MOTM

I disagree slightly with Stooge Barlow on a couple of points.

1. The Moog ribbon controllers have two narrow metal bands that run 
the length of the ribbon, slightly to one side. You bridge the gap 
between the tracks anywhere along its length to generate a gate. I 
like the option of generating gates manually instead of 
automatically. Maybe Barlow and I could compromise and have a mode 
switch that handles both.

2. The single most important useability feature would be to adopt the 
Yamaha convention of having the zero point be where you first put 
your finger down. That way you can touch down anywhere on the ribbon 
and do finger vibrato, or smooth sweeps away from the current control 
voltage. You could have another mode switch that allows it to operate 
the other way as well.

Moe

>>>>
I also think gate and trigger should be generated with each touch of \
the ribbon. 

Two things which I'd add as ideas are: 1) a rotary (Paul gasps) range 
switch to reduce the range to as little as one octave. 2) a scale 
switch to cause the mid point of the ribbon to generate zero volts 
with the right side positive, and the left side negative.
<<<<<

On Fri, 17 Aug 2001 mate_stubb@... wrote:

> 2. The single most important useability feature would be to adopt the
> Yamaha convention of having the zero point be where you first put
> your finger down. That way you can touch down anywhere on the ribbon
> and do finger vibrato, or smooth sweeps away from the current control
> voltage. You could have another mode switch that allows it to operate
> the other way as well.

  For those interested, here is how Yamaha did this:

http://www.cs80.com/csribbon.gif

  They just detect when the ribbon is touched and store the initial ribbon
contact voltage on an S/H cap.  Part of this circuit shows the coarse/fine
tuning knobs used on a CS.  The output drives the top end of the DAC
'octave' resistor ladder in the CS.  Modular use would just need the
output scaled for +/-5V or whatever.  I am unsure what the ribbon
resistance is, but that should not be too critical.  I'll measure it the
next time I have the CS-80 open.

  Oh, the 'down' and 'up' gates can be picked off those comparators and
buffered for gate/trig use.

Crow

/**/

I would investigate the use of tactex if you go this direction.  This seems like
a great prospective product for this type of apllication.  I know a few other
MOTM users are  looking to get the new moog synth to control there motm's just
because of the of that tactex pad and others reasons Im sure too.
Jim

mate_stubb@... wrote:

> 
> I disagree slightly with Stooge Barlow on a couple of points.
> 
> 1. The Moog ribbon controllers have two narrow metal bands that run
> the length of the ribbon, slightly to one side. You bridge the gap
> between the tracks anywhere along its length to generate a gate. I
> like the option of generating gates manually instead of
> automatically. Maybe Barlow and I could compromise and have a mode
> switch that handles both.
> 
> 2. The single most important useability feature would be to adopt the
> Yamaha convention of having the zero point be where you first put
> your finger down. That way you can touch down anywhere on the ribbon
> and do finger vibrato, or smooth sweeps away from the current control
> voltage. You could have another mode switch that allows it to operate
> the other way as well.
> 
> Moe
> 
> >>>>
> I also think gate and trigger should be generated with each touch of \
> the ribbon.
> 
> Two things which I'd add as ideas are: 1) a rotary (Paul gasps) range
> switch to reduce the range to as little as one octave. 2) a scale
> switch to cause the mid point of the ribbon to generate zero volts
> with the right side positive, and the left side negative.
> <<<<<
> 
> 
> 
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

I hate "me too" posts, so I'll say "ditto" instead.  :)  But seriously, a
Tactex box with CV breakouts would be faboo.  I wonder if the Tactex people
would consider making a ribbon-shaped controller as well?

(Appologies to Jim for sending this twice...)

--PBr

-----Original Message-----
From: moog@... [mailto:moog@...]
Sent: Friday, August 17, 2001 6:21 AM
To: motm@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [motm] The NEXT thing (ribbon controller)


I would investigate the use of tactex if you go this direction.  This seems
like
a great prospective product for this type of apllication.  I know a few
other
MOTM users are  looking to get the new moog synth to control there motm's
just
because of the of that tactex pad and others reasons Im sure too.

Midiman has the control one coming out soon designed by MOTMer Tony .K
I have a picture of it if someone can post it on there website, let me know.
JIm

imorpheusl@... wrote:

> 
> <<It's good to see talk about alternatives to keyboard-based
> controllers. For controlling a modular they seem kind of lame.
> 
> I've always envisioned a disc-shaped surface with zones that were
> both sensitive to impact and pressure.
> 
> Imagine a circular controller divided into 8 pie-slice shaped zones.
> Tapping with finger sends a gate/trigger pulse. Sliding a finger over
> a zone while pressing down sends a varying control voltage.>>
> 
> Could you use a korg kaoss pad and a kenton pro 2000 to get this effect? I'm
> not sure how extensive the kaoss pad's midi is but it could be pretty damn
> cool. Imaging running 2 420's, one set to HP and the other set to LP and
> using the kaoss pad to change the cut off frequency. Ultimate band pass
> filter control :P
> 
> -Chaz
> 
>                    Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
>                        ADVERTISEMENT
> 
> 
> 
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

I still have the pic you sent me and I'll put it up, and send the link.

At 11:05 AM 8/18/01 -0400, moog@... wrote:

>Midiman has the control one coming out soon designed by MOTMer Tony .K
>I have a picture of it if someone can post it on there website, let me know.
>JIm

The Midiman Surface One controller:
http://www.hylander.com/images/motm/surfaceone.jpg

At 11:05 AM 8/18/01 -0400, moog@... wrote:

>Midiman has the control one coming out soon designed by MOTMer Tony .K
>I have a picture of it if someone can post it on there website, let me know.
>JIm

In a message dated 8/16/2001 8:46:13 PM, mate_stubb@... writes:

>I disagree slightly with Stooge Barlow on a couple of points.

That's because you're slightly wrong<g>!

>1. The Moog ribbon controllers have two narrow metal bands that run 
>the length of the ribbon, slightly to one side. You bridge the gap 
>between the tracks anywhere along its length to generate a gate. I 
>like the option of generating gates manually instead of 
>automatically. Maybe Barlow and I could compromise and have a mode 
>switch that handles both.

This is a good idea! I'd prefer to have the option of generating a 
gate/trigger with each touch of the ribbon, but also be able to 
"re-gate/trigger" with an additional button (or pad). I wouldn't want to 
always have to use a separate button (or pad) to generate the gate/trigger. 
Good compromise Moe!

>2. The single most important useability feature would be to adopt the 
>Yamaha convention of having the zero point be where you first put 
>your finger down. That way you can touch down anywhere on the ribbon 
>and do finger vibrato, or smooth sweeps away from the current control 
>voltage. You could have another mode switch that allows it to operate 
>the other way as well.

I remember this being mentioned before. Thanks to Crow for posting the info 
about it. This would be a good feature, but again, I wouldn't *always* want 
the ribbon to operate like this. Maybe a few operating modes would be useful: 
1) "traditional" style, 2) zero set (Yamaha style), 3) zero at mid point. 
Additional scaling (inverting) and offset switches and pots could be added to 
these modes, as well as ways to make the output vary from linear to 
exponential.

And it might be good to have controller body marked with position markers too.
JB