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Designing a MIDI/CV for use with P3

Designing a MIDI/CV for use with P3

2006-01-21 by srmaietta

Oaky, Ive got the boards and parts for this MIDI/CV of mine.  Its 
Paux Maddox's/Oakley/Elby designs  poly DAC 4 voice monster job.

http://www.oakleysound.com/polydac.htm

    Now its panel layout time.  Id like to ask y'all a question.  
what would YOU do?  What features would you want for a modular/P3 
combination.  My modular (16 Blacet modules) can be set up as two 
voices, and while it is inevitable that it will grow in the future, 
its not changing for at least a year.  

Electrically it is a four channel unit with poly and mono modes.  Ive 
got a 2u frack (single normal width module) space for this!  Channel 
one takes up like half the panel, and I have channel two's three 
jacks fitting no problem.  I have squeezed channel three's gate on 
there too.  


  Now my initial question is this.  would you rather have:

A - an extra comparator (knob + jack + led) off one of channel one's 
four aux (cc) outs, making a total of three gate outs and two 
comparators.

or instead of this second comparator tied to one of voice one's aux 
outs, 

B - Channel four's gate on the panel.  (making a total of four gate 
outs and one comparator)

Im trying to think about the pros / cons of each, and basically the 
comparators will give me gates based on a cv level, but I can program 
another tracks gates to do the same thing. . and end up a bit more 
flexible maybe.  

My MIDI/CV experience in the modular world is limited to a few years 
with a cv keyboard and a Kenton Pro-Solo, so all the options here are 
glitching me out a bit.  On top of this, for the size of my system 
this thing is going to be overkill regardless, but I still want to 
plan it as best as I can, based on P3 use.


Channel one on this converter has:
note,
velocity,
gate,
pitch bend,
modwheel,
aftertouch,
and sustain pedal outs.
PLUS the four assignable CC outs.  This is looking a bit 
excessive...              I could probably drop aftertouch and 
sustain pedal outs and squeeze another note,velocity, gate voice in 
place ?  Id like to keep PB and Modwheel for nice keyboard use though.

Basically this circuit has a very large potential and Im trying to 
fit as much as I can onto a panel, and going for maximum 
flexibility.  
Any PerFOURmer users out there want to chime in regarding MIDI/CV and 
P3?  
Howabout all of my fellow modular addicts?  What are you 
doing/using/wishing for?  In the P3 which CC's are easiest/ 
quickest / most often used by you guys?

Sorry for all the questions!!
Thanks for any and all input
~Steve

RE: [analogue-sequencer] Designing a MIDI/CV for use with P3

2006-01-21 by a

Ever consider the Doepfer MCV24 instead?
 
  _____  

  <http://jmsb.concordia.ca/%7Ealexa_re/sig.jpg> Alex Reid
Montreal, Canada
alex_reid@sympatico.ca <outbind://126/a@signals-systems.com> 
http://www.signals-systems.com <http://www3.sympatico.ca/signals_systems/> 

            "Jesus diligo quod servo totus..........."
 <mailto:alex_reid@sympatico.ca> 

  _____  

 <mailto:alex_reid@sympatico.ca> 

 
 

  _____  
Show quoted textHide quoted text
From: analogue-sequencer@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:analogue-sequencer@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of srmaietta
Sent: Saturday, January 21, 2006 12:33 PM
To: analogue-sequencer@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [analogue-sequencer] Designing a MIDI/CV for use with P3


Oaky, Ive got the boards and parts for this MIDI/CV of mine.  Its 
Paux Maddox's/Oakley/Elby designs  poly DAC 4 voice monster job.

http://www.oakleysound.com/polydac.htm

    Now its panel layout time.  Id like to ask y'all a question.  
what would YOU do?  What features would you want for a modular/P3 
combination.  My modular (16 Blacet modules) can be set up as two 
voices, and while it is inevitable that it will grow in the future, 
its not changing for at least a year.  

Electrically it is a four channel unit with poly and mono modes.  Ive 
got a 2u frack (single normal width module) space for this!  Channel 
one takes up like half the panel, and I have channel two's three 
jacks fitting no problem.  I have squeezed channel three's gate on 
there too.  


  Now my initial question is this.  would you rather have:

A - an extra comparator (knob + jack + led) off one of channel one's 
four aux (cc) outs, making a total of three gate outs and two 
comparators.

or instead of this second comparator tied to one of voice one's aux 
outs, 

B - Channel four's gate on the panel.  (making a total of four gate 
outs and one comparator)

Im trying to think about the pros / cons of each, and basically the 
comparators will give me gates based on a cv level, but I can program 
another tracks gates to do the same thing. . and end up a bit more 
flexible maybe.  

My MIDI/CV experience in the modular world is limited to a few years 
with a cv keyboard and a Kenton Pro-Solo, so all the options here are 
glitching me out a bit.  On top of this, for the size of my system 
this thing is going to be overkill regardless, but I still want to 
plan it as best as I can, based on P3 use.


Channel one on this converter has:
note,
velocity,
gate,
pitch bend,
modwheel,
aftertouch,
and sustain pedal outs.
PLUS the four assignable CC outs.  This is looking a bit 
excessive...              I could probably drop aftertouch and 
sustain pedal outs and squeeze another note,velocity, gate voice in 
place ?  Id like to keep PB and Modwheel for nice keyboard use though.

Basically this circuit has a very large potential and Im trying to 
fit as much as I can onto a panel, and going for maximum 
flexibility.  
Any PerFOURmer users out there want to chime in regarding MIDI/CV and 
P3?  
Howabout all of my fellow modular addicts?  What are you 
doing/using/wishing for?  In the P3 which CC's are easiest/ 
quickest / most often used by you guys?

Sorry for all the questions!!
Thanks for any and all input
~Steve






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Re: [analogue-sequencer] Designing a MIDI/CV for use with P3

2006-01-21 by Julian

> Ever consider the Doepfer MCV24 instead?


Please dont consider the mcv24.  The 8bit dacs used on all but 4 (if i
remember right) of the outputs make for pretty poor performance.  I know.  I
had one.

Replaced it with a kenton pro-2000.  Less outputs, better performance.

My polydac is still on the 'to be completed' shelf.  It uses 12bit dacs.

Julian

RE: [analogue-sequencer] Designing a MIDI/CV for use with P3

2006-01-21 by a

It all depends on the application.  Yes certain sockets are 8bit, etc, etc.
However, I use the thing to drive a Korg MS-20, Roland SH-101, Doepfer A-100
system, a previous Jupiter-4, and I have had no problems.  It does the job.
 <mailto:alex_reid@sympatico.ca> 

 
 

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Show quoted textHide quoted text
From: analogue-sequencer@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:analogue-sequencer@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Julian
Sent: Saturday, January 21, 2006 4:00 PM
To: analogue-sequencer@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [analogue-sequencer] Designing a MIDI/CV for use with P3


> Ever consider the Doepfer MCV24 instead?


Please dont consider the mcv24.  The 8bit dacs used on all but 4 (if i
remember right) of the outputs make for pretty poor performance.  I know.  I
had one.

Replaced it with a kenton pro-2000.  Less outputs, better performance.

My polydac is still on the 'to be completed' shelf.  It uses 12bit dacs.

Julian




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RE: [analogue-sequencer] Designing a MIDI/CV for use with P3

2006-01-21 by a

> I'm not sure why you would use two different DACs in the same unit, rather
than just adding  
> more multiplexing to your high quality convertor... 
 
Doepfer is just weird like that.  They justify:
-  4 outputs using a 12-bit DAC optimised for -2~8V at one volt per octave
scaling
- 20 outputs using an 8-bit DAC optimised for 0~10v at one volt per octave
scaling
 




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

RE: [analogue-sequencer] Designing a MIDI/CV for use with P3

2006-01-22 by Colin f

> Please dont consider the mcv24.  The 8bit dacs used on all but 4 (if i
> remember right) of the outputs make for pretty poor 
> performance.  I know.  I
> had one.

8 bits can be okay, but it needs to be a good quality convertor.
I'm not sure why you would use two different DACs in the same unit, rather
than just adding more multiplexing to your high quality convertor...
 
> My polydac is still on the 'to be completed' shelf.  It uses 
> 12bit dacs.

12 bit DACs do me fine, for Hz/V control and software glide.
I need to get that PCB design finished sometime.

Best regards,
Colin Fraser
Sequentix Music Systems Ltd
http://www.sequentix.com

Re: Designing a MIDI/CV for use with P3

2006-01-24 by srmaietta

So no one has any comments for me regarding MIDI/CV features for use 
with a P3 and a modular?  I'm just looking for any opinions regarding 
what features would be most useful or requested by YOU guys to have 
on the front panel of this module, with the P3 in mind.   

quick recap:

Available in the circuit:
-4 tracks (note,veloc, gate), mono and poly modes
-track 1 has 4 assignable cc outs available.
-I have one frack panel worth of space, trying to get the most useful 
items I can onto the panel.

I can only fit voices one and two, and voice three's gate out.
My basic question was this:  Would you rather have comparators on two 
of voice one's aux cc outs, or would you rather have one comparator 
and track 4's gate on the panel?

 Suggestions to buy something else are not helpful, save the 
keystrokes.  But! Informing me of how you use the midi/cv items you 
have ARE helpful, and recieve my full dose of gratitude and smiles.

any and all insight would be appreciated.. 
thanks P3 guru's
~Steve

RE: [analogue-sequencer] Re: Designing a MIDI/CV for use with P3

2006-01-24 by Colin f

> So no one has any comments for me regarding MIDI/CV features for use 
> with a P3 and a modular?  I'm just looking for any opinions regarding 
> what features would be most useful or requested by YOU guys to have 
> on the front panel of this module, with the P3 in mind.   

My modular is sitting in pieces in a cardboard box right now, waiting for
the day when I get a new case and wiring loom done for it...

> Available in the circuit:
> -4 tracks (note,veloc, gate), mono and poly modes
> -track 1 has 4 assignable cc outs available.
> -I have one frack panel worth of space, trying to get the most useful 
> items I can onto the panel.
> 
> I can only fit voices one and two, and voice three's gate out.
> My basic question was this:  Would you rather have comparators on two 
> of voice one's aux cc outs, or would you rather have one comparator 
> and track 4's gate on the panel?

You maybe shouldn't try to come up with the final design before you've lived
with it for a while.
Maybe just use a basic plastic box, and mount every output socket on that.
Live with it for a couple of months, and see how you will use it.
Then you'll have a much clearer idea what the best setup is going to be for
your own use.

I'm not sure how software configurable the Polydac is, but I know when I put
my modular back together, I'm going to avoid as much panel wiring as
possible, handling the CV/gate routing at a software level.
By that I mean that if I have 4 VCOs in the synth (which seems quite likely,
since I have 4 Oakley VCOs in the drawer), they will each have their note CV
normallised to a separate convertor output, but the convertor channels will
be easily re-assignable to different MIDI channels - so a selector switch
might assign all VCOs to the same note, split them 1/3, 2/2, 1/1/2 or
1/1/1/1 across 4 different channels.
Gates can be hardwired to envelope generators in a similar way.
Auxiliary CVs are more likely to be available on sockets, but I'll probably
still go for normalisation to the things I usually use them for - filter
CVs, filter envelope amounts, envelope time-constant modulation, etc.

Best regards,
Colin Fraser
Sequentix Music Systems Ltd
http://www.sequentix.com

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