Datacolor User to User Support Group.

.....Going through PhotoShop I got a spot-on profile after just two very minor tweaks. I'm absolutely delighted! Thanks again! 

Bill



--- In datacolor_group@yahoogroups.com, David Miller <dm2363@...> wrote:
>
> 
> On Dec 22, 2010, at 8:59 AM, bill_hansen20012001 wrote:
> 
> > I've successfully made printer profiles using the Spyder systems for quite a while now, but this week I've been frustrated while trying to do a profile for a matte paper, using the Epson 2880 printer. The initial white point comes out 95, which seems okay, but the black point comes out at 19 - way too high - and (of course) the resulting measurement file just can't be used to create a good profile. The soft proofed images look like I'm viewing them through fogged or frosted glass.
> > 
> > Can someone point out to me what is going wrong here, and how to correct it?
> > 
> 
> There's nothing going wrong (this has been posted and written about many times).
> 
> When you print on matte papers, the black you get isn't as dark (and doesn't measure
> as dark) as when you print on non-matte (glossy or luster or semigloss) papers.
> 
> Typical measured values for black on matte papers are from the upper teens into the
> low 20's for the L value. I don't think I've ever seen a matte paper that gets a
> measured black lower than 17, and if you get a value of, say, greater than 23 or
> so, then something else is wrong (most likely, you'd be printing on the wrong side
> of the paper, or you'd be using the wrong kind of black ink - photo black ink on
> matte papers produces a weak black that measures in the upper 20's or even larger).
> 
> You're getting 19 - that's fine. It's not "way too high", it's fine.
> 
> When you softproof in Spyder3Print (this has also been written about many times):
> your softproof looks the way that it does because we don't have a feature that
> lets you turn off "black ink simulation", as Photoshop does. You see the actual
> measured black in the softproof, and with matte papers, that's how things look.
> 
> In Photoshop (which is where you should be doing your "real" softproofing),
> turn off black ink simulation and paper white simulation and your contrast
> will come back. Every printer profile on your system that's been done on
> matte paper will behave the same way (all matte papers measure with lighter
> blacks) - if you softproof in Photoshop with any of them, with black ink
> simulation turned on, you'll see the same washing-out effect happening.
> 
> > The Epson 2880 allows me to vary the ink density of the print, so I've tried printing the targets with not ink adjustment, and with a heavier ink application. The results are 
> > 
> 
> No, you're mostly wasting time and ink doing that. You won't be able to print
> a much darker black - maybe by playing with ink density controls you'll get
> it a bit darker, but lots of trial and error, very little if any benefit - I
> wouldn't spend any time on this.
> 
> What you're trying to do is the physically impossible - you can't make
> matte papers print with the same kind of measurable black that you get
> on non-matte papers. That's just the laws of physics - it's how things are.
> 
> 
> David Miller
> Senior Software Developer, Digital Color Solutions
> Datacolor
>