QTR-Quadtone RIP

I have been mulling over Roy's great reply on profiles ... and I have also been trying finding my way through making a profile, and have what I hope is a simple nuts and bolts question.

I was able to generate a set of the "Relative ink density measurement" numbers. I have been unable to find a template that I can use to put them in.

I am working with a 7600 and Cone K7 inks. 

I went to QTR folder in APS> To QTR > to profiles > and 7600_K7.  When I click on one of the K-7Quad files I get a beautiful little graph of ink curves in QTR Curve View.  When I open it in Text edit  ... It is a very long list with none of the components I can recognize from any of the instructions.  

When I open a UC.Text file in the 7600-UC folder I get files that look like the form I want   ... But they seem to have components that are geared to the the UC color ink set.

I then went into library>printers>qtr>quad-k7 folders and found the same sort of files.

Then I tried library>printers>qtr>plugin> and clicked on a Quad7600.ppd.gz file.  It went from this to a Quad7600.ppd file and changed in size from 4kb to 16 kb. Did I do something bad here??? Nothing opened.

I then tried APS> To QTR > to example inks.  Some of these looked possible .. But none seem to line up with the data I have from the seven inks I generated with Cone K-7.

So the question is what to do with a set of Ink separation Numbers for Cone K7.

Also is there anything like a spread sheet for doing the relative ink density measurements. Lots of places to get a number transposed or make a simple math mistake.

Thanks

Michael
Using mac pro/ os10.5.7 / cs3 / epson 7600 / Cone k7

Cone generates his K7 curves with proprietary software (his own). So you
cannot modify his files via QTR. IJM can make custom K7 curves for your
individual printer.


-- 
amadou diallo
www.blogfiftygreatestphotos.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I hope I am a little unclear in my question

does this mean there is no way for me to make a QTR profile with K7 inks

and the only way to use these inks is with an ink jet mall profile ??

michael

.


--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, amadou diallo <amadiallo@...> wrote:

>
> Cone generates his K7 curves with proprietary software (his own). So you
> cannot modify his files via QTR. IJM can make custom K7 curves for your
> individual printer.
> 
> 
> -- 
> amadou diallo
> www.blogfiftygreatestphotos.com
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

The issue with the K7 inks is that you don't have an easy starting place with
the Cone curves (QTR profiles).  So to make new ones, you need to start from
scratch as opposed to just re-linearizing them.   In practice there's almost no
good reason to bother.

If you do want to do some customization the most useful thing to do is make
a custom grayscale ICC profile.  This gives you all the color management
features in Photoshop -- softproofing and a print profile.  In fact
the print profile
gives you very similar functionality as the QTR profile re-linearizing
-- but better.
Because the ColorManagementSystem can then match the embedded file
profile with the driver/ink setup.   See Amadou's Level 2 for this.

(as has been said before, starting at Level 4 will almost certainly give worse
results than starting at Level 1 and progressing.)  I think you really
need to have
the visual understanding about why you are customizing.

Roy

On Thu, Jul 23, 2009 at 5:24 PM, mberman89<j6mb@...> wrote:
> I hope I am a little unclear in my question
>
> does this mean there is no way for me to make a QTR profile with K7 inks
>
> and the only way to use these inks is with an ink jet mall profile ??
>
> michael
>
> .
>
>
> --- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, amadou diallo <amadiallo@...> wrote:
>>
>> Cone generates his K7 curves with proprietary software (his own). So you
>> cannot modify his files via QTR. IJM can make custom K7 curves for your
>> individual printer.
>>
>>
>> --
>> amadou diallo
>> www.blogfiftygreatestphotos.com
>>
>>
>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>

Yes, it is possible to make your own QTR profiles with K7 inks. As Roy
points out, you have to start from scratch. You also have to profile 7 inks.

However, I must say that the Inkjet Mall profiles are outstanding.

Terry.

On 23/07/09 6:24 PM, "mberman89" <j6mb@...> wrote:

> I hope I am a little unclear in my question
> 
> does this mean there is no way for me to make a QTR profile with K7 inks
> 
> and the only way to use these inks is with an ink jet mall profile ??
> 
> michael
> 
> .
> 
> 
> --- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, amadou diallo <amadiallo@...> wrote:
>> 
>> Cone generates his K7 curves with proprietary software (his own). So you
>> cannot modify his files via QTR. IJM can make custom K7 curves for your
>> individual printer.
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> amadou diallo
>> www.blogfiftygreatestphotos.com
>> 
>> 
>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------
> 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
>

Roy

I am really amazed at the whole QTR thing .. How well it works, and how the community responds to questions.

My starting with level 4  ... Is partially a personality quirk  ...  But also there is a practical side to what I am doing.

About five years ago I cheated on the whole digital print thing ... I had a project and I decided to work with a professional printer.  It meant I had someone doing all the work with the inks, machines and paper. I just needed to work with the image on the monitor end of things.  I focused on one paper and one ink set  .. And a simple system in order to make it work well. 

Eventually I realized ... I would have to set up my own system and bought a printer.  And then a two months ago both my monitor and computer died.

So I am taking this opportunity to start from scratch and learn everything I can ... Because I know in a month or two I will have work flow that works and I will think I no longer have time for the basics and be open to change.

The reason I ended up at level four is it seems fundamental to get the ink flow right.  Perhaps because I am a mile high .. Or the personality of the printer I am using some of my papers are fluorescing with extra ink on black edges with the k7-CTR profiles.
Two papers I need to make work  ... I need to reduce ink flow.  One is the Hahnemuhle photo rag ... I spent the day printing 255 grays and adjusting the ink limits and gama in the advanced adjustments ,, and have something that works well.

And the other is a Vellum paper that there are no profiles for  .. And wants very little ink before it starts to coagulate.

I did manages to work up a good set of Ink separation numbers  ... And I learned a whole lot doing them  ... Until I rain up against the K7 issue  ... And seems got in over my head again.

I'll go back to level 2 and work these things through  ... But I still feel doing each small thing well is what supports the larger goal of a beautiful print. So I do want to get back to this and see if I can make it work.

Thanks again  ... I am still looking at what you wrote yesterday  ...  Most of it I am getting solid on  ... Except for what the printer and profiles are doing  ...  Still more work to do.

Michael


--- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, Roy Harrington <roy@...> wrote:

>
> The issue with the K7 inks is that you don't have an easy starting place with
> the Cone curves (QTR profiles).  So to make new ones, you need to start from
> scratch as opposed to just re-linearizing them.   In practice there's almost no
> good reason to bother.
> 
> If you do want to do some customization the most useful thing to do is make
> a custom grayscale ICC profile.  This gives you all the color management
> features in Photoshop -- softproofing and a print profile.  In fact
> the print profile
> gives you very similar functionality as the QTR profile re-linearizing
> -- but better.
> Because the ColorManagementSystem can then match the embedded file
> profile with the driver/ink setup.   See Amadou's Level 2 for this.
> 
> (as has been said before, starting at Level 4 will almost certainly give worse
> results than starting at Level 1 and progressing.)  I think you really
> need to have
> the visual understanding about why you are customizing.
> 
> Roy
> 
> On Thu, Jul 23, 2009 at 5:24 PM, mberman89<j6mb@...> wrote:
> > I hope I am a little unclear in my question
> >
> > does this mean there is no way for me to make a QTR profile with K7 inks
> >
> > and the only way to use these inks is with an ink jet mall profile ??
> >
> > michael
> >
> > .
> >
> >
> > --- In QuadtoneRIP@yahoogroups.com, amadou diallo <amadiallo@> wrote:
> >>
> >> Cone generates his K7 curves with proprietary software (his own). So you
> >> cannot modify his files via QTR. IJM can make custom K7 curves for your
> >> individual printer.
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> amadou diallo
> >> www.blogfiftygreatestphotos.com
> >>
> >>
> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
>

Michael,

I would never discourage anyone from experimenting. But, my mousetrap is pretty good and we do offer custom K7 curve sets for only $99 in two styles. The normal K7 which is the perfect gamma 2.2 linearization and a Type 2 which is heavy on the bottom end to close up some of the shadow detail (giving the perception of "darker" - if one interprets the output as looking "flat". 

http://shopping.netsuite.com/s.nl/c.362672/it.A/id.3682/.f?sc=15&category=-115

Regards,

Jon Cone
InkjetMall