Disklavier

Good afternoon, everyone.

Regarding Joe's question of a used DC3 vs. a new DGH1BA:

(1) It is unclear to me from the email thread as to whether the DC3 is a Mark 
II or a Mark IIXG. If it is the latter, you could add a DCD1 to it and get 
close to the features of a Mark III. Missing would be the silent system, the 
ability to transpose the CD audio on playback, and support for the Smart 
PianoSoft software (in which you purchase a floppy disk recording of a piano 
part that synchronizes with a commercial audio CD).

If the piano is a Mark II, it may be possible to get an official Yamaha Mark 
IIXG upgrade installed in which the Mark II control unit is replaced with a 
Mark IIXG controller. I believe that a very few kits are left, but I am not 
sure which models still have kits available. To found out, you could call 
Mark Wisner at Yamaha Piano Service: (800) 854-1569 between 8:30-5:00 PST. 
Push 2 at the first menu choice and 2 at the second menu choice. I would 
strongly suggest that you factor the cost of the upgrade into your purchase 
decision.

If the piano is a Mark II and no upgrade is available, I would strongly 
suggest that you factor a DSR1 into the cost of your purchase. The DSR1 looks 
like a Mark IIXG control unit and connects to the old unit via MIDI. You 
could mount the old unit out of sight and mount the DSR1 in its place. For 
most purposes, you would feel as though you were using a Mark IIXG 
instrument. If you choose, you could also add the DCD1.

Please note: If you are doing MIDI work with a computer, you are FAR better 
off with a Mark IIXG or DSR1 control unit. In both cases, the tone generator 
is integrated with the control unit. In the Mark II system in which you use a 
separate tone generator, your MIDI cabling gets complicated. In some record 
and playback senarios, you actually have to keep reconfiguring your cabling.

(2) If high-end recording is a consideration, please note that the DC3 (Mark 
II, IIXG, or III) uses hammer sensors to measure the note-on velocity. In 
contrast, the Mark III systems for the DC2 and smaller sizes use a simpler 
key sensor system. The hammer sensor system if much more accurate.

(3) In general, larger pianos have better tone.

(4) Although Carol stated:

--"The "new technology" solenoids has more to do with the Recording features 
and the way the data processes the way they work.  It does not change how 
loud or quiet the piano will play."--

I believe that she got it backwards. The solenoids are used for playback, not 
recording. In any event, I doubt that there is much practical difference in 
the playback dynamic range of a Mark II/IIXG vs. a Mark III when playing 
acoustically at the normal volume setting. The Pro, however, is another story.

Regards,
PianoBench

<< Thank you all for your responces.  Really helpful.  
Checked the serial number on the painos - they are u.s. #'s.  
Carol, does the "newer technology" solienoid system make that much of a 
difference?  (BTW your explaination on the differences between the markIIXG 
and MarkIII was EXACTLY what I was looking for - it amazes me that the dealer 
couldn't/wasn't able to tell me the same info).  
The DGH1B is definately off the "buy" list - it seems that I can get the DC1A 
(which I believe is the newer model) for <$300 more - $20,000 even (they are 
selling the DGH1BA for $19,788). I am not sure if the DC1A has the new 
stringing scale you are refering to.
Thanks again to everyone for your helpful responces.  Much appreciated.
Joe Raziano
 Carol Beigel <carolrpt@...> wrote:Check again to get the right model 
number.  I do not know in what country 
you are purchasing this piano, but if it is in the United States, make sure 
this is not a "gray market" piano.  You would never be able to get parts or 
service.

A MarkII system does not have flash rom update; will only play 
double-density 720 floppy disks; and ESEQ and MIDI 0 files.

A MarkIIXG system has flash rom updates, uses high density 1.44 floppy 
disks, a memory disk equal to one floppy disk, an XG tone generator, a To 
Host port as well as MIDI In and Out ports, and plays ESEQ and both SMF 0 
and SMF 1 files.

A MarkIII system has everything the MarkIIXG has, but uses a newer 
technology solenoid system; comes with a CD player and speakers already 
installed; has a Silent Mode, has Smart Key and Piano Smart, and 16 memory 
disks built into the control box.

Looking at the subject line in your post, you say you are considering buying 
a DC3IIXG.  That is a proper model number if the serial number checks out.  
That would be a C3 grand piano with a MarkIIXG Disklavier on it.  If you 
like that piano, it is a very, very good deal at $24,500.  It would probably 
cost you at least $10,000 more for the same piano with a MarkIII system.

There is a reason the GH1B grand piano costs a whole lot less than a C3.  It 
has a very bright sound, and is almost impossible to tune the C3 to C4 
octave and the notes on either side.  This is middle C tuned to the C below 
it.  I believe this model is being discontinued as there is a new, 
redesigned stringing scale available in the same size.  I can't remember the 
new model designation.

The C3 grand piano, however, is one beautifully designed lovely sounding 
instrument!  Bigger is better when it comes to pianos.  The longer strings 
generate a better set of harmonics.

The DC3IIXG is clearly the better piano and has all the MIDI features you 
want.  A DGH1B with  MarkIII will give you more features (Silent Mode, A CD 
Player and Speakers, more memory, Piano Smart (recording your own or buying 
a piano performance that plays along with a commercially available audio CD 
from a music store).  However, those features will be at the cost of piano 
sound quality.

Good luck, and enjoy whatever you buy.


Carol Beigel
crbrpt@...


>From: "jraziano <jraziano@...>" <jraziano@...>
>Reply-To: disklavier@yahoogroups.com
>To: disklavier@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: [disklavier] Buying a DC3II-XG??? Help Please
>Date: Sun, 05 Jan 2003 20:32:55 -0000
>
>I strongly considering buying this piano knowing that it has
>the "older" mark II system in it.  (6'2" - NP98 - asking $24500 "new"
>from Yamaha dealer).
>The problem I am really having researching this model is that
>information on it is not available on the Yamaha website.  I know it
>does not have the silent system and the piano smart/smart key (not
>interested in these features anyway).
>Features that I do want - midi capability to record to cakewalk etc..
>(i believe it does this).  I guess what I am trying to figure out is
>that has there been any SIGNIFIGANT upgrades aside from the control
>unit that I should be aware of - abviously the dealer is not
>forthcoming if there is.  He claims that the optics, soleniods and
>machanics are exactly the same as well as the basic unit except for
>the integration of the CDrom and the features list above.  True
>statements?  I don't know.
>The question - should I get this piano OR get the DGH1BA (a 5'3" has
>the Mark III system 19,800).
>Help Help Help.
>Thanks.
>


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Thank you all for your responces.  Really helpful.  
Checked the serial number on the painos - they are u.s. #'s.  
Carol, does the "newer technology" solienoid system make that much of a 
difference?  (BTW your explaination on the differences between the markIIXG 
and MarkIII was EXACTLY what I was looking for - it amazes me that the dealer 
couldn't/wasn't able to tell me the same info).  
The DGH1B is definately off the "buy" list - it seems that I can get the DC1A 
(which I believe is the newer model) for <$300 more - $20,000 even (they are 
selling the DGH1BA for $19,788). I am not sure if the DC1A has the new 
stringing scale you are refering to.
Thanks again to everyone for your helpful responces.  Much appreciated.
Joe Raziano
 Carol Beigel <carolrpt@...> wrote:
<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 
2px solid"><TT>Check again to get the right model number.  I do not know in 
what country 
you are purchasing this piano, but if it is in the United States, make sure 
this is not a "gray market" piano.  You would never be able to get parts or 
service.

A MarkII system does not have flash rom update; will only play 
double-density 720 floppy disks; and ESEQ and MIDI 0 files.

A MarkIIXG system has flash rom updates, uses high density 1.44 floppy 
disks, a memory disk equal to one floppy disk, an XG tone generator, a To 
Host port as well as MIDI In and Out ports, and plays ESEQ and both SMF 0 
and SMF 1 files.

A MarkIII system has everything the MarkIIXG has, but uses a newer 
technology solenoid system; comes with a CD player and speakers already 
installed; has a Silent Mode, has Smart Key and Piano Smart, and 16 memory 
disks built into the control box.

Looking at the subject line in your post, you say you are considering buying 
a DC3IIXG.  That is a proper model number if the serial number checks out.  
That would be a C3 grand piano with a MarkIIXG Disklavier on it.  If you 
like that piano, it is a very, very good deal at $24,500.  It would probably 
cost you at least $10,000 more for the same piano with a MarkIII system.

There is a reason the GH1B grand piano costs a whole lot less than a C3.  It 
has a very bright sound, and is almost impossible to tune the C3 to C4 
octave and the notes on either side.  This is middle C tuned to the C below 
it.  I believe this model is being discontinued as there is a new, 
redesigned stringing scale available in the same size.  I can't remember the 
new model designation.

The C3 grand piano, however, is one beautifully designed lovely sounding 
instrument!  Bigger is better when it comes to pianos.  The longer strings 
generate a better set of harmonics.

The DC3IIXG is clearly the better piano and has all the MIDI features you 
want.  A DGH1B with  MarkIII will give you more features (Silent Mode, A CD 
Player and Speakers, more memory, Piano Smart (recording your own or buying 
a piano performance that plays along with a commercially available audio CD 
from a music store).  However, those features will be at the cost of piano 
sound quality.

Good luck, and enjoy whatever you buy.


Carol Beigel
crbrpt@...>>