MOTM

>anyone ?
>http://www.bigbriar.com/mfCP251.htm
>
>jim

When the Lag Processor and Mixer are done, there won't be any functions in
the CP251 that couldn't be done w/MOTM modules. Now, if it had a joystick
and a ribbon controller, I'd be interested!

____________________________________________
Dave Trenkel : improv@...
Minus Web Site: http://listen.to/minusmusic
Minus MP3's: http://www.mp3.com/-minus-
____________________________________________

In a message dated 8/9/00 3:04:24 PM, improv@... writes:

<< When the Lag Processor and Mixer are done, there won't be any functions in
the CP251 that couldn't be done w/MOTM modules. >>

I've contemplated getting one for a small live-performance rig, but I agree 
that in the "big rack" it won't add much to the party.

Ivan

Hey paul,
how far out is the Mixer module?
Jim

improv@... wrote:

> >anyone ?
> >http://www.bigbriar.com/mfCP251.htm
> >
> >jim
>
> When the Lag Processor and Mixer are done, there won't be any functions in
> the CP251 that couldn't be done w/MOTM modules. Now, if it had a joystick
> and a ribbon controller, I'd be interested!
>
> ____________________________________________
> Dave Trenkel : improv@...
> Minus Web Site: http://listen.to/minusmusic
> Minus MP3's: http://www.mp3.com/-minus-
> ____________________________________________
>
>

I would tack on a few switches.  I have no idea what I would do with them,
but just something that toggled the output from input A to input B.  Perhaps
more than one ribbon.

I think I would leave off the CV mixer and inverters... those sound like
wall territory.  Keep the attenuators, though.

But I still dream about that guitaresque controller.  And the guys who built
the lightwave pickup system made a press release announcing that they would
sell the pickups by themselves(!), optionally with a MIDI converter...  This
means that if anyone were rich enough, they wouldn't have to buy a full
guitar to play with the system as an alternative controller...

--PBr

> -----Original Message-----
> From:	improv@... [SMTP:improv@...]
> Sent:	Thursday, August 10, 2000 10:54 AM
> To:	motm@egroups.com
> Subject:	Re: [motm] How useful in a MOTM system might this be ?
> 
> >In a message dated 8/9/00 3:04:24 PM, improv@... writes:
> >
> ><< When the Lag Processor and Mixer are done, there won't be any
> functions in
> >the CP251 that couldn't be done w/MOTM modules. >>
> >
> >I've contemplated getting one for a small live-performance rig, but I
> agree
> >that in the "big rack" it won't add much to the party.
> >
> This brings up something I've been putting a fair amount of thought (but
> as
> yet, not much action) into: a modular controller surface. I'm thinking
> about a slant-faced cabinet about the size of a small MIDI keyboard. On
> the
> surface would be (and this is blue sky mode here, haven't been worried
> about reality yet) like, 4 joysticks, ~8 trigger buttons, a ribbon
> controller, a step sequencer, an input for a Yamaha breath controller, and
> maybe a few utility modules, like a CV mixer, inverters, attenuators, etc.
> Basically everything but a keyboard! My question to the geniuses of this
> list is, if you were building such a thing, what would you include? What
> would you leave out?
>

>In a message dated 8/9/00 3:04:24 PM, improv@... writes:
>
><< When the Lag Processor and Mixer are done, there won't be any functions in
>the CP251 that couldn't be done w/MOTM modules. >>
>
>I've contemplated getting one for a small live-performance rig, but I agree
>that in the "big rack" it won't add much to the party.
>
This brings up something I've been putting a fair amount of thought (but as
yet, not much action) into: a modular controller surface. I'm thinking
about a slant-faced cabinet about the size of a small MIDI keyboard. On the
surface would be (and this is blue sky mode here, haven't been worried
about reality yet) like, 4 joysticks, ~8 trigger buttons, a ribbon
controller, a step sequencer, an input for a Yamaha breath controller, and
maybe a few utility modules, like a CV mixer, inverters, attenuators, etc.
Basically everything but a keyboard! My question to the geniuses of this
list is, if you were building such a thing, what would you include? What
would you leave out?

____________________________________________
Dave Trenkel : improv@...
Minus Web Site: http://listen.to/minusmusic
Minus MP3's: http://www.mp3.com/-minus-
____________________________________________

> This brings up something I've been putting a fair amount of thought (but as
> yet, not much action) into: a modular controller surface. I'm thinking
> about a slant-faced cabinet about the size of a small MIDI keyboard. On the
> surface would be (and this is blue sky mode here, haven't been worried
> about reality yet) like, 4 joysticks, ~8 trigger buttons, a ribbon
> controller, a step sequencer, an input for a Yamaha breath controller, and
> maybe a few utility modules, like a CV mixer, inverters, attenuators, etc.
> Basically everything but a keyboard! My question to the geniuses of this
> list is, if you were building such a thing, what would you include? What
> would you leave out?
> 
All good ideas Dave.  You might look into something like the EML 300 for more ideas.
 One of the interesting elements was a bank of 16 knobs with 16 buttons.  You would
set voltages on the 16 knobs and select the active voltage with one of the buttons. 


You can also go nuts with the step sequencer stuff so might want to make that a
different box.

The one gesture piece that would be nice on such a box is a pressure sensitive X-Y
pad - like a Korg Kaos Pad or the rumored controller on the BigBriar monosynth.

    Eric


__________________________________________________
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Kick off your party with Yahoo! Invites.
http://invites.yahoo.com/

sounds a bit like the old Aries system doesnt it ?
Jim

alt-mode wrote:

> > This brings up something I've been putting a fair amount of thought (but as
> > yet, not much action) into: a modular controller surface. I'm thinking
> > about a slant-faced cabinet about the size of a small MIDI keyboard. On the
> > surface would be (and this is blue sky mode here, haven't been worried
> > about reality yet) like, 4 joysticks, ~8 trigger buttons, a ribbon
> > controller, a step sequencer, an input for a Yamaha breath controller, and
> > maybe a few utility modules, like a CV mixer, inverters, attenuators, etc.
> > Basically everything but a keyboard! My question to the geniuses of this
> > list is, if you were building such a thing, what would you include? What
> > would you leave out?
> >
> All good ideas Dave.  You might look into something like the EML 300 for more ideas.
>  One of the interesting elements was a bank of 16 knobs with 16 buttons.  You would
> set voltages on the 16 knobs and select the active voltage with one of the buttons.
>
> You can also go nuts with the step sequencer stuff so might want to make that a
> different box.
>
> The one gesture piece that would be nice on such a box is a pressure sensitive X-Y
> pad - like a Korg Kaos Pad or the rumored controller on the BigBriar monosynth.
>
>     Eric
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Kick off your party with Yahoo! Invites.
> http://invites.yahoo.com/
>
>

>sounds a bit like the old Aries system doesnt it ?
>Jim

I dunno, tell me more about the Aries.

____________________________________________
Dave Trenkel : improv@...
Minus Web Site: http://listen.to/minusmusic
Minus MP3's: http://www.mp3.com/-minus-
____________________________________________

only seen pix, see vinateg synth book by mark vail
Jim

improv@... wrote:

> >sounds a bit like the old Aries system doesnt it ?
> >Jim
>
> I dunno, tell me more about the Aries.
>
> ____________________________________________
> Dave Trenkel : improv@...
> Minus Web Site: http://listen.to/minusmusic
> Minus MP3's: http://www.mp3.com/-minus-
> ____________________________________________
>
>

This sounds like a great controller panel! I'd call it the Kitchen Sync. I'm 
not sure what you mean by a step sequencer (possibly no CV out, just the 
individual stages would become active?), but I'd somewhat advise against 
putting a row of pots quite close to a controller surface (like a ribbon, or 
a bunch of joysticks) since a slip of the hand could easily tweak one of 
those CV pots. This is especially true with the large MOTM style pots.

Are you thinking of a full length ribbon, or one of those mini ribbons (like 
those used for pitch benders)?

This might be a good project for those LMB Keyboarder style cabinets. Let us 
know how this develops!
JB



In a message dated 8/10/2000 10:46:50 AM, improv@... writes:

>I'm thinking
>about a slant-faced cabinet about the size of a small MIDI keyboard. On
>the
>surface would be (and this is blue sky mode here, haven't been worried
>about reality yet) like, 4 joysticks, ~8 trigger buttons, a ribbon
>controller, a step sequencer, an input for a Yamaha breath controller,
>and
>maybe a few utility modules, like a CV mixer, inverters, attenuators, etc.
>Basically everything but a keyboard! My question to the geniuses of this
>list is, if you were building such a thing, what would you include? What
>would you leave out?

In a message dated 8/10/2000 1:03:12 PM, alt_mode@... writes:

>The one gesture piece that would be nice on such a box is a pressure 
sensitive
>X-Y
>pad - like a Korg Kaos Pad or the rumored controller on the BigBriar 
monosynth.

Have there been controllers out there like this? I've seen this idea 
mentioned before (a bunch of times) but wondered how it could be implemented. 

JB

--- jwbarlow@... wrote:
> >pad - like a Korg Kaos Pad or the rumored controller on the BigBriar 
> monosynth.
> 
> Have there been controllers out there like this? I've seen this idea 
> mentioned before (a bunch of times) but wondered how it could be implemented. 
> 
Korg has done things in this vein.  I don't know if the Kaos Pad is pressure
sensitive but it outputs MIDI data for X-Y position.  I believe the Korg Z-1 also
has an X-Y pad, again I don't know about pressure sensitivity.  The Kurzweil K2500
has a big ribbon above the keyboard and a small pressure-sensitive ribbon below the
wheels on the left.  Dig through the AH archives and perhaps even the MOTM archives.
 I think the manufacturer of the pad that is allegedly going to be used on the
BigBriar monosynth is listed there.

Eric


__________________________________________________
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Kick off your party with Yahoo! Invites.
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Take a look at the press release here -http://www.tactex.com/bigbriar.html

Dave


At 06:52 PM 8/10/00 -0700, you wrote:

>Korg has done things in this vein.  I don't know if the Kaos Pad is pressure
>sensitive but it outputs MIDI data for X-Y position.  I believe the Korg 
>Z-1 also
>has an X-Y pad, again I don't know about pressure sensitivity.  The 
>Kurzweil K2500
>has a big ribbon above the keyboard and a small pressure-sensitive ribbon 
>below the
>wheels on the left.  Dig through the AH archives and perhaps even the MOTM 
>archives.
>  I think the manufacturer of the pad that is allegedly going to be used 
> on the
>BigBriar monosynth is listed there

In a message dated 00-08-10 13:46:53 EDT, you write:

<<  4 joysticks, ~8 trigger buttons, a ribbon
 controller, a step sequencer, an input for a Yamaha breath controller, and
 maybe a few utility modules, like a CV mixer, inverters, attenuators, etc.
 Basically everything but a keyboard! >>



dave,
were i doing it, i`d leave out the sequencer for simplicity sake ( and there 
are other folks who make sequencers, so why re-invent the wheel. ). plus, i`m 
not familiar with the sources of stuff to make a ribbon controller - can it 
be done in a cost effective yet reliable format ? certainly, the joysticks 
and buttons seem simple enough. likewise a few "utility" things ( don`t 
forget a variable bias supply - either  0 - 5 vdc or -5 - +5 vdc and a couple 
of spst type switches for long term gate type signals as opposed to just 
being available from momentary contact buttons ). i would imagine that a 
simple breath controller could be rigged up from a microphone element and an 
envelope follower - ?
let us know how the idea works out !
best,
dave v.

In a message dated 8/10/2000 7:17:56 PM, davevosh@... writes:

>i would imagine that a 
>simple breath controller could be rigged up from a microphone element and
>an 
>envelope follower - ?

Is this true? When I was a kid we used to check the phase of our 4 X 12 
cabinets by BRIEFLY putting a 9V battery across the tip and shield of our 
speaker cables, so maybe the inverse is true.

JB

>This sounds like a great controller panel! I'd call it the Kitchen Sync.

Hehehe

>I'm
>not sure what you mean by a step sequencer (possibly no CV out, just the
>individual stages would become active?), but I'd somewhat advise against
>putting a row of pots quite close to a controller surface (like a ribbon, or
>a bunch of joysticks) since a slip of the hand could easily tweak one of
>those CV pots. This is especially true with the large MOTM style pots.

That is a thought. One of my first ideas was to mount an MAQ 16/3 in an SKB
pop-up, then fill the other 8 spaces with other controllers. I use the MAQ
as my main controller for the modular, so one use I could envision for the
Kitchen Sync is having a handful of sequences running while I control
other parameters in realtime. I'm also eyeing the sequencer section of the
FR 777 with interest as well...
>
>Are you thinking of a full length ribbon, or one of those mini ribbons (like
>those used for pitch benders)?

I was envisioning a full length ribbon, kind of where the keyboard would be
on a normal controller, maybe with evenly-spaced trigger buttons along the
top of the ribbon. Then, on the left side of surface, a few joysticks. I
should really start sketching some of this out. About the only kind of
controller I DON'T want in this box is a keyboard!
>
>This might be a good project for those LMB Keyboarder style cabinets. Let us
>know how this develops!

Yeah, the LMB box looks pretty ideal.

____________________________________________
Dave Trenkel : improv@...
Minus Web Site: http://listen.to/minusmusic
Minus MP3's: http://www.mp3.com/-minus-
____________________________________________

>Take a look at the press release here -http://www.tactex.com/bigbriar.html
>
>Dave

Yeah, looks cool, but $495 seems a bit steep. I'd hope to make the complete
controller for (a lot) less than that!

____________________________________________
Dave Trenkel : improv@...
Minus Web Site: http://listen.to/minusmusic
Minus MP3's: http://www.mp3.com/-minus-
____________________________________________

>In a message dated 00-08-10 13:46:53 EDT, you write:
>
><<  4 joysticks, ~8 trigger buttons, a ribbon
> controller, a step sequencer, an input for a Yamaha breath controller, and
> maybe a few utility modules, like a CV mixer, inverters, attenuators, etc.
> Basically everything but a keyboard! >>
>
>
>
>dave,
>were i doing it, i`d leave out the sequencer for simplicity sake ( and there
>are other folks who make sequencers, so why re-invent the wheel. ). plus, i`m
>not familiar with the sources of stuff to make a ribbon controller - can it
>be done in a cost effective yet reliable format ? certainly, the joysticks
>and buttons seem simple enough. likewise a few "utility" things ( don`t
>forget a variable bias supply - either  0 - 5 vdc or -5 - +5 vdc and a couple
>of spst type switches for long term gate type signals as opposed to just
>being available from momentary contact buttons ). i would imagine that a
>simple breath controller could be rigged up from a microphone element and an
>envelope follower - ?
>let us know how the idea works out !
>best,
>dave v.

Actually, I don't have a clue as yet as to how to build the ribbon
controller! I was kind of wondering if the controller component of the
Kurzwiel box could be purchased seperately, and hacked to put out CV's. I'd
definitely like to build in an interface for the Yamaha BC series breath
controller, it's among my fave controllers (besides, you can't help but
look dorky using one!). Like the idea of spst switches for long gates!

____________________________________________
Dave Trenkel : improv@...
Minus Web Site: http://listen.to/minusmusic
Minus MP3's: http://www.mp3.com/-minus-
____________________________________________

In a message dated 00-08-11 03:03:14 EDT, you write:

<< Actually, I don't have a clue as yet as to how to build the ribbon
 controller! I was kind of wondering if the controller component of the
 Kurzwiel box could be purchased seperately, and hacked to put out CV's >>



dave,
i`ve seen conductive foam and recording tape both suggested as ribbon 
controller elements before in various diy places. i gather that both will 
work but are not without their own problems. just something you`d have to try 
out and see what works for you. i haven`t got a clue as to whether the 
kurzweil ribbon is available separately. i would think that as an inherently 
"analog" interface that you could get one to do c.v. output as easily as 
rigging it for midi output. don`t know anything about its reported glissando 
problem, either.
glad you liked the idea of the spst switches !
best,
dave v.