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UTILITY LFO

UTILITY LFO

2017-10-04 by Mike Burnham

Hi there

I'm a bit confused about this LFO

If I set the LFO for a perfect triangle at a certain frequency when I drop the frequency it changes shape.

When its really slow you can't really see the shape on a scope and you have to adjust by ear. And I am finding it very difficult to get a perfect triangle shape at very low speeds.

Also is is that the triangle is positive only does not go below zero?

Re: UTILITY LFO

2017-10-04 by Ken Stone

No, the shape should remain constant throughout the speed range. It sounds like you have a "shape" issue or you have speed and shape pots miswired/mixed.
Show quoted textHide quoted text
On Wed, Oct 4, 2017 at 8:38 PM, Mike Burnham mikejburnham@... [cgs_synth] <cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Hi there

I'm a bit confused about this LFO

If I set the LFO for a perfect triangle at a certain frequency when I drop the frequency it changes shape.

When its really slow you can't really see the shape on a scope and you have to adjust by ear. And I am finding it very difficult to get a perfect triangle shape at very low speeds.

Also is is that the triangle is positive only does not go below zero?




--
Ken Stone otherunicorn@...
Modular Synth PCBs for sale <http://www.cgs.synth.net/>

Re: UTILITY LFO

2017-10-04 by Ove Ridé

I think this is an inherent flaw in the design, deemed to be of sufficient performance for LFO use. The culprit is probably the matching of the diode pair. One diode in the pair conducts on the positive cycle, and the other on the negative. You may match up the shape for one setting, but then the different I-V characteristics makes the negative and positive cycles differ in length for a different pitch, and so the shape diverges. Getting a matched diode pair seems likethe way to fix it.

From the schematic, the LFO seems to swing both positive and negative of ground as far as I can tell.

On Wednesday, 4 October 2017, Mike Burnham mikejburnham@... [cgs_synth] <cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Hi there

I'm a bit confused about this LFO

If I set the LFO for a perfect triangle at a certain frequency when I drop the frequency it changes shape.

When its really slow you can't really see the shape on a scope and you have to adjust by ear. And I am finding it very difficult to get a perfect triangle shape at very low speeds.

Also is is that the triangle is positive only does not go below zero?



--
/Ove

Blog: <http://blog.gg8.se/>

"Here is Evergreen City. Evergreen is the color of green forever."

Re: UTILITY LFO

2017-10-04 by Mike Burnham

Yes thanks that makes sense
Any easy way to match diodes?
I do have some 1n4153 which are supposed to be high tolerance 1n4148
. Maybe these would be better?


Sent from my iPhone

On 4 Oct 2017, at 12:36, Ove Ridé nitro2k01@... [cgs_synth] <cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

I think this is an inherent flaw in the design, deemed to be of sufficient performance for LFO use. The culprit is probably the matching of the diode pair. One diode in the pair conducts on the positive cycle, and the other on the negative. You may match up the shape for one setting, but then the different I-V characteristics makes the negative and positive cycles differ in length for a different pitch, and so the shape diverges. Getting a matched diode pair seems likethe way to fix it.


From the schematic, the LFO seems to swing both positive and negative of ground as far as I can tell.
Show quoted textHide quoted text

On Wednesday, 4 October 2017, Mike Burnham mikejburnham@... [cgs_synth] <cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Hi there

I'm a bit confused about this LFO

If I set the LFO for a perfect triangle at a certain frequency when I drop the frequency it changes shape.

When its really slow you can't really see the shape on a scope and you have to adjust by ear. And I am finding it very difficult to get a perfect triangle shape at very low speeds.

Also is is that the triangle is positive only does not go below zero?



--
/Ove

Blog: <http://blog.gg8.se/>

"Here is Evergreen City. Evergreen is the color of green forever."

Re: UTILITY LFO

2017-10-04 by joshua lawson

There’s info about diode matching here:

Ken Stone's Modular Synthesizer

Ken Stone's Modular Synthesizer

Descriptions of the various modules in a home built music synthesizer.





Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

On Wednesday, October 4, 2017, 7:51 AM, Mike Burnham mikejburnham@... [cgs_synth] <cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Yes thanks that makes sense
Any easy way to match diodes?
I do have some 1n4153 which are supposed to be high tolerance 1n4148
. Maybe these would be better?


Sent from my iPhone

On 4 Oct 2017, at 12:36, Ove Ridé nitro2k01@... [cgs_synth] <cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

I think this is an inherent flaw in the design, deemed to be of sufficient performance for LFO use. The culprit is probably the matching of the diode pair. One diode in the pair conducts on the positive cycle, and the other on the negative. You may match up the shape for one setting, but then the different I-V characteristics makes the negative and positive cycles differ in length for a different pitch, and so the shape diverges. Getting a matched diode pair seems likethe way to fix it.


From the schematic, the LFO seems to swing both positive and negative of ground as far as I can tell.
Show quoted textHide quoted text

On Wednesday, 4 October 2017, Mike Burnham mikejburnham@... [cgs_synth] <cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Hi there

I'm a bit confused about this LFO

If I set the LFO for a perfect triangle at a certain frequency when I drop the frequency it changes shape.

When its really slow you can't really see the shape on a scope and you have to adjust by ear. And I am finding it very difficult to get a perfect triangle shape at very low speeds.

Also is is that the triangle is positive only does not go below zero?



--
/Ove

Blog: <http://blog.gg8.se/>

"Here is Evergreen City. Evergreen is the color of green forever."

Re: UTILITY LFO

2017-10-04 by Ken Stone

Yes, that could be a better way to do it. Take care that they are at the same temperature when you test them - in other words, don't touch them!
"To match diodes, try connecting them in series with a 10k resistor across 10 to 15 volts, and measuring for identical drops across the diodes themselves. It would be best to use the same supply and resistor for all measurements, and try to do all measurements at the same temperature. Avoid handling the diodes while testing them to prevent body heat changing their temperature. Note: I did not do this for my module, so this is untried. Alternatively, you could use the diode test function present on most digital multimeters."

On Thu, Oct 5, 2017 at 12:18 AM, joshua lawson rnrjosh@... [cgs_synth] <cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

There’s info about diode matching here:


Ken Stone's Modular Synthesizer

Ken Stone's Modular Synthesizer

Descriptions of the various modules in a home built music synthesizer.





Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone

On Wednesday, October 4, 2017, 7:51 AM, Mike Burnham mikejburnham@... [cgs_synth] <cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Yes thanks that makes sense
Any easy way to match diodes?
I do have some 1n4153 which are supposed to be high tolerance 1n4148
. Maybe these would be better?


Sent from my iPhone

On 4 Oct 2017, at 12:36, Ove Ridé nitro2k01@... [cgs_synth] <cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

I think this is an inherent flaw in the design, deemed to be of sufficient performance for LFO use. The culprit is probably the matching of the diode pair. One diode in the pair conducts on the positive cycle, and the other on the negative. You may match up the shape for one setting, but then the different I-V characteristics makes the negative and positive cycles differ in length for a different pitch, and so the shape diverges. Getting a matched diode pair seems likethe way to fix it.


From the schematic, the LFO seems to swing both positive and negative of ground as far as I can tell.
Show quoted textHide quoted text

On Wednesday, 4 October 2017, Mike Burnham mikejburnham@... [cgs_synth] <cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Hi there

I'm a bit confused about this LFO

If I set the LFO for a perfect triangle at a certain frequency when I drop the frequency it changes shape.

When its really slow you can't really see the shape on a scope and you have to adjust by ear. And I am finding it very difficult to get a perfect triangle shape at very low speeds.

Also is is that the triangle is positive only does not go below zero?



--
/Ove

Blog: <http://blog.gg8.se/>

"Here is Evergreen City. Evergreen is the color of green forever."




--
Ken Stone otherunicorn@...
Modular Synth PCBs for sale <http://www.cgs.synth.net/>

Re: UTILITY LFO

2017-10-04 by Ken Stone

They may do the job. Just measure the voltage drop of them using the diode test function of your multimeter. Pick two with the same voltage.

On Wed, Oct 4, 2017 at 10:51 PM, Mike Burnham mikejburnham@... [cgs_synth] <cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Yes thanks that makes sense
Any easy way to match diodes?
I do have some 1n4153 which are supposed to be high tolerance 1n4148
. Maybe these would be better?


Sent from my iPhone

On 4 Oct 2017, at 12:36, Ove Ridé nitro2k01@... [cgs_synth] <cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

I think this is an inherent flaw in the design, deemed to be of sufficient performance for LFO use. The culprit is probably the matching of the diode pair. One diode in the pair conducts on the positive cycle, and the other on the negative. You may match up the shape for one setting, but then the different I-V characteristics makes the negative and positive cycles differ in length for a different pitch, and so the shape diverges. Getting a matched diode pair seems likethe way to fix it.


From the schematic, the LFO seems to swing both positive and negative of ground as far as I can tell.
Show quoted textHide quoted text

On Wednesday, 4 October 2017, Mike Burnham mikejburnham@... [cgs_synth] <cgs_synth@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Hi there

I'm a bit confused about this LFO

If I set the LFO for a perfect triangle at a certain frequency when I drop the frequency it changes shape.

When its really slow you can't really see the shape on a scope and you have to adjust by ear. And I am finding it very difficult to get a perfect triangle shape at very low speeds.

Also is is that the triangle is positive only does not go below zero?



--
/Ove

Blog: <http://blog.gg8.se/>

"Here is Evergreen City. Evergreen is the color of green forever."




--
Ken Stone otherunicorn@...
Modular Synth PCBs for sale <http://www.cgs.synth.net/>

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