadtoneRIP] <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com>
 wrote:
 If the R1430 is that low-grade,
 then why has IJM put so much effort into developing the
 forthcoming Piezo digital negative system for
 it?
 
 
     
      
 
     
     
 
 
 
 #yiv5310550692 #yiv5310550692 --

Re: [QuadtoneRIP] Poor quality on A3

2016-03-13 by forums@walkerblackwell.com

Micro-banding (micro-micro banding? heh) exists in the 1430 with super tight-dot papers/films (glossy, Pictorico, etc). I’ve seen way less (to no) micro banding with CISS on that printer.

Working on possible R2000 CISS and R2880 CISS as well. Possibly R3000 (different setup) stay tuned.

The trick to all of these CISSs is to make sure we use the correct high-quality tubing. The default tubing for most CISS’s don’t cut it so we’ve put a lot of time and effort into testing a ton of different tubing configs.

probably off-topic for this thread but if anyone wants to know progress on this, the IJM forum will have it (inkjetmall.com/tech <http://inkjetmall.com/tech>) 

cheers all,
Walker
Show quoted textHide quoted text
> On Mar 13, 2016, at 12:39 PM, Larry Beach pianoquartet@... [QuadtoneRIP] <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
> 
> Any chance on a similar CISS for the R2000?
> 
> R2000:  
> better paper handling,
> Refurbs are just $50 more than a new 1430
> refurbed R2000 may be newer than refurbed R2880
> 
> I must admit I don't see how pressurization reduces microbanding. I thought microbanding was due to how Epson was feeding paper during the first and last inch, now how ink was delivered. Perhaps I need to reread the microbanding issues.
> 
> Larry
> 
> --------------------------------------------
> On Sun, 3/13/16, 'forums@... <mailto:forums@...>' forums@walkerblackwell.com <mailto:forums@...> [QuadtoneRIP] <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com <mailto:QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com>> wrote:
> 
> Subject: Re: [QuadtoneRIP] Poor quality on A3
> To: "QuadtoneRIP@...m <mailto:QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com>" <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com <mailto:QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com>>
> Received: Sunday, March 13, 2016, 7:16 AM
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A few reasons
> for doing the 1430.
> 1. Because
> it’s actually a really very high-quality K6 head after
> the first inch and before the last. It’s dither pattern is
> almost superior to the x900s frankly (what I’m seeing
> in-lab right now). We are putting a CISS on it that (when
> raised to the proper level) increases pressure to the head
> decreases any small micro-banding.
> 2. This lowers the
> barrier-of-entry for anyone wanting to do alt-process at
> really high quality! We are seeing resolutions at a
> 1point-text level with Platinum right now . . . .
> 3. It’s a $300.00 printer that
> you can get new, that
> doesn’t have insane DRM built into it that excludes
> alternative inks.
> cheers,Walker
> 
> On Mar 12, 2016, at 9:36 PM, brian_downunda@... <mailto:brian_downunda@...>
> [QuadtoneRIP] <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com <mailto:QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com>>
> wrote:
> If the R1430 is that low-grade,
> then why has IJM put so much effort into developing the
> forthcoming Piezo digital negative system for
> it?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: Poor quality on A3

2016-03-13 by brian_downunda@...

Just to be clear, my comment "If the R1430 is that low-grade, then why has IJM put so much effort into developing the forthcoming Piezo digital negative system for it?" was tongue-in-cheek.

There's nothing wrong with the R14x0 print quality, only the build quality. I had an R1410 that produced great K6 prints, but would never feed the paper straight. Despite this, I wish I'd kept it, as the R1400/1410 had little or no micro-banding on the first and last inch, unlike other/later desktop printers, including the R1430.

A CIS is convenient, in that you don't have to worry about frequent cartridge refills. But it brings the disadvantages of the ink-lines-and-dampers models to the desktops. I.e. sedimentation in the lines, agitation, harder to hibernate the printer, and you can't easily switch inksets. I have the IJM one for my R1900, but I've never used it.

I'm glad the OP is happy, given that we've drifted way off topic, as usual.

Re: Poor quality on A3

2016-03-13 by paulmwhiting@...

Walker,

Would you tell me what DRM stands for?

Thanks!

Paul

Re: Poor quality on A3

2016-03-13 by paulmwhiting@...

Jacques,

Any way you could send a photo of how and where that 1" blue Styrofoam strip goes? Dropbox maybe, or in the files section of this group? Thank you!

Paul

Re: Poor quality on A3

2016-03-13 by brian_downunda@...

Digital Rights Management. I believe he is referring to the fact that for the new P800 and the new large format Epson printers, the chip fabricators so far have been unable to create chips that you could use on refillable carts. They have had some success on the P600, but the chip readouts are not entirely reliable. Hence IJM is only supplying a CIS for the P600 at this stage.


---In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, <paulmwhiting@...> wrote :

Would you tell me what DRM stands for?

Re: Poor quality on A3

2016-03-14 by rdeloe1@...

Jacques,

I was going to ask for that picture of your styrofoam too! Thanks for posting. Unfortunately, the link doesn't seem to be working. Can you check it?

Thanks,
Rob

Re: [QuadtoneRIP] Re: Poor quality on A3

2016-03-14 by Jacques Caron

Hi Rob

It's working perfectly here. Just in case :


Hope that this one work; I'm very good with Dropbox

Jacques

Jacques Caron

Le 2016-03-14 à 08:40, "rdeloe1@... [QuadtoneRIP]" <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> a écrit :



Jacques,

I was going to ask for that picture of your styrofoam too! Thanks for posting. Unfortunately, the link doesn't seem to be working. Can you check it?

Thanks,
Rob


Re: [QuadtoneRIP] Re: Poor quality on A3

2016-03-14 by Jacques Caron

Oops, this one does not work, let's try :


Jacques Caron

Le 2016-03-14 à 09:02, "Jacques Caron jacques.caron@... [QuadtoneRIP]" <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> a écrit :



Hi Rob

It's working perfectly here. Just in case :


Hope that this one work; I'm very good with Dropbox

Jacques

Jacques Caron

Le 2016-03-14 à 08:40, "rdeloe1@... [QuadtoneRIP]" <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> a écrit :



Jacques,

I was going to ask for that picture of your styrofoam too! Thanks for posting. Unfortunately, the link doesn't seem to be working. Can you check it?

Thanks,
Rob





Re: Poor quality on A3

2016-03-15 by paulmwhiting@...

All three worked for me, Jacques, thank you. Good to know... I didn't realize head strikes were harmful.

Regards,

Paul

Re: Poor quality on A3

2016-03-15 by paulmwhiting@...

Thanks, Brian, that clears it up for me.

Yes, I had read an announcement over at IJM about this. Seems a never-ending battle between chip designers and those of us who want to use 3rd party inks and carts.

Regards,

Paul

Re: [QuadtoneRIP] Re: Poor quality on A3

2016-03-15 by Jacques Caron

Hi Paul

Glad to know it worked; as far as head strikes, I don't know if they are really harmful but in any event, when the head start to strike the paper you get blobs of ink on your margins. Very annoying.

Cheers

Jacques

Jacques Caron

Le 2016-03-15 à 09:24, "paulmwhiting@... [QuadtoneRIP]" <QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com> a écrit :



All three worked for me, Jacques, thank you. Good to know... I didn't realize head strikes were harmful.

Regards,

Paul


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