MOTM

The picture at the link below shows what I found in a hoppy shop in the mall. 
 It is made of balsa wood and fits the MOTM modules exactly.  It would be 
ideal if something like this could be found made of white plastic so it 
doesn't have to be painted and would be more durable.  Although for those 
people with light wood color cases, just the unfinished look would match 
well.  Also included is a shot of my final MOTM cases, 12U wide (like the 
blue one) but 3 modules high (angled bottom row) for those of you who wanted 
case building documented.  Later on I'll post some tips about applying tolex 
that I figured out which help reduce the risk of making mistakes.

http://members.aol.com/elhardt/images/construction1.jpg

-----Original Message-----
From: elhardt@... [mailto:elhardt@...]
Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2001 7:50 PM
To: motm@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [motm] Module separators, another alternative

The picture at the link below shows what I found in a hoppy shop in the mall.
It is made of balsa wood and fits the MOTM modules exactly.

That's a bunny place to find balsa wood

Al (just couldn't resist)

jlarryh@... writes:

>>I actually found some metal ones that are just U channel that fit perfect 
also.  However, they had two problems.  One of those problems is probably 
shared by these.
 
1 - shared problem.  The material between the modules is too thick and the
modules will no longer fit a standard rail
2 - Unique problem to the metal - even at only 1/8 inch wide, they covered
some screen that is close to the edge on 1Us.<<

Since I don't have metal rails to try it with I can't say for sure, but I 
believe this doesn't share the same problem.  The wood is very thin, only 
about 1/32" thick on the part that separates the modules.  So if you have 
less than a 1/32" gap between modules, then you are out of luck.

You're right, the wood doesn't have the 2nd problem.  The total width of the 
separator is 3/16", which is just perfect and doesn't cover any silkscreen.

But here is a possible problem.  What happens if I want to pull out a module 
that is not on the end of a row of modules?  I don't know, because this 
particular I-beam shape kind of locks the modules together.  So I may just 
have to remove modules from the edge of the case up to the module I want to 
remove if I need to do that.  Or I was thinking perhaps cutting off a leg to 
make it a J-beam shape might help.  Or if there is enough friction, just a 
T-beam shape that could just be pushed inbetween the modules.  I'm starting 
to wonder if there's a plastic store around here.  If so, I might be able to 
make my own.  It might require some delicate Dremel work though.

-Elhardt

I actually found some metal ones that are just U channel that fit perfect
also.  However, they had two problems.  One of those problems is probably
shared by these.

1 - shared problem.  The material between the modules is too thick and the
modules will no longer fit a standard rail
2 - Unique problem to the metal - even at only 1/8 inch wide, they covered
some screen that is close to the edge on 1Us.

Larry H

----- Original Message -----
From: <elhardt@...>
To: <motm@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2001 6:49 PM
Subject: [motm] Module separators, another alternative


The picture at the link below shows what I found in a hoppy shop in the
mall.
 It is made of balsa wood and fits the MOTM modules exactly.  It would be
ideal if something like this could be found made of white plastic so it
doesn't have to be painted and would be more durable.  Although for those
people with light wood color cases, just the unfinished look would match
well.  Also included is a shot of my final MOTM cases, 12U wide (like the
blue one) but 3 modules high (angled bottom row) for those of you who wanted
case building documented.  Later on I'll post some tips about applying tolex
that I figured out which help reduce the risk of making mistakes.

http://members.aol.com/elhardt/images/construction1.jpg

>The picture at the link below shows what I found in a hoppy shop in the mall.
> It is made of balsa wood and fits the MOTM modules exactly.

Is this balsa or spruce? (both are common in model airplanes). Balsa this
thin would be REALLY soft.

>It would be
>ideal if something like this could be found made of white plastic so it
>doesn't have to be painted and would be more durable.

What you want here is Sentra. It's high-density PVC foam. Looks like a
cross between acrylic (only softer and much easier to work) and foam core
board (much stronger and more flexible, and can be bent with heat). They
make it with both matt and gloss finishes, and a variety of colors,
including black.


-- 
Terry Bowman, KA4HJH
"The Mac Doctor"

droscar@... writes:

>>Is this balsa or spruce? (both are common in model airplanes). Balsa this 
thin would be REALLY soft.<<

From all my childhood experience with balsa, it sure seems like it.  It's 
light as a feather and can bend and flex quite a bit.  If spruce fills those 
specs then it could be spruce.  The package doesn't say.

>>What you want here is Sentra. It's high-density PVC foam. Looks like a
cross between acrylic (only softer and much easier to work) and foam core
board (much stronger and more flexible, and can be bent with heat). They
make it with both matt and gloss finishes, and a variety of colors,
including black.<<

If that's the big poster size stuff I also saw in the hobby/art store, then I 
might know what you mean.  Maybe I'll have to take another look, but the foam 
center looked like it would compress and stay that way if squeezed.  And it 
didn't look like something that could be cut down to about 1/32" thinkness.  
Though I did also buy a white adhesive vinyl sheet with a slightly shiney 
finish that I can cut to any size and stick it on the modules like the 
drafting tape some people use.  But black is not the color I want as that 
defeats the purpose of visual module separation.

-Elhardt

The metal I got was 0.014" thick.  Of course, being "U" shaped, 2 pieces
would be required once toward each module.  While that does not have the
"module removal and installation" problem, it was still too thick.  2x0.014
= 0.028
1/32 = 0.031  So, 1/32 inch still seems too thick.

If anyone cares to look at the metal, I have some photos (it is brass). Or
you can go look at:
http://www.modeltool.com/kands/kandsindex.html

Paul can tell us the exact amount he specs off of the panels to allow for
slop of fit.  But, anything you stick in there gets rid of the slop and the
machine shop tolerances are going to eat into that slop (along with paint)
often.  That's why there is slop.  But from what I see something  is going
to have to be in the 0.015 range to work.

I think that rules out wood.  I think ONE of these metal U channels will fit
OK, but of course, that does not supply the desired look and it is too wide
on the front - 0.111 inch overhang.  Certainly plastic does sound like a
possible alternative to metal.  A piece of this thickness of brass or
plastic shaped and sized like the wood Ken found would be juts right.  Now,
where is it?

Larry H

----- Original Message -----
From: <elhardt@...>
Since I don't have metal rails to try it with I can't say
for sure, but I believe this doesn't share the same problem.
The wood is very thin, only about 1/32" thick on the part
that separates the modules.  So if you have less than a
1/32" gap between modules, then you are out of luck.

>>>Is this balsa or spruce? (both are common in model airplanes). Balsa this
>thin would be REALLY soft.<<
>
>From all my childhood experience with balsa, it sure seems like it.  It's
>light as a feather and can bend and flex quite a bit.  If spruce fills those
>specs then it could be spruce.  The package doesn't say.

Sounds like it must be balsa. Balsa comes in variety of densities--maybe
this is some of the heavier stuff. The really light stuff you could never
do this with. If it were spruce if would feel more like a typical softwood,
like pine.


>>>What you want here is Sentra. It's high-density PVC foam. Looks like a
>cross between acrylic (only softer and much easier to work) and foam core
>board (much stronger and more flexible, and can be bent with heat). They
>make it with both matt and gloss finishes, and a variety of colors,
>including black.<<
>
>If that's the big poster size stuff I also saw in the hobby/art store, then I
>might know what you mean.  Maybe I'll have to take another look, but the foam
>center looked like it would compress and stay that way if squeezed.  And it
>didn't look like something that could be cut down to about 1/32" thinkness.

That's foam-core board. I don't think that would work, either. Sentra is
available from sign shops and plastics suppliers, like acrylic. You can't
really tell that it's expanded (doesn't look foamy), except that it lighter
and more flexible than acrylic.

If you can get balsa to do this Sentra would probably work great.


>Though I did also buy a white adhesive vinyl sheet with a slightly shiney
>finish that I can cut to any size and stick it on the modules like the
>drafting tape some people use.  But black is not the color I want as that
>defeats the purpose of visual module separation.

I didn't realize you wanted it to stand out. They make it in white, beige,
red, green, etc.

-- 
Terry Bowman, KA4HJH
"The Mac Doctor"

In a message dated 2/4/01 10:13:46 AM Central Standard Time, 
jlarryh@... writes:

> The metal I got was 0.014" thick.  Of course, being "U" shaped, 2 pieces
>  would be required once toward each module.  While that does not have the
>  "module removal and installation" problem, it was still too thick.  2x0.014
>  = 0.028
>  1/32 = 0.031  So, 1/32 inch still seems too thick.
>  
>  If anyone cares to look at the metal, I have some photos (it is brass). Or
>  you can go look at:
>  http://www.modeltool.com/kands/kandsindex.html
>  
>  Paul can tell us the exact amount he specs off of the panels to allow for
>  slop of fit.  But, anything you stick in there gets rid of the slop and the
>  machine shop tolerances are going to eat into that slop (along with paint)
>  often.  That's why there is slop.  But from what I see something  is going
>  to have to be in the 0.015 range to work.
>  
>  I think that rules out wood.  I think ONE of these metal U channels will 
fit
>  OK, but of course, that does not supply the desired look and it is too wide
>  on the front - 0.111 inch overhang.  Certainly plastic does sound like a
>  possible alternative to metal.  A piece of this thickness of brass or
>  plastic shaped and sized like the wood Ken found would be juts right.  Now,
>  where is it?

 Welp,
 There's always this stuff that I wrote about awhile back:

http://www.piko.de/e/plastruct/s-plastruct.htm

 There's lots of various shapes and sizes. Experimenting with this stuff in 
my 19" rack brought up the same problems/concerns as have been mentioned... 
Using the "H" columns tends to lock adjacent modules together, the slop in 
between the modules is consumed, etc...

 Very soon I'll be going to check out some wood places to figure out what 
type of wood to use for my cabinet. I'm starting the think this Plastruct 
stuff may be just the ticket after all, as long as I use wood screws to 
secure the modules in the case. This will allow the modules to be correctly 
spaced for the Plastruct dividers.

 Andrew Sanchez

In a message dated 2/4/01 4:06:02 PM Central Standard Time, 
jlarryh@... writes:

>  Welp,
>   There's always this stuff that I wrote about awhile back:
>  
>  http://www.piko.de/e/plastruct/s-plastruct.htm
>  
>  I had completely forgotten about this stuff.  Thanks for bringing it up
>  again Andrew.
>  Larry H
>  

 If ya'd like, I can send you some samples of the various sizes/shapes that I 
have. Just let me know!

 Andrew

----- Original Message -----

From: <ixqy@...>

 Welp,
 There's always this stuff that I wrote about awhile back:

http://www.piko.de/e/plastruct/s-plastruct.htm

I had completely forgotten about this stuff.  Thanks for bringing it up
again Andrew.
Larry H