AVR-Chat

I prefer top posting as it saves me scrolling down past numerous previous messages.

----- Original Message ----
From: dlc <dlc@frii.com>
To: AVR-Chat@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, 23 March, 2008 9:00:28 PM
Subject: Re: [AVR-Chat] C programming on AVR

In general I find that those that tirade against top posters can't 
spell and smell of elderberry wine.

DLC

David Kelly wrote:
> On Mar 23, 2008, at 1:27 AM, dlc wrote:
> 
>> Don't worry about it. To live on the 'net you need to grown thicker
>> skin. There is _always_ someone who wants to instruct us all not to
>> top-post. Like the teachers who taught us english speakers that we 
>> must
>> NEVER split an infinitive (which we can very easily do [and I just
>> did]), they are simply attached to a habit that does not always make
>> sense. Top post all you want - I myself get tired of wading through
>> increasingly difficult to deal with >>> to get to the answer somewhere
>> near the bottom of a 20 page thread... This isn't USENET me' lads.
> 
> 
> Don't forget that when asking questions one is asking for the favor of 
> a reply. If you can't speak the language, ask intelligent questions, 
> and obey the forms, then don't expect a reply.
> 
> Top posting is bad. Failure to trim is equally bad. There is no excuse 
> for 20 pages of quoted crap. In general top-posters are responsible 
> for most cases of 20 pages of quoted crap.
> 
> Fun thing to do to yank top-poster's chains: reply in top-post format 
> but change the contents of the quoted section. Then cite that quoted 
> sections a couple of generations later. Top-posters who fail to trim 
> never read the entire message they send.
> 
> --
> David Kelly N4HHE, dkelly@HiWAAY. net
> ============ ========= ========= ========= ========= ========= ========= ======
> Whom computers would destroy, they must first drive mad.
> 
> 
> ------------ --------- --------- ------
> 
> Yahoo! Groups Links
> 
> 
> 

You can post way down here and see if the in-line posters will see it.

-- 
------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- -
Dennis Clark TTT Enterprises
www.techtoystoday. com
------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- -

 


      ___________________________________________________________ 
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In AVR-Chat@yahoogroups.com, np np <harrabylad@...> wrote:

> I prefer top posting as it
> saves me scrolling down past
> numerous previous messages.

OK, but I'm sure you understand that we're a community here and that 
your preferences aren't the only ones that count.  (If we're not a 
community, why are we doing this?)  Personally, I'm surprised that top 
posting is the main issue rather than failure to trim the chain of 
messages leading up to the post and changing the topic without changing 
the subject line.  My (personal) ideal post has an accurate subject 
line, a brief record of what was previously said on the subject and by 
whom and then the new content.  Previous and new content would be 
repeated in turn as needed.  Sure, this might increase the effort you 
need to put into the post from one unit to three units.  But if it 
decreases the effort of only ten readers from one unit to half a unit, 
we're ahead and we get more done as a group.

Graham.

On Mon, Mar 24, 2008 at 09:16:56AM +0000, np np wrote:
> I prefer top posting as it saves me scrolling down past numerous  
> previous messages.

1 line of new content for 68 lines of quoted bulk. You sure are saving  
*yourself* a lot of time. "68dd" trimmed the non-Yahoo! bulk in vim  
under mutt.

As Graham says, its not really an issue if top-posters bothered to  
trim. In my opinion most don't trim because they don't read what they  
are re-sending. As np np says, he can't be bothered to scroll to the  
end of a message, apparently not even his own.

np np, I don't bother to scroll to the end of a message. If I open the  
message at all if it doesn't get to interesting new content within my  
window size then its deleted. Top posting is wrong. Bottom posting is  
also wrong. If new content doesn't start quickly then the poster  
failed the courtesy requirement by failing to trim. If its top-posted  
its very unlikely I will reply no matter I might have the solution or  
something else useful, once again for failing the courtesy  
requirement, by speaking out of order.

On other lists I've seen text messages routinely bloat to over 250k  
bytes of untrimmed bulk when top-posters-without-trim run unthrottled.  
Bloats even faster when "rich text" is allowed.

Bandwidth and disk space is cheap these days, but all that bulk  
renders searching list archives practically useless.

-- 
David Kelly N4HHE, dkelly@HiWAAY.net
========================================================================
Whom computers would destroy, they must first drive mad.

So, is it also discourteous to post 50 or 60 lines of code asking the 
list members to look through it for the errors rather than running it 
through the (free) simulator?

How about off topic discussions from which others also gain information 
for future reference?

How about...

It seems we're expending an awful lot of time, disk space, and bandwidth 
over something as nit picky as whether to top or bottom post responses 
to a message.  Let's just get back to writing code and designing 
circuits...for those of us with nothing better to do than work.


REB



David Kelly wrote:
> On Mon, Mar 24, 2008 at 09:16:56AM +0000, np np wrote:
>   
>> I prefer top posting as it saves me scrolling down past numerous  
>> previous messages.
>>     
>
> 1 line of new content for 68 lines of quoted bulk. You sure are saving  
> *yourself* a lot of time. "68dd" trimmed the non-Yahoo! bulk in vim  
> under mutt.
>
> As Graham says, its not really an issue if top-posters bothered to  
> trim. In my opinion most don't trim because they don't read what they  
> are re-sending. As np np says, he can't be bothered to scroll to the  
> end of a message, apparently not even his own.
>
> np np, I don't bother to scroll to the end of a message. If I open the  
> message at all if it doesn't get to interesting new content within my  
> window size then its deleted. Top posting is wrong. Bottom posting is  
> also wrong. If new content doesn't start quickly then the poster  
> failed the courtesy requirement by failing to trim. If its top-posted  
> its very unlikely I will reply no matter I might have the solution or  
> something else useful, once again for failing the courtesy  
> requirement, by speaking out of order.
>
> On other lists I've seen text messages routinely bloat to over 250k  
> bytes of untrimmed bulk when top-posters-without-trim run unthrottled.  
> Bloats even faster when "rich text" is allowed.
>
> Bandwidth and disk space is cheap these days, but all that bulk  
> renders searching list archives practically useless.
>
>   


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On Mar 24, 2008, at 9:59 PM, Roy E. Burrage wrote:

[...]

> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Fix your email client, it is sending Rich Text to a text-only list.

Its also failing to trim.

--
David Kelly N4HHE, dkelly@HiWAAY.net
========================================================================
Whom computers would destroy, they must first drive mad.

You might want to check yours David.  So far as I know this list is set 
to accept text only in the settings.

It's interesting that you're the only one to complain since before Dave 
VanHorn hosted this list on his server, and was an e-groups list before 
that.

Kwitcherbellyakin and let's get back to work.


REB



David Kelly wrote:
> On Mar 24, 2008, at 9:59 PM, Roy E. Burrage wrote:
>
> [...]
>
>   
>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>     
>
> Fix your email client, it is sending Rich Text to a text-only list.
>
> Its also failing to trim.
>
> --
> David Kelly N4HHE, dkelly@HiWAAY.net
> ========================================================================
> Whom computers would destroy, they must first drive mad.
>
>
>   


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On Tue, Mar 25, 2008 at 08:44:24AM -0400, Roy E. Burrage wrote:
> You might want to check yours David.  So far as I know this list is
> set to accept text only in the settings.

Yes, this list will only *send* plain text but if one sends RTF the RTF
(and any other attachment) is stripped and the following footer is
appended by Yahoo!:

> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> It's interesting that you're the only one to complain since before
> Dave VanHorn hosted this list on his server, and was an e-groups list
> before that.

I'm not complaining, altho you are complaining about being criticized.
I'm helping the ignorant who are willing to learn how to communicate
better. If no one says these things then bad habits such as yours become
ingrained and hard to break. Just like smoking.

Those who are not willing to learn are not worth helping.

-- 
David Kelly N4HHE, dkelly@HiWAAY.net
========================================================================
Whom computers would destroy, they must first drive mad.

Marlboro light 100s, soft pack.  Next time you're in Chattaboogie drop 
off a couple of cartons, would you please?  I believe they're less 
expensive down there in Huntsville these days.  I'm in the book.

If you aren't complaining, why not just leave it alone David.  We can't 
all be as perfect as others, and we all have preferences that may not 
fit the wants and desires of those who are perfect.  There are lists of 
pros and cons for that can be generated for anything people wish to do.

Is your delete key broken?


REB


David Kelly wrote:
> On Tue, Mar 25, 2008 at 08:44:24AM -0400, Roy E. Burrage wrote:
>   
>> You might want to check yours David.  So far as I know this list is
>> set to accept text only in the settings.
>>     
>
> Yes, this list will only *send* plain text but if one sends RTF the RTF
> (and any other attachment) is stripped and the following footer is
> appended by Yahoo!:
>
>   
>>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>>>         
>
>   
>> It's interesting that you're the only one to complain since before
>> Dave VanHorn hosted this list on his server, and was an e-groups list
>> before that.
>>     
>
> I'm not complaining, altho you are complaining about being criticized.
> I'm helping the ignorant who are willing to learn how to communicate
> better. If no one says these things then bad habits such as yours become
> ingrained and hard to break. Just like smoking.
>
> Those who are not willing to learn are not worth helping.
>
>   


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]