MOTM

I think people who complain about today's prices forget how expensive it
was back in the 70's to buy this stuff  (forget about what I paid for my
first 122 Leslie).  Even the inflated prices of old Analog gear today are
not bad when you consider what they originally cost and adjust for
inflation.  To me, the projected price of the SynthTech vocoder does not
sound that high for what I know it will deliver.  It just "may" be more
than I personally can justify having tied up in one for a hobby as opposed
to professional use.  You didn't see too may garage bands in the 70s with
Arp 2500s or EMS vocoders.  So, I am thankful that today Paul is making
great analog stuff "I" can really afford.
Larry H

> From: Paul Schreiber <synth1@...>
> 
> Things run across whilst cleaning in the closets all day:
> 
> 1) 2ea original Oberheim stickers with the adhesive backing still intact!
> 
> 2) 1ea ARP 2500 brochure. Price of a typical system (1977) was $14,300.
> 
> 3) If you think $2500-2000 is alot for a vocoder, the EMS one (1977 price
> list) was $20,450!!
> 
> That's 6.85 new Corvettes!!
> 
> Paul S.

Labor. These were all hand built. The Sennheiser used hand-matched filter
sections.

Back then, it was almost impossible to get 1% caps except in a few values.
And, they were huge!

You didn't have op amps (or if you did, they didn't have high gain-bandwidth
product) so
the "actual" versus "theoretical" filter calulation would be 15%-25% off. I
vaguely remember
reading 1 Sennheiser vocoder took 1 technician like 3 weeks to tune up.

Paul S.

----- Original Message -----

From: "Nathan Hunsicker" <nate@...>
To: <motm@egroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, June 13, 2000 7:57 AM
Subject: Re: [motm] Tibits from the closet


> >3) If you think $2500-2000 is alot for a vocoder, the EMS one (1977 price
> >list) was $20,450!!
> >
> >That's 6.85 new Corvettes!!
> >
> >Paul S.
>
>
> What exactly make a vocoder so expensive? I mean $20,000+ in 1977, Even if
> all the components were made of gold, how could you justify a cost like
> that? The coveted Sennheiser was even more (I think). I can understand I
> high price (it includes filters, envelope followers and vca's for each
> band) but $20,000? Is that all in R&D? -Nate
>
>
>
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In a message dated 06/13/2000 12:28:22 AM, synth1@... writes:

<< 3) If you think $2500-2000 is alot for a vocoder, the EMS one (1977 price
list) was $20,450!! >>

You can buy a new EMS Vocoder 2000 for under $2000 USD.  Weren't the old 
Sennheiser vocoders way up there in price?  Was there a Bode one too?

Ivan

JH may correct, but I think the list price of the Sennheiser was $40,000!

They go for $11K - $14K on Vemia auction.

Paul S.

----- Original Message -----
From: <ivancu@...>
To: <motm@egroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, June 13, 2000 6:23 PM
Subject: Re: [motm] Tibits from the closet


>
> In a message dated 06/13/2000 12:28:22 AM, synth1@... writes:
>
> << 3) If you think $2500-2000 is alot for a vocoder, the EMS one (1977
price

> list) was $20,450!! >>
>
> You can buy a new EMS Vocoder 2000 for under $2000 USD.  Weren't the old
> Sennheiser vocoders way up there in price?  Was there a Bode one too?
>
> Ivan
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Big Groups = big savings @ beMANY!
> http://click.egroups.com/1/4112/5/_/529958/_/960938600/
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>

> You can buy a new EMS Vocoder 2000 for under $2000 USD.  Weren't the old
> Sennheiser vocoders way up there in price?  Was there a Bode one too?

The EMS 2000 is EMS' cheap, low-end model. It doesn't even have channel
attenuators, number of channels is 16, and filters are just 4-pole. (As far
as
I know.) I think it's in one league with the MAM / FAT vocoder.

The EMS 3000 is almost the same, but channel attenuators are added.
Now get a quote for this one ! (which is to stress what Paul pointed out
about the cost of front panel components)

The EMS vocoder with 22 channels is called EMS 5000. I did not
care to memorize the price for that one !

The Bode / Moog vocoder is another 16 channel / 4-pole filter design.
I have the schemos, and it's full of compromise. Not much to learn from
that one, honestly. (But don't tell Bob.)

If there is *one* reference to start with, then it's the Sennheiser, hands
down. It needs some additional features, and a way more production-
friendly design strategy, though.

JH.

In a message dated 00-06-13 19:27:25 EDT, you write:

<< You can buy a new EMS Vocoder 2000 >>


ivan,
the vocoder pricing quoted was for the big one designed to work along side 
the synthi 100. don`t know how many they sold but i know that the wdr radio 
stdio in germany where stockhausen does/ did a lot of his work had one of 
each.
best,
dave v.