MOTM

I haven't been "fast to respond" this week for several reasons (Spring Break for 
the kids, out Wed all day with medical
tests [when you turn 50, the medical community gets all excited], getting the 
'650 boards over to the stuffing house).

I will catch up this weekend on all the outstanding kit orders, and send to Paul 
H's assistant the next batch of
kits that need to be shipped.

Front panels for all the back-orders ('820, '485, '300s) will arrive towards the 
end of the month. Also all the Frac
sheet metal. The first batch of Frac boards will go to the board stuffer March 
29th. They will be available for ordering
from Analog Haven ~April 15th (tax day here in the US!!). JH, Old Crow and I did 
a great job on these, IMHO.

The upcoming week I will also be 'slow to respond' due to "real work" issues and 
preparing the '650s for shipping. Remember,
just because you can type and send an email to me in 1min doesn't mean I will 
get back in 10min :) It may be 2-3 days.
Haven't run off with your money, still paying bills :)

Paul H. has been move out of intensive care into a rehab facility and will begin 
therapy Monday.

Paul S.

Hey, I have a 'safety' question about my MOTM rig.  I have a friend who
plays "Feedback Mixer."  That is, he takes a cheap behringer mixer, and
patches it into itself.  The array of sounds it produces is actually
quite amazing, with pseudo-hard sync and incredibly strange effects in
general.  Very interesting- but he wants to cross-patch into my
modular.  Seems like it's *probably* an OK idea- but I have NO idea what
voltage ranges this thing could be producing.  I could probably hook up
a meter to it in AC mode, but I'm not sure that would be accurate.

The question is, what modules, if any, would be at risk from this kind
of potentially grossly out-of-spec experimentation?

How does he do that? Does he use outboard effects on a send/return or 
is it just a mixer?

Genius idea, in any event.

On 17-Mar-06, at 8:02 PM, Geoff wrote:

> Hey, I have a 'safety' question about my MOTM rig.  I have a friend who
> plays "Feedback Mixer."  That is, he takes a cheap behringer mixer, and
> patches it into itself.  The array of sounds it produces is actually
> quite amazing, with pseudo-hard sync and incredibly strange effects in
> general.  Very interesting- but he wants to cross-patch into my
> modular.  Seems like it's *probably* an OK idea- but I have NO idea 
> what
> voltage ranges this thing could be producing.  I could probably hook up
> a meter to it in AC mode, but I'm not sure that would be accurate.
>
> The question is, what modules, if any, would be at risk from this kind
> of potentially grossly out-of-spec experimentation?
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
__________________________________________________
www.bodega-audio.com
Bodega/Bootleg Sounds. Fat East Coast. Distillery Mastering.

Just be sure you use MOTM inputs that have an attenuator on them. Then you are 
safe. Just start with the
pot levels at '5'.

Paul S.

----- Original Message ----- 

From: "Geoff" <overand@...>
To: "MOTM litserv" <motm@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, March 17, 2006 7:02 PM
Subject: Re: [motm] Quickie update


> Hey, I have a 'safety' question about my MOTM rig.  I have a friend who
> plays "Feedback Mixer."  That is, he takes a cheap behringer mixer, and
> patches it into itself.  The array of sounds it produces is actually
> quite amazing, with pseudo-hard sync and incredibly strange effects in
> general.  Very interesting- but he wants to cross-patch into my
> modular.  Seems like it's *probably* an OK idea- but I have NO idea what
> voltage ranges this thing could be producing.  I could probably hook up
> a meter to it in AC mode, but I'm not sure that would be accurate.
>
> The question is, what modules, if any, would be at risk from this kind
> of potentially grossly out-of-spec experimentation?
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

It's just a mixer.  It's really  profoundly strange thing, he patches
outputs of the mixer (mains, aux sends, etc) to inputs of the mixer
(channels, aux returns, etc), and applys different EQ, etc on the
channels.  It's a really ugly feedback loop, but the variety of sounds
he manages to produce is actually somewhat frustrating for me!  After he
played the thing for 20 minutes, he looked at me, and said "I can't
believe you spend ($X,XXX) on your modular!

Of course, his thing is unpredictable, and can't be 'played' like a
regular instrument, but for pure glorping, it's surprisingly good.  Go
figure!  I'll probably get some recordings up at some point, for those
of you who might be interested.

-Geoff

Matthew Hiscock wrote:

> How does he do that? Does he use outboard effects on a send/return or
> is it just a mixer?
>
> Genius idea, in any event.
>
> On 17-Mar-06, at 8:02 PM, Geoff wrote:
>
>     Hey, I have a 'safety' question about my MOTM rig. I have a friend
>     who
>     plays "Feedback Mixer." That is, he takes a cheap behringer mixer,
>     and
>     patches it into itself. The array of sounds it produces is actually
>     quite amazing, with pseudo-hard sync and incredibly strange
>     effects in
>     general. Very interesting- but he wants to cross-patch into my
>     modular. Seems like it's *probably* an OK idea- but I have NO idea
>     what
>     voltage ranges this thing could be producing. I could probably
>     hook up
>     a meter to it in AC mode, but I'm not sure that would be accurate.
>
>     The question is, what modules, if any, would be at risk from this
>     kind
>     of potentially grossly out-of-spec experimentation?
>
>

I use feedback in my modular all the time, usually done with a mult or
a mixer. The Evolver also makes clever use of feedback for very
strange and powerful sounds. Feedback is cool!

--- In motm@yahoogroups.com, Geoff <overand@...> wrote:
>
> It's just a mixer.  It's really  profoundly strange thing, he patches
> outputs of the mixer (mains, aux sends, etc) to inputs of the mixer
> (channels, aux returns, etc), and applys different EQ, etc on the
> channels.  It's a really ugly feedback loop, but the variety of sounds
> he manages to produce is actually somewhat frustrating for me!  After he
> played the thing for 20 minutes, he looked at me, and said "I can't
> believe you spend ($X,XXX) on your modular!
> 
> Of course, his thing is unpredictable, and can't be 'played' like a
> regular instrument, but for pure glorping, it's surprisingly good.  Go
> figure!  I'll probably get some recordings up at some point, for those
> of you who might be interested.
> 
> -Geoff
> 
> Matthew Hiscock wrote:
> 
> > How does he do that? Does he use outboard effects on a send/return or
> > is it just a mixer?
> >
> > Genius idea, in any event.
> >
> > On 17-Mar-06, at 8:02 PM, Geoff wrote:
> >
> >     Hey, I have a 'safety' question about my MOTM rig. I have a friend
> >     who
> >     plays "Feedback Mixer." That is, he takes a cheap behringer mixer,
> >     and
> >     patches it into itself. The array of sounds it produces is
actually

> >     quite amazing, with pseudo-hard sync and incredibly strange
> >     effects in
> >     general. Very interesting- but he wants to cross-patch into my
> >     modular. Seems like it's *probably* an OK idea- but I have NO idea
> >     what
> >     voltage ranges this thing could be producing. I could probably
> >     hook up
> >     a meter to it in AC mode, but I'm not sure that would be accurate.
> >
> >     The question is, what modules, if any, would be at risk from this
> >     kind
> >     of potentially grossly out-of-spec experimentation?
> >
> >
>

Geoff wrote:

> but the variety of sounds
> he manages to produce is actually somewhat frustrating for me!  

hmm - that can be solved  ;-)

> After he
> played the thing for 20 minutes, he looked at me, and said "I can't
> believe you spend ($X,XXX) on your modular!

that's just his POV. basically you should be able to sort of "rebuild" 
the stuff he patches on your modular (depending on the modules you 
have). AND (in a sense) that would be reproduceable. (but with some 
effort the stuff on the mixer as well)

> Of course, his thing is unpredictable, and can't be 'played' like a
> regular instrument, but for pure glorping, it's surprisingly good.  Go
> figure!  I'll probably get some recordings up at some point, for those
> of you who might be interested.

yes, indeed!  would be nice and interesting!

   ;-) Michael.

So, I'm listening to an excerpt from a recording I made a while ago
strictly on my MOTM rig, with no keyboard, just the UEG and the 320 LFO
as sources, plus the regular oscillators etc.

What's interesting is that there's a chunk where I'm turning a fine-tune
knob, and I actually 'play' the synth this way as it's doing a rythmic
LFO-trigger->ADSR->VCA (or VCF) thing.  I'm sure I'm not the first
person to have done this, I bet most of the other regulars here have
done this, but what amazed me is that I was able to actually do this.
I'd never done it before, and I usually landed right on the note,
turning the knob when the previous note had decayed away, pretty
quickly.  I'm not very adept at this at all, but I'd also never
practiced before.  I figured out how I was able to do it at all, though-

I may not have done 'play the note by turning the knob' thing a lot, but
I *have* been turning knobs to tune synths, and even moreso, I've been
playing with filters near the point of self-oscillation, hopping around
the harmonic series.  All of this knob-time actually gave me a sort of
limited ability to do this stuff, I think.

I have no real interest in advertising my 'music' on this list, but you
can hear what I'm talking about in the first chunk of:
http://overand.dissociative.net/Overand_-_Jam_2_Excerpt_2_Recursive_Delivery_(37-20).mp3

It's not a very good 'work' overall, it's just me farting around with no
plan, and a stereo delay, but it explains what I'm talking about.


I'm just curious if this is a common thing, that as you play your
modular more and more, you develop this odd knob-intuition?

Jonathan Snipes wrote:

> for no-input mixer stuff, listen to:
> 
> http://www.japanimprov.com/tnakamura/
> 
> he's the master.  this is a pretty common technique that lots of people 
> used in the noise/improv world.  but toshimaru nakamura's the best, imho.

I don't know many of them, I just got some sampler records with works of 
him and also Otomo Yoshihide.
There's also a german lady I like to listen to, Andrea Neumann. But she 
also plays "inside piano" which is basically a custom built piano frame 
where she connected several types of mics and pickups to. So these 
things mix up.

> the beautiful thing about feedback mixer patches is that in order to 
> recreate sounds, not only do you have to remember where you patched 
> things, but in what order you patched them, in what order you turned 
> which knobs, how quickly you turned knobs, etc.

We are talking about improvisation. So I (at least for my part) have the 
same "problem" (actually, due to the nature of the application, there is 
none) when improvising on my modular. To recreate a certain piece I do 
need some choreographie to get close to the original.

While I found Nakamura's works quite interesting I still like to know 
and hear what this particular gentleman's pieces do sound like, since 
here's some sort of competition between his mixer and Geoff's modular 
ongoing. ;-)

To me it's like comparing a cello to a trombone ...

    Michael.

(In fact Geoff could team up with his friend and jam together)

> 
> -jonathan
> 
> On Mar 17, 2006, at 11:01 PM, Michael Zacherl (aka TonTaub) wrote:
> 
>> Geoff wrote:
>>
>> > but the variety of sounds
>> > he manages to produce is actually somewhat frustrating for me! 
>>
>> hmm - that can be solved  ;-)
>>
>> > After he
>> > played the thing for 20 minutes, he looked at me, and said "I can't
>> > believe you spend ($X,XXX) on your modular!
>>
>> that's just his POV. basically you should be able to sort of "rebuild"
>> the stuff he patches on your modular (depending on the modules you
>> have). AND (in a sense) that would be reproduceable. (but with some
>> effort the stuff on the mixer as well)
>>
>> > Of course, his thing is unpredictable, and can't be 'played' like a
>> > regular instrument, but for pure glorping, it's surprisingly good.  Go
>> > figure!  I'll probably get some recordings up at some point, for those
>> > of you who might be interested.
>>
>> yes, indeed!  would be nice and interesting!
>>
>>    ;-) Michael.