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2014-11-16 by MixMeisterBob
Just wondering if I can Stream Internet Radio that Plays My Piano via my Wagon Grand Disklavier. I do use my laptop to play midi files via the wagon on my C3, but streaming sounds like what I want nopw…Bob
2014-11-16 by Mark Fontana
Yamaha could release a mobile or desktop app called something like "Disklavier Radio Receiver" that would receive the stream and play it out to the piano through a MIDI interface. It could be a way to gain additional revenue from Disklavier Radio, especially if the app would support non-Disklavier player systems too (by adjusting the streams slightly on-the-fly to better suit the target player system). I think there's at least one developer on this mailing list who knows enough about the network protocol to implement such an application, even if Yamaha won't do it. The assumption is that Yamaha's concerns about piracy are what has been blocking this in both cases. The external MIDI connection would make it possible to intercept and store the streams, even if the streaming itself is fully legit and paid for. There are probably also business and legal issues related to how the content is licensed and priced for streaming use. Mark Fontana On 11/16/2014 07:53 AM, 'MixMeisterBob' mixmeisterbob@... [disklavier] wrote:
> > Just wondering if I can Stream Internet Radio that Plays My Piano via > my Wagon Grand Disklavier. I do use my laptop to play midi files via > the wagon on my C3, but streaming sounds like what I want nopw\u2026Bob > > >
2014-11-17 by MixMeisterBob
So I have to replace my Disklavier piano to be able to stream?
From: disklavier@yahoogroups.com [mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2014 1:43 PM To: disklavier@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [disklavier] Streaming Internet Radio that Plays My Piano Yamaha could release a mobile or desktop app called something like "Disklavier Radio Receiver" that would receive the stream and play it out to the piano through a MIDI interface. It could be a way to gain additional revenue from Disklavier Radio, especially if the app would support non-Disklavier player systems too (by adjusting the streams slightly on-the-fly to better suit the target player system). I think there's at least one developer on this mailing list who knows enough about the network protocol to implement such an application, even if Yamaha won't do it. The assumption is that Yamaha's concerns about piracy are what has been blocking this in both cases. The external MIDI connection would make it possible to intercept and store the streams, even if the streaming itself is fully legit and paid for. There are probably also business and legal issues related to how the content is licensed and priced for streaming use. Mark Fontana On 11/16/2014 07:53 AM, 'MixMeisterBob' mixmeisterbob@... <mailto:mixmeisterbob@...> [disklavier] wrote: Just wondering if I can Stream Internet Radio that Plays My Piano via my Wagon Grand Disklavier. I do use my laptop to play midi files via the wagon on my C3, but streaming sounds like what I want nopw…Bob
2014-11-17 by PianoBench@...
Good morning, everyone. Bob, the direct answer is Yes. DisklavierRadio and DisklavierTV are only supported by: —E3 —Mark IV —Mark II, Mark IIXG, Mark III which have a DKC-850 connected as a “replacement” control unit (as opposed to an add-on control unit that connects via MIDI cables) Regards, PianoBench
> On Nov 17, 2014, at 8:16 AM, 'MixMeisterBob' mixmeisterbob@... [disklavier] <disklavier@yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > > So I have to replace my Disklavier piano to be able to stream? > > > > From: disklavier@yahoogroups.com <mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com> [mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com <mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com>] > Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2014 1:43 PM > To: disklavier@yahoogroups.com <mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com> > Subject: Re: [disklavier] Streaming Internet Radio that Plays My Piano > > > > > > > Yamaha could release a mobile or desktop app called something like "Disklavier Radio Receiver" that would receive the stream and play it out to the piano through a MIDI interface. It could be a way to gain additional revenue from Disklavier Radio, especially if the app would support non-Disklavier player systems too (by adjusting the streams slightly on-the-fly to better suit the target player system). I think there's at least one developer on this mailing list who knows enough about the network protocol to implement such an application, even if Yamaha won't do it. > > The assumption is that Yamaha's concerns about piracy are what has been blocking this in both cases. The external MIDI connection would make it possible to intercept and store the streams, even if the streaming itself is fully legit and paid for. There are probably also business and legal issues related to how the content is licensed and priced for streaming use. > > Mark Fontana > > > On 11/16/2014 07:53 AM, 'MixMeisterBob' mixmeisterbob@... <mailto:mixmeisterbob@...> [disklavier] wrote: > >> >> >> Just wondering if I can Stream Internet Radio that Plays My Piano via my Wagon Grand Disklavier. I do use my laptop to play midi files via the wagon on my C3, but streaming sounds like what I want nopw…Bob >> >> >> > > > > >
2014-11-17 by Mark Fontana
It seems like Yamaha could expand the market for Disklavier Radio as I described by watermarking the streams, telling the user this, and requiring the user to sign a strict EULA when subscribing to the streaming service. If streamed content appears in the wild despite the EULA, they'd have a shot at determining who leaked it from the watermark. Another solution (Disklavier-only) would be to have the external application transmit the wireline MIDI with encryption applied, then provide a one-time firmware update for older Disklaviers to detect and decrypt the encrypted streams. Mark Fontana
On 11/17/2014 09:27 AM, PianoBench@... [disklavier] wrote: > > Good morning, everyone. > > > Bob, the direct answer is Yes. > > DisklavierRadio and DisklavierTV are only supported by: > > \u2014E3 > \u2014Mark IV > \u2014Mark II, Mark IIXG, Mark III which have a DKC-850 connected as a > \u201creplacement\u201d control unit (as opposed to an add-on control unit that > connects via MIDI cables) > > Regards, > PianoBench > >> On Nov 17, 2014, at 8:16 AM, 'MixMeisterBob' >> mixmeisterbob@... <mailto:mixmeisterbob@...> >> [disklavier] <disklavier@yahoogroups.com >> <mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com>> wrote: >> >> >> So I have to replace my Disklavier piano to be able to stream? >> >>
2014-11-18 by MixMeisterBob
I have always wondered why the DKC-850, since it has midi, is not able to be used on my Control Wagon?
From: disklavier@yahoogroups.com [mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, November 17, 2014 12:06 PM To: disklavier@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [disklavier] Streaming Internet Radio that Plays My Piano It seems like Yamaha could expand the market for Disklavier Radio as I described by watermarking the streams, telling the user this, and requiring the user to sign a strict EULA when subscribing to the streaming service. If streamed content appears in the wild despite the EULA, they'd have a shot at determining who leaked it from the watermark. Another solution (Disklavier-only) would be to have the external application transmit the wireline MIDI with encryption applied, then provide a one-time firmware update for older Disklaviers to detect and decrypt the encrypted streams. Mark Fontana On 11/17/2014 09:27 AM, PianoBench@... <mailto:PianoBench@...> [disklavier] wrote: Good morning, everyone. Bob, the direct answer is Yes. DisklavierRadio and DisklavierTV are only supported by: —E3 —Mark IV —Mark II, Mark IIXG, Mark III which have a DKC-850 connected as a “replacement” control unit (as opposed to an add-on control unit that connects via MIDI cables) Regards, PianoBench On Nov 17, 2014, at 8:16 AM, 'MixMeisterBob' mixmeisterbob@... <mailto:mixmeisterbob@...> [disklavier] <disklavier@yahoogroups.com <mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com> > wrote: So I have to replace my Disklavier piano to be able to stream?
2014-11-18 by wandamusic@...
I do not have streaming radio on my DU1A, but follow with interest the conversations. I am just curious, my assumption must be wrong based on the limits Yamaha puts on the streaming audio. But say you had disklavier radio on your piano. Would you not be able to set MIDI thru or OUT in such a way as to "capture" what is coming IN to the piano? That data stream is SOMEwhere. My thoughts are if it is already possible to "intercept it", yet it is not intercepted and pirated and a problem, perhaps there might be a chance of influencing someone to allow an update for older diskalviers to get the service. And if this potential interception is why they do not release some update.... then we just need some disklavier nerds to figure out a way that it can be retrofitted while not allowing theft, like the encryption mentioned. Maybe some sort of hardwired, rather than software type encryption (if that is possible). Blessings, Wanda
2014-11-18 by George Frederick Litterst
Good morning, everyone. Bob, Yamaha does not offer the DKC-850 as an upgrade for the Wagon Grand, MX100A or B, or MX80 series. However, the unit is useable with these pianos—assuming that the original components of those pianos are still in working condition. If you add a DKC-850 to your Wagon Grand, you will connect it to the wagon unit with MIDI cables. After making a couple of simple MIDI settings on the wagon unit and one setting on the DKC-850, you are all set to go. To operate your piano, your Wagon Grand must be turned on. After that, all of your interaction can be with the DKC-850, ignoring the wagon, which will give you a user-experience that is similar to operating a modern E3 Disklavier. NOTE: The record/playback quality of your instrument will be unchanged and obviously no new mechanical features, such as a silent system, will be added to your piano. When the DKC-850 is used as a MIDI add-on unit, you will not have access to DisklavierRadio or DisklavierTV. Regards, PianoBench
> On Nov 18, 2014, at 6:16 AM, 'MixMeisterBob' mixmeisterbob@... [disklavier] <disklavier@yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > > I have always wondered why the DKC-850, since it has midi, is not able to be used on my Control Wagon? > > > > From: disklavier@yahoogroups.com <mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com> [mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com <mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com>] > Sent: Monday, November 17, 2014 12:06 PM > To: disklavier@yahoogroups.com <mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com> > Subject: Re: [disklavier] Streaming Internet Radio that Plays My Piano > > > > > > > It seems like Yamaha could expand the market for Disklavier Radio as I described by watermarking the streams, telling the user this, and requiring the user to sign a strict EULA when subscribing to the streaming service. If streamed content appears in the wild despite the EULA, they'd have a shot at determining who leaked it from the watermark. > > Another solution (Disklavier-only) would be to have the external application transmit the wireline MIDI with encryption applied, then provide a one-time firmware update for older Disklaviers to detect and decrypt the encrypted streams. > > Mark Fontana > > > On 11/17/2014 09:27 AM, PianoBench@... <mailto:PianoBench@...> [disklavier] wrote: > >> >> >> Good morning, everyone. >> >> >> >> Bob, the direct answer is Yes. >> >> >> >> DisklavierRadio and DisklavierTV are only supported by: >> >> >> >> —E3 >> >> —Mark IV >> >> —Mark II, Mark IIXG, Mark III which have a DKC-850 connected as a “replacement” control unit (as opposed to an add-on control unit that connects via MIDI cables) >> >> >> >> Regards, >> >> PianoBench >> >> >> >>> On Nov 17, 2014, at 8:16 AM, 'MixMeisterBob' mixmeisterbob@comcast.net <mailto:mixmeisterbob@...> [disklavier] <disklavier@yahoogroups.com <mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com>> wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> So I have to replace my Disklavier piano to be able to stream? >>> >>> >>> > > > > >
2014-11-18 by George Frederick Litterst
Good morning, everyone. Wanda, your DU1A is upgradeable with a DKC-850, which means that the DKC-850 can replace your current control unit completely, thus providing access to DisklavierRadio and DisklavierTV. Obviously, there is a piracy concern behind the design of DisklavierRadio and DisklavierTV, and it is not possible to capture the MIDI data streams. I did not design DisklavierRadio nor DisklavierTV, so I cannot comment on the exact thinking behind the design except to point out that there are many different constituencies that have to be pleased in order for either system to be viable: —Yamaha —the performing artists —the owners of music copyrights (i.e. mechanical rights and public performance rights) —consumers Intellectual property law and the opinions of the individual constituents makes these issues complicated. If the data streams can be captured, for example, performing artists may demand higher fees or refuse to participate in broadcasts. NOTE: I used the word “may.” It’s all conjecture. We’re obviously living in a fast-changing era in which everyone is trying to figure out a viable way to make new technologies work for everyone. Regards, PianoBench
> On Nov 18, 2014, at 8:14 AM, wandamusic@... [disklavier] <disklavier@yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > > I do not have streaming radio on my DU1A, but follow with interest the conversations. > > I am just curious, my assumption must be wrong based on the limits Yamaha puts on the streaming audio. > > But say you had disklavier radio on your piano. Would you not be able to set MIDI thru or OUT in such a way as to "capture" what is coming IN to the piano? > > That data stream is SOMEwhere. > > My thoughts are if it is already possible to "intercept it", yet it is not intercepted and pirated and a problem, perhaps there might be a chance of influencing someone to allow an update for older diskalviers to get the service. > > And if this potential interception is why they do not release some update.... then we just need some disklavier nerds to figure out a way that it can be retrofitted while not allowing theft, like the encryption mentioned. Maybe some sort of hardwired, rather than software type encryption (if that is possible). > > Blessings, > > Wanda > >
2014-11-19 by MixMeisterBob
Thanks for the info George, however, I want to stream the internet so maybe a Yamaha Guru will chime in…Bob
From: disklavier@yahoogroups.com [mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, November 18, 2014 8:28 AM To: disklavier@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [disklavier] Streaming Internet Radio that Plays My Piano Good morning, everyone. Bob, Yamaha does not offer the DKC-850 as an upgrade for the Wagon Grand, MX100A or B, or MX80 series. However, the unit is useable with these pianos—assuming that the original components of those pianos are still in working condition. If you add a DKC-850 to your Wagon Grand, you will connect it to the wagon unit with MIDI cables. After making a couple of simple MIDI settings on the wagon unit and one setting on the DKC-850, you are all set to go. To operate your piano, your Wagon Grand must be turned on. After that, all of your interaction can be with the DKC-850, ignoring the wagon, which will give you a user-experience that is similar to operating a modern E3 Disklavier. NOTE: The record/playback quality of your instrument will be unchanged and obviously no new mechanical features, such as a silent system, will be added to your piano. When the DKC-850 is used as a MIDI add-on unit, you will not have access to DisklavierRadio or DisklavierTV. Regards, PianoBench On Nov 18, 2014, at 6:16 AM, 'MixMeisterBob' mixmeisterbob@... <mailto:mixmeisterbob@...> [disklavier] <disklavier@yahoogroups.com <mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com> > wrote: I have always wondered why the DKC-850, since it has midi, is not able to be used on my Control Wagon? From: <mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com> disklavier@yahoogroups.com [ <mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com> mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, November 17, 2014 12:06 PM To: <mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com> disklavier@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [disklavier] Streaming Internet Radio that Plays My Piano It seems like Yamaha could expand the market for Disklavier Radio as I described by watermarking the streams, telling the user this, and requiring the user to sign a strict EULA when subscribing to the streaming service. If streamed content appears in the wild despite the EULA, they'd have a shot at determining who leaked it from the watermark. Another solution (Disklavier-only) would be to have the external application transmit the wireline MIDI with encryption applied, then provide a one-time firmware update for older Disklaviers to detect and decrypt the encrypted streams. Mark Fontana On 11/17/2014 09:27 AM, <mailto:PianoBench@...> PianoBench@... [disklavier] wrote: Good morning, everyone. Bob, the direct answer is Yes. DisklavierRadio and DisklavierTV are only supported by: —E3 —Mark IV —Mark II, Mark IIXG, Mark III which have a DKC-850 connected as a “replacement” control unit (as opposed to an add-on control unit that connects via MIDI cables) Regards, PianoBench On Nov 17, 2014, at 8:16 AM, 'MixMeisterBob' <mailto:mixmeisterbob@...> mixmeisterbob@... [disklavier] < <mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com> disklavier@yahoogroups.com> wrote: So I have to replace my Disklavier piano to be able to stream?
2014-11-19 by Bill Brandom
George is a Yamaha guru. Bill iPhone On Nov 19, 2014, at 6:12 AM, 'MixMeisterBob' mixmeisterbob@... [disklavier] <disklavier@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Thanks for the info George, however, I want to stream the internet so maybe a Yamaha Guru will chime in…Bob
From: disklavier@yahoogroups.com [mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Tuesday, November 18, 2014 8:28 AM To: disklavier@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [disklavier] Streaming Internet Radio that Plays My Piano Good morning, everyone. Bob, Yamaha does not offer the DKC-850 as an upgrade for the Wagon Grand, MX100A or B, or MX80 series. However, the unit is useable with these pianos—assuming that the original components of those pianos are still in working condition. If you add a DKC-850 to your Wagon Grand, you will connect it to the wagon unit with MIDI cables. After making a couple of simple MIDI settings on the wagon unit and one setting on the DKC-850, you are all set to go. To operate your piano, your Wagon Grand must be turned on. After that, all of your interaction can be with the DKC-850, ignoring the wagon, which will give you a user-experience that is similar to operating a modern E3 Disklavier. NOTE: The record/playback quality of your instrument will be unchanged and obviously no new mechanical features, such as a silent system, will be added to your piano. When the DKC-850 is used as a MIDI add-on unit, you will not have access to DisklavierRadio or DisklavierTV. Regards, PianoBench On Nov 18, 2014, at 6:16 AM, 'MixMeisterBob' mixmeisterbob@... [disklavier] <disklavier@yahoogroups.com> wrote: I have always wondered why the DKC-850, since it has midi, is not able to be used on my Control Wagon? From: disklavier@yahoogroups.com [mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Monday, November 17, 2014 12:06 PM To: disklavier@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [disklavier] Streaming Internet Radio that Plays My Piano It seems like Yamaha could expand the market for Disklavier Radio as I described by watermarking the streams, telling the user this, and requiring the user to sign a strict EULA when subscribing to the streaming service. If streamed content appears in the wild despite the EULA, they'd have a shot at determining who leaked it from the watermark. Another solution (Disklavier-only) would be to have the external application transmit the wireline MIDI with encryption applied, then provide a one-time firmware update for older Disklaviers to detect and decrypt the encrypted streams. Mark Fontana On 11/17/2014 09:27 AM, PianoBench@... [disklavier] wrote: Good morning, everyone. Bob, the direct answer is Yes. DisklavierRadio and DisklavierTV are only supported by: —E3 —Mark IV —Mark II, Mark IIXG, Mark III which have a DKC-850 connected as a “replacement” control unit (as opposed to an add-on control unit that connects via MIDI cables) Regards, PianoBench On Nov 17, 2014, at 8:16 AM, 'MixMeisterBob' mixmeisterbob@... [disklavier] <disklavier@yahoogroups.com> wrote: So I have to replace my Disklavier piano to be able to stream?
2014-11-29 by David Masher
Hi Folks, I hope you all had a great Thanksgiving! Quick question my Mark IV will not connect to the PRC-100. I get a message saying the network is offline. I am pretty tech savvy but can really find a knowledge base that contains this issue and how to correct it. I have tried restarting, making sure the cards we properly seated etc... Thanks for your help! David David J. Masher Creative Director Inversion Media <http://www.inversiondesign.com/> 74 Wethersfield Street Rowley, MA 01969 978 853 5187 david.masher@...
> On Nov 19, 2014, at 1:01 PM, Bill Brandom billbrando@...m [disklavier] <disklavier@yahoogroups.com> wrote: > > > George is a Yamaha guru. > > Bill > > iPhone > > On Nov 19, 2014, at 6:12 AM, 'MixMeisterBob' mixmeisterbob@... <mailto:mixmeisterbob@...> [disklavier] <disklavier@yahoogroups.com <mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com>> wrote: > > > > Thanks for the info George, however, I want to stream the internet so maybe a Yamaha Guru will chime in…Bob > > > > From: disklavier@yahoogroups.com <mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com> [mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com <mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com>] > Sent: Tuesday, November 18, 2014 8:28 AM > To: disklavier@yahoogroups.com <mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com> > Subject: Re: [disklavier] Streaming Internet Radio that Plays My Piano > > > > > > Good morning, everyone. > > > > Bob, Yamaha does not offer the DKC-850 as an upgrade for the Wagon Grand, MX100A or B, or MX80 series. However, the unit is useable with these pianos—assuming that the original components of those pianos are still in working condition. > > > > If you add a DKC-850 to your Wagon Grand, you will connect it to the wagon unit with MIDI cables. After making a couple of simple MIDI settings on the wagon unit and one setting on the DKC-850, you are all set to go. To operate your piano, your Wagon Grand must be turned on. After that, all of your interaction can be with the DKC-850, ignoring the wagon, which will give you a user-experience that is similar to operating a modern E3 Disklavier. > > > > NOTE: The record/playback quality of your instrument will be unchanged and obviously no new mechanical features, such as a silent system, will be added to your piano. > > > > When the DKC-850 is used as a MIDI add-on unit, you will not have access to DisklavierRadio or DisklavierTV. > > > > Regards, > > PianoBench > > > > > > > > On Nov 18, 2014, at 6:16 AM, 'MixMeisterBob' mixmeisterbob@... <mailto:mixmeisterbob@...> [disklavier] <disklavier@yahoogroups.com <mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com>> wrote: > > > > > > I have always wondered why the DKC-850, since it has midi, is not able to be used on my Control Wagon? > > > > From: disklavier@yahoogroups.com <mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com> [mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com <mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com>] > Sent: Monday, November 17, 2014 12:06 PM > To: disklavier@yahoogroups.com <mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com> > Subject: Re: [disklavier] Streaming Internet Radio that Plays My Piano > > > > > > > It seems like Yamaha could expand the market for Disklavier Radio as I described by watermarking the streams, telling the user this, and requiring the user to sign a strict EULA when subscribing to the streaming service. If streamed content appears in the wild despite the EULA, they'd have a shot at determining who leaked it from the watermark. > > Another solution (Disklavier-only) would be to have the external application transmit the wireline MIDI with encryption applied, then provide a one-time firmware update for older Disklaviers to detect and decrypt the encrypted streams. > > Mark Fontana > > > On 11/17/2014 09:27 AM, PianoBench@... <mailto:PianoBench@...> [disklavier] wrote: > > > > Good morning, everyone. > > > > Bob, the direct answer is Yes. > > > > DisklavierRadio and DisklavierTV are only supported by: > > > > —E3 > > —Mark IV > > —Mark II, Mark IIXG, Mark III which have a DKC-850 connected as a “replacement” control unit (as opposed to an add-on control unit that connects via MIDI cables) > > > > Regards, > > PianoBench > > > > On Nov 17, 2014, at 8:16 AM, 'MixMeisterBob' mixmeisterbob@... <mailto:mixmeisterbob@...> [disklavier] <disklavier@yahoogroups.com <mailto:disklavier@yahoogroups.com>> wrote: > > > > > > So I have to replace my Disklavier piano to be able to stream? > > > > > > > > > > > > >