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2009-05-12 by Tyler Boley
I'm not seeing much info on doing more detailed toner content edits. Obviously the limit for overall amount of a given ink, but it's not clear to me what the density setting would be accomplishing in this context, on a single ink toner color. So, I'm assuming the highlight, shadow, and gamma setting offer some possibilites? Or further, editing a new raw file to use? Thanks, Tyler
2009-05-14 by Howard Shaw
I use a .acv or .raw curve to control the toner. The highlight/shadow etc controls won't allow you to control the toner separately. Using a .raw curve the density setting can be used as an overall 'quantity' control while the curve controls the relative amount of toner at the different density levels. Howard Tyler Boley wrote:
> I'm not seeing much info on doing more detailed toner content edits. Obviously the limit for overall amount of a given ink, but it's not clear to me what the density setting would be accomplishing in this context, on a single ink toner color. > So, I'm assuming the highlight, shadow, and gamma setting offer some possibilites? > Or further, editing a new raw file to use? > Thanks, > Tyler > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > >
2009-05-14 by Roy Harrington
The Density values are for partitioning multiple levels of toner i.e. M and LM. The dark one or a single toner would be 100. I would start with the highlight/shadow values the same as the ones in the gray channel. This gives close to a constant ratio of toner-to-gray ink. After that you can fine tune with small variations in highlight/shadow -- larger values give less toner and smaller ones give more toner. You can do split tone this way but I tend to leave splits to the print sliders. As Howard mentions you can get fine control with custom .acv /.raw curves. Roy
On Mon, May 11, 2009 at 6:08 PM, Tyler Boley <tyler@...> wrote: > I'm not seeing much info on doing more detailed toner content edits. Obviously the limit for overall amount of a given ink, but it's not clear to me what the density setting would be accomplishing in this context, on a single ink toner color. > So, I'm assuming the highlight, shadow, and gamma setting offer some possibilites? > Or further, editing a new raw file to use? > Thanks, > Tyler > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > >
2009-05-14 by Tyler Boley
thanks, this is what I presumed. All I wanted to do was get some nasty spikes out of the toner channels down near 100% in the existing curves I've been trying. They are only a problem with some of the PK setups, giving less than ideal gloss differential performance between 90 and 100%. Regarding creating new raws, should the base file used be rgb-raw-16.psd? It looks to me like the existing raw toner files have been rotated 180% from that. Does it matter? Tyler --- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, Roy Harrington <roy@...> wrote:
> > The Density values are for partitioning multiple levels of toner i.e. M and LM. > The dark one or a single toner would be 100. > > I would start with the highlight/shadow values the same as the ones in the > gray channel. This gives close to a constant ratio of toner-to-gray ink. > After that you can fine tune with small variations in highlight/shadow -- > larger values give less toner and smaller ones give more toner. You can > do split tone this way but I tend to leave splits to the print > sliders. As Howard > mentions you can get fine control with custom .acv /.raw curves. > > Roy > > On Mon, May 11, 2009 at 6:08 PM, Tyler Boley <tyler@...> wrote: > > I'm not seeing much info on doing more detailed toner content edits. Obviously the limit for overall amount of a given ink, but it's not clear to me what the density setting would be accomplishing in this context, on a single ink toner color. > > So, I'm assuming the highlight, shadow, and gamma setting offer some possibilites? > > Or further, editing a new raw file to use? > > Thanks, > > Tyler > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >
2009-05-15 by Roy Harrington
Hi Tyler, It's been so long since I had to use the .raw files I had to re-check it out. The rgb-raw-16.psd file is really for the custom RGB curves in the ICC profiles. For the simple curve .raw you ought to use a gray version i.e. just one channel. You can convert gray in PS but make sure the CM working spaces are compatible. It's imperative that you get the same 256 levels. Check histogram after conversion. You are also right about the reversal -- the file should go from white to black i.e. the way we think of "ink" curves not the RGB concept of light - black to white. Roy
On Thu, May 14, 2009 at 11:43 AM, Tyler Boley <tyler@...> wrote: > thanks, this is what I presumed. > All I wanted to do was get some nasty spikes out of the toner channels down near 100% in the existing curves I've been trying. > They are only a problem with some of the PK setups, giving less than ideal gloss differential performance between 90 and 100%. > > Regarding creating new raws, should the base file used be rgb-raw-16.psd? It looks to me like the existing raw toner files have been rotated 180% from that. > Does it matter? > Tyler > > --- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, Roy Harrington <roy@...> wrote: >> >> The Density values are for partitioning multiple levels of toner i.e. M and LM. >> The dark one or a single toner would be 100. >> >> I would start with the highlight/shadow values the same as the ones in the >> gray channel. This gives close to a constant ratio of toner-to-gray ink. >> After that you can fine tune with small variations in highlight/shadow -- >> larger values give less toner and smaller ones give more toner. You can >> do split tone this way but I tend to leave splits to the print >> sliders. As Howard >> mentions you can get fine control with custom .acv /.raw curves. >> >> Roy >> >> On Mon, May 11, 2009 at 6:08 PM, Tyler Boley <tyler@...> wrote: >> > I'm not seeing much info on doing more detailed toner content edits. Obviously the limit for overall amount of a given ink, but it's not clear to me what the density setting would be accomplishing in this context, on a single ink toner color. >> > So, I'm assuming the highlight, shadow, and gamma setting offer some possibilites? >> > Or further, editing a new raw file to use? >> > Thanks, >> > Tyler >> > >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------------ >> > >> > Yahoo! Groups Links >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > >
2009-05-16 by Tyler Boley
Roy, I guess the next most obvious question, then, is- how are the ongoing new ink setups for QTR being developed in terms of the toner curves then? I just assumed the best way was to make a new .raw to use, but it sounds like this may be now an archaic method? Is there a better 2009 method? Thanks, T --- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, Roy Harrington <roy@...> wrote:
> > Hi Tyler, > > It's been so long since I had to use the .raw files I had to re-check it out. > The rgb-raw-16.psd file is really for the custom RGB curves in the ICC profiles. > > For the simple curve .raw you ought to use a gray version i.e. just one channel. > You can convert gray in PS but make sure the CM working spaces are compatible. > It's imperative that you get the same 256 levels. Check histogram > after conversion. > You are also right about the reversal -- the file should go from white > to black i.e. > the way we think of "ink" curves not the RGB concept of light - black to white. > > Roy > > On Thu, May 14, 2009 at 11:43 AM, Tyler Boley <tyler@...> wrote: > > thanks, this is what I presumed. > > All I wanted to do was get some nasty spikes out of the toner channels down near 100% in the existing curves I've been trying. > > They are only a problem with some of the PK setups, giving less than ideal gloss differential performance between 90 and 100%. > > > > Regarding creating new raws, should the base file used be rgb-raw-16.psd? It looks to me like the existing raw toner files have been rotated 180% from that. > > Does it matter? > > Tyler > > > > --- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, Roy Harrington <roy@> wrote: > >> > >> The Density values are for partitioning multiple levels of toner i.e. M and LM. > >> The dark one or a single toner would be 100. > >> > >> I would start with the highlight/shadow values the same as the ones in the > >> gray channel. This gives close to a constant ratio of toner-to-gray ink. > >> After that you can fine tune with small variations in highlight/shadow -- > >> larger values give less toner and smaller ones give more toner. You can > >> do split tone this way but I tend to leave splits to the print > >> sliders. As Howard > >> mentions you can get fine control with custom .acv /.raw curves. > >> > >> Roy > >> > >> On Mon, May 11, 2009 at 6:08 PM, Tyler Boley <tyler@> wrote: > >> > I'm not seeing much info on doing more detailed toner content edits. Obviously the limit for overall amount of a given ink, but it's not clear to me what the density setting would be accomplishing in this context, on a single ink toner color. > >> > So, I'm assuming the highlight, shadow, and gamma setting offer some possibilites? > >> > Or further, editing a new raw file to use? > >> > Thanks, > >> > Tyler > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > ------------------------------------ > >> > > >> > Yahoo! Groups Links > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > >
2009-05-16 by Roy Harrington
Tyler, the approach can vary a lot based of the ink set you are using. Most of the builtin features are for inks with simple dilutions. The last bunch of curves I did were for the 3800-UC. Most of them are very simple: warm = just K's, cool = just add C,LC,M,LM with simple tweaks of ink limits. neutral was more effort to account for variations of color in the light/dark inks. See: UCmk-raw-neut.txt here I used the CURVE with coordinates for subtle tweaking. The nice thing about this rather than .acv's or .raw's is that it's all in one file. If you like the PS curve editing do it with .acv's as you are working on the curve and then just transcribe the points later on. BTW, the QTR points allow more of them and more accuracy using decimal values than the PS point. Use the builtin features first to get close -- they all work very smoothly. Use the points for the subtle variations. Of course with other situations you can go to the extreme of hand coding all the coordinates for all of the inks. Paul Roark did this quite a bit with the 3MK ink set since the "ink concept" was different. Roy
On Fri, May 15, 2009 at 6:50 PM, Tyler Boley <tyler@...> wrote: > Roy, I guess the next most obvious question, then, is- how are the ongoing new ink setups for QTR being developed in terms of the toner curves then? > I just assumed the best way was to make a new .raw to use, but it sounds like this may be now an archaic method? Is there a better 2009 method? > Thanks, > T > > --- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, Roy Harrington <roy@...> wrote: >> >> Hi Tyler, >> >> It's been so long since I had to use the .raw files I had to re-check it out. >> The rgb-raw-16.psd file is really for the custom RGB curves in the ICC profiles. >> >> For the simple curve .raw you ought to use a gray version i.e. just one channel. >> You can convert gray in PS but make sure the CM working spaces are compatible. >> It's imperative that you get the same 256 levels. Check histogram >> after conversion. >> You are also right about the reversal -- the file should go from white >> to black i.e. >> the way we think of "ink" curves not the RGB concept of light - black to white. >> >> Roy >> >> On Thu, May 14, 2009 at 11:43 AM, Tyler Boley <tyler@...> wrote: >> > thanks, this is what I presumed. >> > All I wanted to do was get some nasty spikes out of the toner channels down near 100% in the existing curves I've been trying. >> > They are only a problem with some of the PK setups, giving less than ideal gloss differential performance between 90 and 100%. >> > >> > Regarding creating new raws, should the base file used be rgb-raw-16.psd? It looks to me like the existing raw toner files have been rotated 180% from that. >> > Does it matter? >> > Tyler >> > >> > --- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, Roy Harrington <roy@> wrote: >> >> >> >> The Density values are for partitioning multiple levels of toner i.e. M and LM. >> >> The dark one or a single toner would be 100. >> >> >> >> I would start with the highlight/shadow values the same as the ones in the >> >> gray channel. This gives close to a constant ratio of toner-to-gray ink. >> >> After that you can fine tune with small variations in highlight/shadow -- >> >> larger values give less toner and smaller ones give more toner. You can >> >> do split tone this way but I tend to leave splits to the print >> >> sliders. As Howard >> >> mentions you can get fine control with custom .acv /.raw curves. >> >> >> >> Roy >> >> >> >> On Mon, May 11, 2009 at 6:08 PM, Tyler Boley <tyler@> wrote: >> >> > I'm not seeing much info on doing more detailed toner content edits. Obviously the limit for overall amount of a given ink, but it's not clear to me what the density setting would be accomplishing in this context, on a single ink toner color. >> >> > So, I'm assuming the highlight, shadow, and gamma setting offer some possibilites? >> >> > Or further, editing a new raw file to use? >> >> > Thanks, >> >> > Tyler >> >> >
2009-06-13 by Mike Kirwan
I have just replaced my R1800 with a R1900 and have run into a problem with using the rear manual paper loader. With the controls set to print centered works just fine with the sheet loader, but when using the rear manual loader does not print centered, but strongly biased toward the top of the sheet. There is no image cut-off, but a pain as I like to display my prints with the image centered. It works fine on the R1800 but cannot go back as I had the funeral for the poor worn out beast. Anyone have a clue as to why this is happening? Thanks Mike [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
2009-06-13 by Michael King
Are you on PC or Mac? 2009/6/13 Mike Kirwan <mkirwan@...> > > > I have just replaced my R1800 with a R1900 and have run into a problem with > using the rear manual paper loader. With the controls set to print centered > works just fine with the sheet loader, but when using the rear manual > loader > does not print centered, but strongly biased toward the top of the sheet. > There is no image cut-off, but a pain as I like to display my prints with > the image centered. It works fine on the R1800 but cannot go back as I had > the funeral for the poor worn out beast. > > Anyone have a clue as to why this is happening? > > Thanks > > Mike > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
2009-06-13 by Mike Kirwan
Sorry, should have provided more information. Running the PC version of QTR 2.6.2.0 on Windows XP Mike _____
From: QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com [mailto:QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Michael King Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2009 8:38 AM To: QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [QuadtoneRIP] Epson R1900 Rear Paper Loading Problem Are you on PC or Mac? 2009/6/13 Mike Kirwan <mkirwan@pacbell. <mailto:mkirwan%40pacbell.net> net> > > > I have just replaced my R1800 with a R1900 and have run into a problem with > using the rear manual paper loader. With the controls set to print centered > works just fine with the sheet loader, but when using the rear manual > loader > does not print centered, but strongly biased toward the top of the sheet. > There is no image cut-off, but a pain as I like to display my prints with > the image centered. It works fine on the R1800 but cannot go back as I had > the funeral for the poor worn out beast. > > Anyone have a clue as to why this is happening? > > Thanks > > Mike > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]