Analogue-sequencer

Folks,

A quick question for those of you using v4...

As it stands, each bar in a multi-bar pattern has its own aux config.
The default config on a new bar is 'auto', which means you can set the
config just on the first bar, and all the other bars will pick it up.
But this is a rather clumsy way of doing it.
If you later move bars about, and copy a bar with 'auto' auxes over the
first bar that had the actual settings in, then you need to set them up
again.

I was wondering how much value there is in being able to set up different
auxes on each bar in a pattern.
Is it something anyone is actually doing ?
Or does it just make life more complicated ?

Best regards,
Colin Fraser
Sequentix Music Systems Ltd
http://www.sequentix.com

Hi Colin

Colin f wrote:
> I was wondering how much value there is in being able to set up different
> auxes on each bar in a pattern.
> Is it something anyone is actually doing ?
> Or does it just make life more complicated ?

I'd vote for simplicity - one pattern, one config. There's too much
danger of accidentally setting up something wrong, and then it can take
quite a while to debug it, not something I'd want when I'm in a creative
flow.

Bye
Martin

-- 
http://www.navisto.ch
http://www.myspace.com/navisto

hi Colin,
I do occasionally, but never in a way that I absolutely definitely
need it. Couldn't you have a user-config option to determine whether
an aux-config is pattern or bar based? Or maybe something like a flag
at the bar-level which in a default position would pick up the
aux-config from the previous pattern, but when set would enable you to
alter the aux-config...
I like to keep my options open :-)

grtz, Chiel



--- In analogue-sequencer@yahoogroups.com, "Colin f" <colin@...> wrote:
>
> Folks,
> 
> A quick question for those of you using v4...
> 
> As it stands, each bar in a multi-bar pattern has its own aux config.
> The default config on a new bar is 'auto', which means you can set the
> config just on the first bar, and all the other bars will pick it up.
> But this is a rather clumsy way of doing it.
> If you later move bars about, and copy a bar with 'auto' auxes over the
> first bar that had the actual settings in, then you need to set them up
> again.
> 
> I was wondering how much value there is in being able to set up
different

> auxes on each bar in a pattern.
> Is it something anyone is actually doing ?
> Or does it just make life more complicated ?
> 
> Best regards,
> Colin Fraser
> Sequentix Music Systems Ltd
> http://www.sequentix.com
>

i would vote against different auxes on each bar of a pattern.

Colin f <colin@colinfraser.com> wrote:          Folks,

A quick question for those of you using v4...

As it stands, each bar in a multi-bar pattern has its own aux config.
The default config on a new bar is 'auto', which means you can set the
config just on the first bar, and all the other bars will pick it up.
But this is a rather clumsy way of doing it.
If you later move bars about, and copy a bar with 'auto' auxes over the
first bar that had the actual settings in, then you need to set them up
again.

I was wondering how much value there is in being able to set up different
auxes on each bar in a pattern.
Is it something anyone is actually doing ?
Or does it just make life more complicated ?

Best regards,
Colin Fraser
Sequentix Music Systems Ltd
http://www.sequentix.com



                         

 __________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com 

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

>>I was wondering how much value there is in being able to set up
different auxes on each bar in a pattern.<<

I'm inclined towards suggesting that the aux config should apply to
the entire contents of a track, in both v4 & v3. 

I'm back using v3 now, because we're doing a lot of stuff that's
pre-arranged.... 
& the thing that slows me down the most is having to set up the auxes
for each pattern in each track. I tend to do the same things with the
auxes all the time: 
some polyphonic stuff, some repeat-trills, some knob-grab so that I
can use the unused knobs in mixer-mode to change the velocity &/or
length of notes in a pattern. 
in fact, while I'm on the subject, it takes two auxes to direct one of
the knobs to a midi CC, which is a nuisance. I know I've said before
that users should treat the p3 as a sequencer first, & use a separate
midi controller for such tweakage, but I have changed my mind since
starting to use mixer mode.

anyway.

if there was a bit of user-memory left over to do it, I'd suggest
allowing the save/recall of aux configs on an additional page in the
aux setup process. one would save/recall the setting for all four
auxes & then edit/contextualise them; for my money, this would be
quicker than doing it from scratch each time. 

my workaround for this is to use otherwise empty patterns to copy aux
configs from. this is obviously not a terribly efficient use of the
p3's memory...

duncan.

--- In analogue-sequencer@yahoogroups.com, "Colin Fraser" <colin@...>
wrote:
>
> I appreciate what you mean about keeping the options open.
> A user config option would be possible, or even a simple setting at 
> the pattern level.
> The issue is that the code space is nearly full, and there a few 
> more things I'd like to get in there to finish v4 off.
> Having the (possibly unneccessary) flexibility in the aux config is 
> using up code space that might be better applied, for example, to 
> having a better bar edit mode, where you can rotate the bars in a 
> pattern to set a new starting point, or define a starting point 
> other than bar 1. It also seems like the flexibilty that exists now 
> is more a source of confusion than it is a useful feature.
> There has to be a compromise somewhere...

Well if you put it like that i'd happily lose the aux-config
flexibility at bar-level to gain the better bar edit mode with the
stuff you mention; that would have a much higher practical value,
where the aux-config stuff has a more experimental character I guess.
And when it comes to live use I also tend to use the same auxes for
complete tracks, so i'm reasonably sure that i'll know what i'm doing
...
grtz, Chiel

I'd happily go for the simplicity of one set of definitions, especially if 
it freed up some space for something really nice... :)

Paul

> I do occasionally, but never in a way that I absolutely definitely
> need it. Couldn't you have a user-config option to determine whether
> an aux-config is pattern or bar based? Or maybe something like a flag
> at the bar-level which in a default position would pick up the
> aux-config from the previous pattern, but when set would enable you to
> alter the aux-config...
> I like to keep my options open :-)

I appreciate what you mean about keeping the options open.
A user config option would be possible, or even a simple setting at the
pattern level.
The issue is that the code space is nearly full, and there a few more things
I'd like to get in there to finish v4 off.
Having the (possibly unneccessary) flexibility in the aux config is using up
code space that might be better applied, for example, to having a better bar
edit mode, where you can rotate the bars in a pattern to set a new starting
point, or define a starting point other than bar 1.
It also seems like the flexibilty that exists now is more a source of
confusion than it is a useful feature.
There has to be a compromise somewhere...

Best regards,
Colin Fraser
Sequentix Music Systems Ltd
http://www.sequentix.com

Hello,
Just as my music, Keep it as simple as possible :-)



--- In analogue-sequencer@yahoogroups.com, "Colin f" <colin@...> 
wrote:
>
> Folks,
> 
> A quick question for those of you using v4...
> 
> As it stands, each bar in a multi-bar pattern has its own aux 
config.
> The default config on a new bar is 'auto', which means you can set 
the
> config just on the first bar, and all the other bars will pick it 
up.
> But this is a rather clumsy way of doing it.
> If you later move bars about, and copy a bar with 'auto' auxes over 
the
> first bar that had the actual settings in, then you need to set 
them up
> again.
> 
> I was wondering how much value there is in being able to set up 
different

> auxes on each bar in a pattern.
> Is it something anyone is actually doing ?
> Or does it just make life more complicated ?
> 
> Best regards,
> Colin Fraser
> Sequentix Music Systems Ltd
> http://www.sequentix.com
>

> A user config option would be possible, or even a simple setting at the
> pattern level.

The option would be nice but in practice I only ever use the same set
of auxes for the whole pattern.
Keep it simple and save the code space.

--- In analogue-sequencer@yahoogroups.com, "Colin f" <colin@...> wrote: 
> I was wondering how much value there is in being able to set up
different
> auxes on each bar in a pattern.

Will make the leap to V4 on one of my machines soon, but I concur that
keeping it simple would be my use once I get there.

-Jim

--
Jim Combs

Atlanta's Creative Loafing Best of 2005 & 2007 "Best Local Electronic Act"

Buy my Sensitive Chaos "Leak" CD at http://cdbaby.com/sensitivechaos

"I highly recommend Leak for its inventiveness, its beat-happy
effervescence, and its thorough lack of pretension, not to mention
it's just a flat out fun album from start to finish." - Bill
Binkelman, New Age Reporter

www.myspace.com/jimcombs
www.sensitivechaos.com
www.myspace.com/sensitivechaos

Belated (and slightly aside) follow-up... I'm about to upgrade my
machine from V3 to V4, so I'm busy bouncing patterns out to Ableton
Live so that I can recreate them by ear. How stable is the pattern
storage format for V4? Will these AUX changes (or any further changes)
preserve patterns, and/or allow existing sysex dumps to be reloaded?

-- N.

> Belated (and slightly aside) follow-up... I'm about to upgrade my
> machine from V3 to V4, so I'm busy bouncing patterns out to Ableton
> Live so that I can recreate them by ear. How stable is the pattern
> storage format for V4? Will these AUX changes (or any further changes)
> preserve patterns, and/or allow existing sysex dumps to be reloaded?

You know you can translate a v3 dump to v4 using P3 Tools 2 ?

The simplified v4 auxes will mean that every bar in a pattern will be
written with the same aux config when it is edited.
The aux changes will slightly affect v4 dumps, in that if you have 'auto'
assigments of auxes in saved patterns, you will need to edit them and save
them for the aux config in the first bar to be written to all the other
bars.
The sysex format itself will be unchanged, and will still allow different
bars in a pattern to have different aux configs, for example, if that's how
they have been converted from a v3 dump where a playlist has been converted
to a multi-bar pattern.

Best regards,
Colin Fraser
Sequentix Music Systems Ltd
http://www.sequentix.com

> You know you can translate a v3 dump to v4 using P3 Tools 2 ?

Yep... well, *I* can't because I don't have a PC running Windows. But  
in any case, most of the stuff I wanted to keep is sufficiently  
simple that I can recreate it by ear.

I'm now running V4 in my MX-expanded P3 (after a heart-stopping  
moment when I realised that my so-called Pozidriv-equipped cyber  
model Swiss Army Knife actually has Phillips bits instead) and it all  
seems to be working fine. There are a few UI queries I have, but they  
can wait until I understand completely what I'm actually doing (and  
until I'm sure they're not due to having completely reset the machine  
and lost all my prefs... I thought I'd lost the binary countdown on  
the mode LEDs for a while, which was rather upsetting).

	-- N.


Nick Rothwell / Cassiel.com Limited
www.cassiel.com
www.myspace.com/cassieldotcom
www.last.fm/music/cassiel
www.loadbang.net

Hi;

I am not familiar with V4 , but agree. keep it simple.

Less is more!

Hans

________________________________> To: analogue-sequencer@yahoogroups.com> From: vonhaulshoven@yahoo.com> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 07:32:56 +0000> Subject: [analogue-sequencer] Re: V4 question>> Hello,> Just as my music, Keep it as simple as possible :-)> --- In analogue-sequencer@yahoogroups.com, "Colin f"> wrote:>>>> Folks,>>>> A quick question for those of you using v4...>>>> As it stands, each bar in a multi-bar pattern has its own aux> config.>> The default config on a new bar is 'auto', which means you can set> the>> config just on the first bar, and all the other bars will pick it> up.>> But this is a rather clumsy way of doing it.>> If you later move bars about, and copy a bar with 'auto' auxes over> the>> first bar that had the actual settings in, then you need to set> them up>> again.>>>> I was wondering how much value there is in being able to set up> different>> auxes on each bar in a pattern.>> Is it something anyone is actually doing ?>> Or does it just make life more complicated ?>>>> Best regards,>> Colin Fraser>> Sequentix Music Systems Ltd>> http://www.sequentix.com>>> 

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today it's FREE!
http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/