Bc2000 (for the BCF2000 & BCR2000)

--- In bc2000@yahoogroups.com, "islandgroove2002"
<islandgroove2002@...> wrote:
> I did play with the Default value setting with no difference and I am a
> bit confused by the values range of 0-16383 (RTFM?)

Default is a generic parameter, i.e. it applies to ANY "standard" or 
"custom" output message definition, so its wide range of 0-16383 is 
necessary to support even those output message types that use 0-16383. 
In fact, as far as the "standard" output definitions are concerned, this 
wide range is only used by a few encoder and fader parameters (i.e. CC 
and NRPN in the 14-bit modes), but not for parameters for buttons. So 
you should only ever set Default to the range currently indicated for 
Value 1 and Value 2 on the "Standard message" tab, i.e. usually 0-127.

By the way: the upcoming BC Manager 1.5.0 fixes a bug concerning 
"Default Off": all previous versions of BC Manager (including 1.4.0)
don't send or save "Default Off" (so you'd lose "Default Off" upon
reopening the file). But as far as I can see, this doesn't have
anything to do with your current problem.

> When I send  snapshot from the BCF2000, only buttons with illuminated 
> LED are sent as a value (Value 1 = 127).Buttons that are "off" send no 
> value, so an off button (Value 2 = 60) is not being sent with the 
> snapshot.
> I can see that "off" does send a value of 60 from the BCF when I record 
> my button presses into a midi track, just not during snapshot send.

> So perhaps this is a slight glich in the Behringer programming that 
> cannot be resolved by BCMan editable parameters?

Believe it or not: I can't reproduce your problem. If anything, I've
got the REVERSE problem(!): I can't make my BCF NOT send the "off"
value (Value 2) in snapshots, at least not using a "standard output"
CC message. So I'm kind of confused right now.

We have a lot of issues to consider here:

First of all: there are 3 ways of triggering a snapshot:

1. You select a memory preset (e.g. via the preset keys on the BCF
itself) that has the "snapshot (on preset selection)" parameter set to
"on". (See under the Settings tab of the preset dialog in BC Manager.)

2. You press EDIT + "<PRESET" on the BCF. (This works irrespective of
the preset's "snapshot" parameter.)

3. In BC Manager you execute "Receive snapshot". This sends a special
snapshot request to the BCF. (This also works irrespective of the
preset's "snapshot" setting.)

However, I must say that I've never ever found any difference in
output for these 3 methods - but you never know.

Secondly: there may be a difference between the BCF's snapshot
behavior for a "standard output" definition and for a "custom output"
definition:

My experience is that a standard CC definition with Value 1=127, Value
2=0 (or your 60) and Mode "Toggle On" ALWAYS causes a snapshot to
include a message containing the correct value (so initially Value 2
(i.e. 0 or your 60). 

E.g.:

$rev F1 ; Firmware 1.10; BC Manager 1.5.0
$preset
  .name 'ButtonTest              '
  .snapshot on
  .request off
  .egroups 4
  .fkeys on
  .lock off
  .init
$button 33 ;Standard output
  .easypar CC 1 1 127 0 toggleon
  .showvalue on
$store 1
$end

Note that "snapshot" is "on" here. So if I upload this to my BCF, then
switch to preset 1 (e.g. via the PRESET buttons on the BCF itself),
the BCF ALWAYS returns "B0 01 00" (in BC Manager's "MIDI input
messages" window in "Record" mode). The same happens when I press EDIT
+ "<PRESET", or when I execute "Receive snapshot" from BC Manager.

However, it is also possible to define basically the same setup via
"custom output":

$rev F1 ; Firmware 1.10; BC Manager 1.5.0
$preset
  .name 'ButtonTest              '
  .snapshot on
  .request off
  .egroups 4
  .fkeys on
  .lock off
  .init
$button 33 ;Custom output
  .showvalue on
  .mode toggle
  .minmax 0 127
  .tx $B0 $01 val
$end

(In BC Manager the relevant values can be set via the button dialog's
"Custom output" tab.)

In this case, the BCF reacts more as you've described: it does NOT
send a message in the initial snapshot. However, it does send "0" in
manually triggered snapshots after you've pressed the button twice.

But I CAN make my BCF send a message even in the initial snapshot if I
add the line ".default 0" to the button section in the above script.
(Equivalent in BC Manager's button dialog box: under the "General"
tab, set Default "on" and to "0".)
So for custom output, if the Default parameter is set to "on", the
selected actual value of Default IS included in the initial snapshot.

In "BC MIDI Implementation.pdf" I stated that ".default off" ALWAYS
has the effect of PREVENTING a message in an initial snapshot - but
given the behavior described above, I'm now starting to suspect that
this prevention only works for CUSTOM output, not for STANDARD output.

On the other hand, if you can't get a response from standard message
definitions in initial snapshots, there may be something I'm
completely missing right now. So let me know how things work (or don't
work) for you.

Mark.