Wiardgroup

hi all

I have 2 doepfer joysticks that are banana jacked I can control 12
VC's.Is this basically what the JAG does or am I missing something?

On Feb 12, 2007, at 2:52 AM, cray5656 wrote:

> hi all
>
> I have 2 doepfer joysticks that are banana jacked I can control 12
> VC's.Is this basically what the JAG does or am I missing something?

A joystick only gives you 2 cv outs, X and Y where all of the parameters
you are multing get the same controls.  The jag axis converter turns the
X/Y joystick input into 10 different cv outs.  With this you can do  
things
like quad and up to 10 channel surround panning or controlling up to
10 parameters in a synth.

bryan

Hi cray

--- In wiardgroup@yahoogroups.com, "cray5656" <amni56@...> wrote:
>
> hi all
> 
> I have 2 doepfer joysticks that are banana jacked I can control 12
> VC's.Is this basically what the JAG does or am I missing something?
>
(BTW i assumed you are referring to Dieter's A-174 joysticks)

well yes,
you're missing something. But don't feel bad, because (unfortunately
for Grant's sales) the JAG's functions are not easy to describe in
text and the poor JAG is prone to being misunderstood.
(and there is also good reason to doubt that those misunderstandings 
will be much remedied by THIS reply... but i'll try....)

First off the best and easiest way to comprehend the JAG is in a demo.
This is one module wherein the visual feedback from the panel LED's
are the best way to comprehend the functions. If you know someone with
a JAG... i urge you to go borrow some time with it. (that will be LOTs
more fun than reading this anyway!) 

The first, important distinction, is that the JAG is NOT a joystick.
It's a  processor. (it can even process audio, but for sake of clarity
i'm not even going there) 
The X & Y jacks are INPUTs, They can certainly be connected to your
A-174's but they can just as easily accept a couple of LFO's or Envelopes.

The JAG turns the TWO vectors of control at the X & Y inputs into ten
INDEPENDENT output vectors , at each LED (and the two 'invisible
vectors of "dome" and "edge")
by comparison 
A conventional Joystick (like the A-174) outputs only two INDEPENDENT
vectors per module (x & y). You can mult the outputs of the A-174 (to
the limit of the joystick's available drive current) but that doesn't
multiply the number of INDEPENDENT vectors available

Those are some of the essential differences. That key word i keep
capitalizing is Independent vectors of control; the ability to move
one CV up- while moving another down - while holding three other CVs
steady- and creating a 'bump' in yet another CV.... ALL WITH ONE
MOTION! Combined with a joystick, i find the JAG can output an array
of CV's that allow me to rival the level of control over an analog
synth that one can exert over an acoustic instrument. Used a different
way the JAG outputs enough control to allow you to 'conduct' complex
'ensembles' of  multiple voices. 
to compare again...
with 2 joysticks you have independent mix control over 4 voices (via
VCA's)
with 2 JAGs you would have independent mix control over 20 voices
(likewise via VCA's)

best,
-doc

> The JAG turns the TWO vectors of control at the X & Y inputs into ten
> INDEPENDENT output vectors , at each LED (and the two 'invisible
> vectors of "dome" and "edge")

The "Dome" function indicator is the Yellow LED in the middle. The "Edge" function is the 
inverse of dome (more or less).

BTW, the color mapping of the LEDs is inspired by one of the Chinese color mapping of the 
"Ba-Gua" or eight sided figure showing the eight possible outcomes of the three "I-Ching" 
coins.

Blue was substituted for black (North).

When I mentioned Feng Shui to my fellow engineer Chunning Sang, he replied "Next you'll 
be telling me you've seen a UFO, only my grandparents believe in that stuff!"

Both Western and Eastern Geomancy are fascinating topics however. It is amazing how 
much the human belief system has changed over a short time. For example, earlier 
humans believed that evil traveled in straight lines, and avoided straight lines in art and 
even fences. This is why much early art contains great complexity (such as celtic knots). It 
was believed that these highly tangeld lines would prevent the entrance of evil.

The idea was so universal that there is a specific word for it, "apotropaic" meaning 
"intended to ward off evil or bad influences".

Rest assured, all Wiard product produce waveforms of apotropaic complexity, and can only 
be good for you!

I am only kidding around, so don't send the guys from the Funny Farm.

> Rest assured, all Wiard product produce waveforms of
> apotropaic complexity, and can only 
> be good for you!
> 
> I am only kidding around, so don't send the guys
> from the Funny Farm.

Don't worry, not calling anyone, and I leave the
Wogglebug free running at all times to keep the house
safe!
Hmm...Wonder if Wiard could have a future as defense
contractor, 
maybe outfit the First Earth Battalion?


 
____________________________________________________________________________________
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Hi Professor
--- In wiardgroup@yahoogroups.com, "Grant Richter" <grichter@...> wrote:

> The "Dome" function indicator is the Yellow LED in the middle. The
"Edge" function is the 
> inverse of dome (more or less).
>

my apologies...the center yellow LED slipped my memory...
i stand corrected 

> It was believed that these highly tangeld lines would prevent the
entrance of evil.
> 
> The idea was so universal that there is a specific word for it,
"apotropaic" meaning 
> "intended to ward off evil or bad influences".
>
aha!!!!
the very reason i use apotropaic wiring layouts in all my DIY projects!
;'>
When i was researching a paper on neural nets i had to digest a lot of
work done in biology & neurology. i found and cited a study that
investigated the evolution of nerve bundles. The experiments compared
the performance of tangles of nerve fibers to the performance of the
fibers when they were 'straightened out' (laid parallel).... and the
tangles always performed better (faster and more accurately) Some of
the cause was shown to be 'crosstalk' but even when they took steps to
eliminate the crosstalk the tangles STILL performed better. 


> 
> I am only kidding around, so don't send the guys from the Funny Farm.
>

you're totally safe Professor, There's no way the ambulance driver
would accept payment in the form of unsold JAGs


(take heart! spring is comin'!)

-doc

I would love to demo the JAG or any Wiard stuff but here in Australia 
its very hard, I have only seen a Wiard Joystick in real life.

>
>

Is there any normalising in any of the following, as I would like to mod 
them to banana jacks

JAG
JOYSTICK
NOISE RING
WOGGLE BUG

ross

Hi ross
--- In wiardgroup@yahoogroups.com, amnesia <amni56@...> wrote:
>
> Is there any normalising in any of the following, as I would like to
mod 
> them to banana jacks
> 
> JAG
> JOYSTICK
> NOISE RING
> WOGGLE BUG
> 

Prof. Richter is pretty good about posting the block diagrams on the
official Wiard site. He uses a 3-terminal symbol for jacks. If the
middle terminal is connected, then the jack is normalized. 
Based on this, and a quick and decidedly cursory, glance at the block
diagrams, the JAG and JOYSTICK are not norm'd and the NOISE RING and
WOGGLEBUG are norm'd. 

best,
-doc

i only know of a normalized connection on the noise ring.
the lower output is normalled to the ext rate input.

best wishes

ingo


--- amnesia <amni56@tpg.com.au> schrieb:

> Is there any normalising in any of the following, as I would like to
> mod 
> them to banana jacks
> 
> JAG
> JOYSTICK
> NOISE RING
> WOGGLE BUG
> 
> ross
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 
> 


http://www.dron.de
http://www.selfoscillate.de
http://www.signalform.de


		
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